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Shaggy Texas - Shaggy Bevo, Thujone, MS Pain, Butt Hurt, and BBQ (RIP)

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Muck said:
I watched that team [2005 Texas]. It wasn't in the top 10 all time let alone #1.
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2005 Texas went 13-0 and defeated #2 Southern Cal, #4 Ohio State, #20 Texas Tech, and #22 Oklahoma. The Horns should've lost to both OSU and USC (both ended up being 3-point wins). They blew out the rest of their schedule by an average score of 53 to 14, with the closest game being a 40-29 road victory over arch rival Texas A+M.

By comparison, 2002 Ohio State went 14-0 and beat #2 Miami, #9 Michigan, #10 Washington State, and #16 Penn State. The Buckeyes had seven games that they won by seven points or less (two went into overtime), and all seven of those games could have been losses.

I'd say that it's pretty close between those two teams, which are arguably the best ever for each school, and in the discussion for best ever of all time. I wouldn't say that 2005 Texas was the best ever, or even in the top ten, but it's not really a ludicrous assertion, especially coming from a bunch of homers.
 
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LordJeffBuck said:
2005 Texas went 13-0 and defeated #2 Southern Cal, #4 Ohio State, #20 Texas Tech, and #22 Oklahoma. The Horns should've lost to both OSU and USC (both ended up being 3-point wins). They blew out the rest of their schedule by an average score of 53 to 14, with the closest game being a 40-29 road victory over arch rival Texas A+M.

By comparison, 2002 Ohio State went 14-0 and beat #2 Miami, #9 Michigan, #10 Washington State, and #16 Penn State. The Buckeyes had seven games that they won by seven points or less (two went into overtime), and all seven of those games could have been losses.

I'd say that it's pretty close between those two teams, which are arguably the best ever for each school, and in the discussion for best ever of all time. I wouldn't say that 2005 Texas was the best ever, or even in the top ten, but it's not really a ludicrous assertion, especially coming from a bunch of homers.
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They also beat the best dynasty of the BCS era, since the Cornhusker dominance predated that. And that was probably the best championship game of the era as well. So you can see how they get to that point.
 
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LordJeffBuck said:
2005 Texas went 13-0 and defeated #2 Southern Cal, #4 Ohio State, #20 Texas Tech, and #22 Oklahoma. The Horns should've lost to both OSU and USC (both ended up being 3-point wins). They blew out the rest of their schedule by an average score of 53 to 14, with the closest game being a 40-29 road victory over arch rival Texas A+M.

By comparison, 2002 Ohio State went 14-0 and beat #2 Miami, #9 Michigan, #10 Washington State, and #16 Penn State. The Buckeyes had seven games that they won by seven points or less (two went into overtime), and all seven of those games could have been losses.

I'd say that it's pretty close between those two teams, which are arguably the best ever for each school, and in the discussion for best ever of all time. I wouldn't say that 2005 Texas was the best ever, or even in the top ten, but it's not really a ludicrous assertion, especially coming from a bunch of homers.
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You would put 2002 over 1968? Interesting. I don't put 2002 anywhere near greatest of all time. In the conversation for greatest defense, yes.

I think UT fan has a decent argument for best of the decade in 2005, but the undisputed greatest team of all-time (not that I think such a thing is even quantifiable) is ridiculous.
 
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If you're going to claim being the greatest team of all time, you shouldn't need the self inflicted wounds of splitting time between Zwick and Smith, plus the Hamby drop (I swear...I'm over it. I really am) to win......unless you're telling me 2005 Ohio State is at least a top 10 all time team.
 
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ORD_Buckeye said:
You would put 2002 over 1968? Interesting. I don't put 2002 anywhere near greatest of all time. In the conversation for greatest defense, yes.
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This is a bit old (2008) and the link is now broken so I can't update the list, but here's how one computer pollster ranked the top teams of all time:

Billingsley's also ranks the top 200 teams of all time; making the Billingsley Top 200 is a pretty special accomplishment, considering the fact that since the inception of college football in 1869, there have been a grand total of 10,881 teams! Ohio State has thirteen entries on the list, which are set forth in the table below (Top 200 ranking, year, record, Billingsley rating, Billingsley poll finish for the year in question, AP poll finish for year in question):

Ohio State Teams in the Billingsley Top 200
018. Ohio State 2002 (14-0-0) (344.085) (#1) (#1)
040. Ohio State 1954 (10-0-0) (331.252) (#1) (#1)
060. Ohio State 1968 (10-0-0) (322.908) (#1) (#1)
076. Ohio State 1996 (11-1-0) (320.058) (#2) (#2)
103. Ohio State 1973 (10-0-1) (315.625) (#5) (#2)
104. Ohio State 1975 (11-1-0) (315.468) (#2) (#4)
125. Ohio State 1944 (_9-0-0) (311.796) (#2) (#2)
143. Ohio State 2006 (12-1-0) (308.385) (#2) (#2)
147. Ohio State 1961 (_8-0-1) (308.034) (#2) (#2)
152. Ohio State 1957 (_9-1-0) (307.556) (#3) (#2)
159. Ohio State 1970 (_9-1-0) (305.842) (#4) (#5)
175. Ohio State 1998 (11-1-0) (304.252) (#2) (#2)
193. Ohio State 1949 (_7-1-2) (301.525) (#4) (#6)
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Here's another computer pollster (Berryman) who ranks 2005 Texas as the #7 team of all time and 2002 Ohio State as the #23 team of all time, both being the best ever for each school: LINK to Berryman's 100 best college teams of all time. Interestingly, the 1968 Ohio State team does not rank in the top 100, but 1996 (#48), 1975 (#50), 1973 (#76), and 1998 (#100) all do.

