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- Thread starter MD Buckeye
- Start date
BuckeyeMafia
A Leaf on the Wind
I just want to see Ohio State out-coach MSU. The last time Ohio State out-coached a superior or equal team may have been the 2002 National Championship. Maybe Oregon in the Rose Bowl. You could also argue about several instances since then, like Michigan in 2006, but I'd argue that we won that game with talent. And it's not like it was hard to out-coach Lloyd Carr.
Notable BIG games we were out-coached in: USC twice, Arkansas, MSU and Clemson last year, and even VT this year. Out-coached in dramatic fashion in many of those games. I know the offensive line struggled early this year, but in that VT game it looked like Herman had never seen a blitz package before. I do expect a win tomorrow, but it won't happen if they continue to leave the players out to dry.
Notable BIG games we were out-coached in: USC twice, Arkansas, MSU and Clemson last year, and even VT this year. Out-coached in dramatic fashion in many of those games. I know the offensive line struggled early this year, but in that VT game it looked like Herman had never seen a blitz package before. I do expect a win tomorrow, but it won't happen if they continue to leave the players out to dry.
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ShowMeBuck
You know what? Chicken butt.
Boy, I read a lot of out-coached comments in different places. And I tend to agree, this year especially. Wonder if Herman is feeling any of that pressure? I definitely think Urban is. This game hinges on in-game adjustments, not something that I consider a strong suit of Hermans. This is a huge opportunity for him to change that perception.
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UpNorth_Buckeye
Assistant Coach
The better question is if that grainy picture is green with black specks or black with green specks?That is a real question?
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matcar
Mostly banned
I'm really not sure how one determines when we are out coached. Seems like bullshit to me. Basically the assumption is that we are better than everyone, so if we lose, we are out coached. If we win, then the players did their job. I don't buy it. FWIW, I think you could argue that much of the 2012 season our coaches pulled rabbits out of hats to win.
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ShowMeBuck
You know what? Chicken butt.
We ARE better than V Tech. We just are. We were seriously out coached. Yes, the O Line and JT were green. Yes the WRs dropped passes. But in the 4th quarter when they kept bringing the house especially.....we were out coached.
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Wisconsin 2011.
Btw, I'd like to know how many opportunities they had to do the bold. I imagine the number is quite small.
Texas 05? (coaching wash imo)
USC 08? (outcoached? or outclassed?)
Wisc 11
That's a pretty small list and supports what matcar was saying.
And if Sparty wins, it won't be because their offense is imaginative and sexy. It will be because they out-execute OSU, and mark another year where their defense gets the hype but their offensive execution elevates them from Virginia Tech levels to a highly respected program.
They are favored to win because Bollman prepares them well to line up and manball their opposition to death. They are favored to win because Sparty has done a very nice job developing QBs under Dantonio's reign (with a brief stretch of hideous inbetween Cousins and Cook). Their defensive coach is going to run the same stuff he's run for years. They are going to ask their guys to go out and execute and our fans are scared that they'll do so better. If that happens, it will be misconstrued as outcoaching the opposition.
Perhaps, but against PSU, the OSU coaches (and even the running game) put JT in a lot of 3rd and short situations that he just was not ready to handle.
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ShowMeBuck
You know what? Chicken butt.
So, if the coaches put JT in situations he was not ready to handle, then that was poor coaching right? Not sure where the "but" fits in with that content.
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kippy1040
Hall of Fame
I agree what you are saying here. Herman and Urban may have a couple of ACES up there sleeves to pull this one out. Also I remember a lot of buckeye fans were not approving of Bollman when he was our offensive co-ordinator , and now he is with Dantonio at Mich St. That move really surprised me. He must be doing something right for the Spartans. And I hope coaches Ash and Johnson, have our defensive line and linebackers ready for this one also.
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No, it was not poor coaching (unless you mean failing to develop a stud redshirt frosh QB in the past year). It's called having your starting QB in a sling (who hung 63 on them last year). Sometimes your guys just fail to execute, especially the bakcups.
Fast forward to 1:30:00 in this video:
Drive after pick six:
Read option, EzE picks up 9 tough yards
Handoff, Eze picks up 7 tough yards.
Handoff (no read), Eze met in backfield, falls down, loses 4.
