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- Thread starter NFBuck
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ScriptOhio
Everybody is somebody else's weirdo.
Re: Chardon, Ohio-based attorney and Cleveland native Lawrence J. Dolan made history in 2000 when he purchased the Cleveland Indians for a then-record $323 million. The president and managing partner of Thrasher, Dinsmore & Dolan built most of his wealth upon ownership of stock in Cablevision, founded by his brother Charles, who in 1999 was No. 312 on Forbes Magazine's richest person list. Dolan brought Cablevision to the Cleveland area in the early 1980s. He negotiated and bought the first cable TV franchises in Geauga County and later sold them to Cablevision, which added other franchises to become the area's largest cable TV operator.
Call them the Cleveland
Replace the Chief Wahoo logo with caricature of Larry (or some hick that looks like cable TV repairman):
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Wait, are you seriously suggesting that "Indians" is a derogatory term just like "Miserly Jews" and "Wetbacks" and "Camel Jockeys"?
And I find it particularly interesting that you somehow associate "Jews" with "miserliness", especially as an Ohio State fan: Schottenstein Center ... Wexner Center for the Arts (and also Medical Center) ... Fisher College of Business ... Solove Research Institute (part of The James) ... Wolstein Football Center ... just to name a few. That association is truly offensive.
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Hetuck
Assistant Coach
It's about time they changed the name. It should've happened a long time ago. When they recently blew the lead and lost the World Series, I could at least say that they didn't deserve it as long as they were still selling merchandise with the Chief Wahoo logo on it. Oh, sure, they stopped wearing it on their uniforms. But they were still selling it. I get it that you grew up seeing it and never stopped to think about it but fucking take a moment to stop and think about it. Look at it. How can you be comfortable portraying other people with such a grotesque racial stereotype?
It's interesting to follow the evolution of racial stereotyping in our media over the years. Go to YouTube and look up the Bugs Bunny episodes they don't show on tv anymore. Look at how minorities have been portrayed in movies and radio over the decades. Look at how Native Americans have been portrayed in all the old Westerns. I once saw an episode of Have Gun Will Travel where Paladin set a trap for an "Indian" and used a bottle of whiskey as bait.
I also saw a rerun of an episode of Family Ties not too long ago where a black family who were friends of the Keatons moved into the neighborhood and were the victims of racist vandalism. In one scene, while defending her neighbors, Elise Keaton was wearing a Cleveland Indians jersey with a great big Chief Wahoo patch on the sleeve. I saw that episode when it aired. It didn't strike me at the time because I never thought about it at the time. Since then I've thought about it. You know, with time you're supposed to learn and grow and evolve. That looked really out of place.
Nobody in Oxford, OH is bitching anymore about the change from Redskins to Redhawks. Nobody at Illinois is bitching seriously that they need to bring back Chief Illiniwek who was a character as historically accurate as Casper the Ghost. When they change the name, you'll get over it.
It's interesting to follow the evolution of racial stereotyping in our media over the years. Go to YouTube and look up the Bugs Bunny episodes they don't show on tv anymore. Look at how minorities have been portrayed in movies and radio over the decades. Look at how Native Americans have been portrayed in all the old Westerns. I once saw an episode of Have Gun Will Travel where Paladin set a trap for an "Indian" and used a bottle of whiskey as bait.
I also saw a rerun of an episode of Family Ties not too long ago where a black family who were friends of the Keatons moved into the neighborhood and were the victims of racist vandalism. In one scene, while defending her neighbors, Elise Keaton was wearing a Cleveland Indians jersey with a great big Chief Wahoo patch on the sleeve. I saw that episode when it aired. It didn't strike me at the time because I never thought about it at the time. Since then I've thought about it. You know, with time you're supposed to learn and grow and evolve. That looked really out of place.
Nobody in Oxford, OH is bitching anymore about the change from Redskins to Redhawks. Nobody at Illinois is bitching seriously that they need to bring back Chief Illiniwek who was a character as historically accurate as Casper the Ghost. When they change the name, you'll get over it.
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BuckBuckTN
Heisman
The Cleveland Careys (or caries, since they've been decaying for decades.....)
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Seriously? I'm pissed off because a cartoon character and a nickname that I've grown up with my entire life has been taken away and that makes me a "racist asshole." Go stare at your Justine Bateman poster in your bedroom and have a good time enjoying the rest of your night.
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bukIpower
Head Coach
I came here for the cancel culture and PC and wow I wasnt disappointed.
That said...
I've never considered their name from a race stand point. They've always been the Cleveland baseball team to me that just so happened to be call the Indians.
Whenever they win it...what do you all think people will cheer? The Cleveland Renegades or some dumb ass name or will it be the Cleveland Indians?
There's MOVIES made after this shitty team (insert the Major League shitty gif) and theres no name that can be given to them to replace what they have been for 105yrs.
To those who think it's racist? No one who cheers this team does so because of the name. They do so because it's Northern Ohio. They do so because it's the blue red and white. They do so because they don't want to give up on the team even though they really are shit.
I understand the chief wahoo ban and I surely understand the Redskins make change.... I dont get this though.
So to me... call them what you want.
I'll watch them at JACOBS field next year.
That said...
I've never considered their name from a race stand point. They've always been the Cleveland baseball team to me that just so happened to be call the Indians.
Whenever they win it...what do you all think people will cheer? The Cleveland Renegades or some dumb ass name or will it be the Cleveland Indians?
There's MOVIES made after this shitty team (insert the Major League shitty gif) and theres no name that can be given to them to replace what they have been for 105yrs.
To those who think it's racist? No one who cheers this team does so because of the name. They do so because it's Northern Ohio. They do so because it's the blue red and white. They do so because they don't want to give up on the team even though they really are shit.
I understand the chief wahoo ban and I surely understand the Redskins make change.... I dont get this though.
So to me... call them what you want.
I'll watch them at JACOBS field next year.
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Buckeneye
I lead, you follow.
Interesting sentiment.
Consider people saying just this line about the alternative - "just get over it" (re: being The Indians)
Would you feel that an appropriate response? Likely not, so why now? (Rhetorical, in all honesty but your response is always welcomed)
I have to ask this aloud, not specifically to you Tuck, but to anyone in this forum that reads and kicks this around in their mind...
What does this name change actually accomplish? I mean some tangible, clearly defined benefit? Will the atrocities that Native Americans have suffered somehow be further righted? If so, in what way beyond cosmetically? If not, well that would basically be the equivalent to saying "I married her for her looks".
Is it more than that? Is this a collective effort to shed all things past associated with negative stereotypes, or names that have been glorified with ties to the historical degradation of NA peoples? If so, and it in some way helps, shouldn't changing the city name of Columbus, Ohio be any even greater symbol of atonement? That name, more specifically the one who it most commonly brings to mind, is on a level of pure villainy with many a NA and festers centuries long history of scars.
And if you do not believe our state capitol should be renamed yet a simple small market baseball team should, might I ask where both the logic and consistency are in such a mindset?
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You missed my sarcasm font.
I hope they go back to Spiders b/c I think it is a sweet, underused nickname.
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