Of course, computers don't watch football games, so their objective formulas cannot possibly capture all the nuances of a subjective experience ("I know it when I see it"). But in this case, I do agree with the computers that the 2002 Ohio State team was the best Buckeye team of all time, with 2014, 1968, and 1954 also being in the discussion.
 
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LordJeffBuck said:
This is a bit old (2008) and the link is now broken so I can't update the list, but here's how one computer pollster ranked the top teams of all time:



Here's another computer pollster (Berryman) who ranks 2005 Texas as the #7 team of all time and 2002 Ohio State as the #23 team of all time, both being the best ever for each school: LINK to Berryman's 100 best college teams of all time. Interestingly, the 1968 Ohio State team does not rank in the top 100, but 1996 (#48), 1975 (#50), 1973 (#76), and 1998 (#100) all do.

Of course, computers don't watch football games, so their objective formulas cannot possibly capture all the nuances of a subjective experience ("I know it when I see it"). But in this case, I do agree with the computers that the 2002 Ohio State team was the best Buckeye team of all time, with 2014, 1968, and 1954 also being in the discussion.
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How does the number of games factor into that ranking?
 
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The only thing I could point to 2002 as the best OSU team of all time (and I'm 34, so my memory only goes back to the 90s) is that they just wouldn't lose. There was just a feeling from week to week that this team couldn't lose. It didn't know how. It tried a few times....but it couldn't figure it out. That's something that is hard to quantify.

Despite that non-fact, I still don't think I'd pick 2002 if I was picking a team to go up against another team and my life was on the line. I might even pick 2005 or 2006 before that one, as crazy as it sounds.
 
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BuckeyeNation27 said:
The only thing I could point to 2002 as the best OSU team of all time (and I'm 34, so my memory only goes back to the 90s) is that they just wouldn't lose. There was just a feeling from week to week that this team couldn't lose. It didn't know how. It tried a few times....but it couldn't figure it out. That's something that is hard to quantify.

Despite that non-fact, I still don't think I'd pick 2002 if I was picking a team to go up against another team and my life was on the line. I might even pick 2005 or 2006 before that one, as crazy as it sounds.
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I might pick 1996 or 1998
 
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Woody1968 said:
How does the number of games factor into that ranking?
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No idea, to be honest. Here is a LINK to Billingsley's methodology, but it says nothing about number of games played.

I found the updated Billingsley 200 list, which is current through 2014. Texas 2005 ranks #19.

Here's how Ohio State's team fare:

Ohio State Teams in the Billingsley Top 200
031. Ohio State 2002 (14-0-0) (349.108) (#1) (#1 AP)
035. Ohio State 1954 (10-0-0) (346.983) (#1) (#1 AP)
036. Ohio State 2014 (14-1-0) (344.763) (#1) (#1 AP)
047. Ohio State 1944 (_9-0-0) (311.796) (#1) (#2 AP)
057. Ohio State 1968 (10-0-0) (335.665) (#1) (#1 AP)
106. Ohio State 1996 (11-1-0) (325.654) (#3) (#2 AP)
121. Ohio State 1973 (10-0-1) (323.244) (#5) (#2 AP)
125. Ohio State 1961 (_8-0-1) (308.034) (#2) (#2 AP)
159. Ohio State 1975 (11-1-0) (316.018) (#2) (#4 AP)

Ohio State is #3 in Billingsley's list of top programs all time:

01. Notre Dame.....268.752
02. Alabama........268.140
03. Ohio State.....266.876
04. Michigan.......266.353
05. Oklahoma.......260.958
06. Texas..........259.332
07. Nebraska.......259.001
08. Southern Cal...258.118
09. Tennessee......254.011
10. Georgia........250.826
 
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BuckeyeNation27 said:
The only thing I could point to 2002 as the best OSU team of all time (and I'm 34, so my memory only goes back to the 90s) is that they just wouldn't lose. There was just a feeling from week to week that this team couldn't lose. It didn't know how. It tried a few times....but it couldn't figure it out. That's something that is hard to quantify.

Despite that non-fact, I still don't think I'd pick 2002 if I was picking a team to go up against another team and my life was on the line. I might even pick 2005 or 2006 before that one, as crazy as it sounds.
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I know you can qualify "greatest" in a lot of different ways, but if I had to pick an Ohio State team I think could beat all the others in one game at one moment in time (so no season long factors), I think the 2002 team that beat Miami, the 2005 team that beat Notre Dame, the 2006 team that beat Michigan, and the 2014 team that beat Wisconsin/Bama/Oregon would be hard to decide between at the top of my list.

I was 12 in 98 so I don't remember enough about '96/'98 to know how they would fit in.

Edit: and I think any team prior to the 90s would get beat simply based and how far superior modern athletes are, but obviously '68 and '73 were great as well.
 
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