Play action. Blitz comes, JT panicks, drops his eyes and dances around. Regains composure, passes into flats to Vannett. Delay gives DB time to limit gain to 4 yds (who was previously busy with Corey Smith upfield at the first down line).
3rd & 8, screen pass. Not a popular call, especially thrown to Spencer, though the two OL do not pick up anyone (the WRs had their guys sealed off). If they call this pass on the first drive PSU never gets back into the game.
Punt.
1st down at OSU 44.
Outside run to EzE. Defense does not shift with Heuerman coming in motion to seal off Hull, stretched a 3 yd gain into an 9.5 yd gain.
Faked pop pass to dontre, D overpursued to him. Thomas wide open. JT is late and puts too much air on the ball (due to pressure), giving the safety time to recover and break it up. Frankly if he makes the same pass to the trailing WR (spencer?) that is also a nice completion (and maybe more with Heuerman blocking the safety and the LBs giving chase). Thomas almost makes a play inside, while the DB does a good job to fight through his hands. JT leaves with injury.
Cardale enters and surrenders his freight train for an easier to tackle airborne version.
Barrett returns, dive play to EzE who mans up and finds a way.
1st down, play action, shot to Devin. JT under throws an easy TD due to major pressure in his face. Devin also could have caught the ball though it was tricky and somehow passed through the DBs hands untouched.
There are two nice passing plays there that just were not executed well, due in large part to the play of the defense.
2nd and 10, fake pitch from Marshall in wildcat. Nice 5 yd gain.
3rd & 5, Outside sweep to Jalin. First down.
Dontre Wildcat for 5 yds.
Dontre Wildcat for 2 yds.
3rd & 5, Great playcall and execution by everyone but the passer. Heuerman comes in motion. Great pick by Thomas, who takes out his man just past the first down line. Dontre runs off his man deep. #5 from PSU panics as Dontre runs past and turns and sprints towards the endzone. Heuerman is wide open for an easy first down the whole way. JT triple clutches, and eventually gets batted down (and frankly the DB was in position to potentially stop it by the time the ball would have arrived)
Missed FG
Now you have to credit the defense for making things difficult, but JT was struggling with basic passes. What playcall would have worked against that defense with the way JT was playing?
They tried to limit how much they leaned on JT, and frankly the running game was doing enough to put him in good situations. He just could not execute when they dialed up a pass. After that drive they wisely took the ball almost entirely out of his hands. Naturally that led to a stagnant offense.
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ShowMeBuck
You know what? Chicken butt.
Thanks for posting that Josh. I can't watch it all now but I made it to the 1:32 mark, the 3rd and 1 after JT missed on the throw to #3. We run a VERY predictable QB sneak and get stuffed. That's just oh-so imaginative.
Edit: if we are going to go for it anyway on 4th down when Zeke manned up and got the first down, why not throw to the endzone on that 3rd down? Yes I know he just missed on the previous pass to Thomas.......so what. Throw it again. Everyone in the stadium knew the QB sneak was coming. That's when you throw for the TD like Holy Buckeye vs. Purdue.
Edit: if we are going to go for it anyway on 4th down when Zeke manned up and got the first down, why not throw to the endzone on that 3rd down? Yes I know he just missed on the previous pass to Thomas.......so what. Throw it again. Everyone in the stadium knew the QB sneak was coming. That's when you throw for the TD like Holy Buckeye vs. Purdue.
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That tends to happen when the 3rd string QB is suddenly forced into the middle of a hostile environment and the guy is an agile freight train. If he stays on his feet he picks it up easily.
Sparty will be the opposite of imaginative yet again this weekend. They'll sprinkle in a few jet sweeps or playaction passes, but they'll generally run exactly what you think is coming, and try to pick up yardage anyway.
Herman was 'oh-so imaginative' (and by that I mean basic but diverse) in how used motion with Heuerman. A few times it outflanked the defense and helped OSU sustain a surprisingly effective running game. Another time it saw him slip out as a receiver, leaving behind EzE to try (and fail) to pick up a blitzing corner, resulting in a sack. But those tendencies also led to him slipping out wide open on 3rd down when JT just wouldn't release the ball with Zettel standing in the way.
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ShowMeBuck
You know what? Chicken butt.
Look at my edit.....why not throw it on that 3rd down instead of the QB sneak?
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