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Cleveland Cavs (2016 NBA Champions)

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UpNorth_Buckeye said:
The Cavs are in the finals all 3 years with Wiggins as well.
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No, the Cavs are in the lottery three straight years because Lebron never returns to Cleveland with Wiggins on the roster. Like it or not, Wiggins-for-Love was a necessary precondition of Lebron coming back to the Cavs.

UpNorth_Buckeye said:
I agree, Wiggins is not near all-NBA. He also just turned 22 and averaged over 23 points. So wouldn't be absurd that he would he an all-nba type player in a few years. But he also may never be. That's why I said you won't know for a few years.
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Wiggins is a scorer who does nothing else on the court. While his shooting has improved, he's still shooting a pedestrian .452 overall and .356 on threes. He might be the worst 6-foot-8 rebounder in the game (4.0 rpg), and he makes Dion Waiters look unselfish (2.3 apg). And despite his rep coming out of college, he's not a great defender, or even a good one. All hype.
 
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BuckeyeMafia said:
The Cavs won a title with Love. It's senseless to debate whether or not they'd be better off with Wiggins now because LeBron wasn't planning for three years down the road. I think there's also next to no chance that the Cavs would've beaten Golden State with Wiggins instead of Love.
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He did put up 8.5 points and 6.8 boards on 26% 3-pt shooting and missed a game that Cleveland won by 30. Having said that, I tend to agree that his ability to keep the paint open and get rebounds (although he was poor at both during the series) would probably outweigh what Wiggins would bring, which is just better defense (not hard to do when compared to Love). But I wouldn't say it as a definite statement.
 
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LordJeffBuck said:
No, the Cavs are in the lottery three straight years because Lebron never returns to Cleveland with Wiggins on the roster. Like it or not, Wiggins-for-Love was a necessary precondition of Lebron coming back to the Cavs.
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I guess we'll never know as we're both using hypotheticals, but you may be right. But imagine if there wasn't the perfect storm where Love was basically on his way out and the deal made all too much sense to do? Are you saying if Love wasn't even available and there was no other easy deal to make that LeBron never would have come back? I disagree, but again we won't know.

LordJeffBuck said:
Wiggins is a scorer who does nothing else on the court. While his shooting has improved, he's still shooting a pedestrian .452 overall and .356 on threes. He might be the worst 6-foot-8 rebounder in the game (4.0 rpg), and he makes Dion Waiters look unselfish (2.3 apg). And despite his rep coming out of college, he's not a great defender, or even a good one. All hype.
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I pretty much agree with this, which is why I'll once again say that i am referring to him in a few years. Just saying it wouldn't be out of this world for him to develop further since he's only 22. But, he may not, and he may already be at or near his ceiling.
 
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I'll just say this in the Love Wiggins debate. The Cavs won a title WITH love, not BECAUSE of Love....we'll never know if they would have won WITH Wiggins but damn it sure is fun to debate when it looks like the wheels are coming off.
 
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AuTX Buckeye said:
I'll just say this in the Love Wiggins debate. The Cavs won a title WITH love, not BECAUSE of Love....we'll never know if they would have won WITH Wiggins but damn it sure is fun to debate when it looks like the wheels are coming off.
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He made some damn clutch plays down the stretch last year. That being said, he hasn't been the rebounder he was in Minnesota, and the scoring is a bit more up and down in Cleveland. The good thing Kevin Love provides the Cavs is cutting Thompson's minutes so you're not left wondering what the fuck TT's trying to accomplish out there. I enjoy Thompson, but there's no way in hell he should be getting paid as much as he is right now.
 
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TooTallMenardo said:
He made some damn clutch plays down the stretch last year. That being said, he hasn't been the rebounder he was in Minnesota, and the scoring is a bit more up and down in Cleveland. The good thing Kevin Love provides the Cavs is cutting Thompson's minutes so you're not left wondering what the fuck TT's trying to accomplish out there. I enjoy Thompson, but there's no way in hell he should be getting paid as much as he is right now.
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Meh. Look at the contracts absolute stiffs like Ian mahimi are getting paid right now. Thompson is a good value by comparison.

I'd also suggest that folks complaining about Love's defense take a look at his defensive rating, especially compared to Paul George.
 
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AuTX Buckeye said:
I'll just say this in the Love Wiggins debate. The Cavs won a title WITH love, not BECAUSE of Love....we'll never know if they would have won WITH Wiggins but damn it sure is fun to debate when it looks like the wheels are coming off.
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I've been as big a Kevin Love critic as anyone, but he forever earned a place in Cleveland lore with his defensive effort on Curry following Kyrie's three that put them ahead in game 7. Without that incredible, if uncharacteristic effort, the Cavs very well might not be 2016 NBA champs.

That said, trading Love for a one year rental is a bad move. They can win again with the LeBron/Kyrie/Love core. They just need upgrades around them...J.R. Smith in particular.
 
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tsteele316 said:
Meh. Look at the contracts absolute stiffs like Ian mahimi are getting paid right now. Thompson is a good value by comparison.

I'd also suggest that folks complaining about Love's defense take a look at his defensive rating, especially compared to Paul George.
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A bad contract is a bad contract, no justification for me. Nicholas Batum is making $120 on 6 years in Charlotte. The NBA has to stop throwing money at middle of the pack (at best) players. It doesn't seem very sustainable to continue paying players $100m for averaging 11 points 6 rebounds a game for his career.
 
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TooTallMenardo said:
A bad contract is a bad contract, no justification for me. Nicholas Batum is making $120 on 6 years in Charlotte. The NBA has to stop throwing money at middle of the back (at best) players. It doesn't seem very sustainable to continue paying players $100m for averaging 11 points 6 rebounds a game for his career.
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I don't think TT is a bad contact in the current NBA. Blame the owners for the current state of the game. If you could pick 1 contract to void I doubt it would be his. If they did end up moving Love for a good defender like Butler the Cavs could have an elite D. I don't know if Butler does enough of what they need on offense to help.

Swear to God if they end up doing something stupid like Love for Melo they might as well blow the whole thing up. Melo will be free in a few months. I don't even like Love for PG straight up.
 
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exhawg said:
I don't think TT is a bad contact in the current NBA. Blame the owners for the current state of the game. If you could pick 1 contract to void I doubt it would be his. If they did end up moving Love for a good defender like Butler the Cavs could have an elite D. I don't know if Butler does enough of what they need on offense to help.

Swear to God if they end up doing something stupid like Love for Melo they might as well blow the whole thing up. Melo will be free in a few months. I don't even like Love for PG straight up.
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If I could void one, it would be Shump. If I could void two, no doubt, it's Thompson's.
 
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