Buckeye Offensive Coordinator Discussion (merged)

[Buckin' A]

My take...
It is much easier to make mistakes that will LOSE you a game on offense than on defense.


Second, if we want to start passing the ball around 60 times a game, forget about having a GREAT defense. You'll only have a TIRED defense. That kind of game plan extends the game and puts the defense out there for way too many plays.

First, then why bother even going out on offense? No offense equals no chance for a mistake in your theory.

Second, going 3 and out doesn't give the D much rest either.

 

[MililaniBuckeye]

what i AM saying is that just because you have a great defense doesn't mean that your offense has to suck

That's exactly what I'm saying...

 

[strohs]

From this data it seems that 24 points is actually a pretty reasonable measuring stick.

Very reasonable, too bad we cant seem to get their more than 6 times or so a season...

 

[bkochmc]

Very reasonable, too bad we cant seem to get their more than 6 times or so a season...

Very true... and therein lies the problem. The year the offense had the greatest success scoring 24+ points is the year we won the MNC... coincidence? I tend not to think so.

BTW, I'm not disagreeing that there are issues on offense this year... I'm in the camp that the problem lies more in the execution than the gameplan. When the Bucks execute they play really well and the fans are happy (Miami, Iowa) but when they don't execute many fans start calling for heads to roll (1st half of SDSU, Penn St.).

 

[ysubuck]

But doesn't the responsibility for a lack of execution also lie with the coaches? This lack of offense isn't a new problem, it's an ongoing problem. The question needs to be asked "Why aren't the players executing?"

Are the players that are being recruited being developed adequately by the coaches? It kills me that Ohio State supposedly brought in this magical open field tailback in Maurice Wells and there they are running the option to Brandon Schnittker? I mean right now Ohio State's top two tailbacks are Tony Pittman and Brandon Schnittker?!?!?! Meanwhile Tyrell Sutton and Northwestern can blow up against Penn State for 500+ yards. Michigan State is running wild using 3 tailbacks including a true freshman?!?!?! Players need to execute, yes. But coaches also need to develop those players to the point where the execution is there.

 

[jwinslow]

I think the talent is lacking in 3 ways:
1) Our 5th year players are from a mediocre recruiting class. We still are not beyond the bare cupboard cooper left, in that the 2001 recruiting class was not that great b/c OSU was not very good.
2) All of our eggs are in Zwick/Smith's basket. Neither Zwick/Smith are good enough to run the table this year IMO (tho Zwick hasn't had a fair shot yet). I think that is partially a talent problem.
3) We need a TE. Irizarry would likely be starting or contributing, but he messed that up. Frost seems to be doing something wrong behind the scenes. Hamby can't catch a pass anymore, tho he never gets a break so any weaknesses will be amplified. A converted defender is our backup.
4) We do not have a backup RB. Clarett left us with nothing, causing recruits to head elsewhere and even a RB to transfer. Hiley ruined his career with troublemaking. Our first good recruiting class was 2004, and they are only sophomores.

A team with avg QBs, a non-20 carry RB1, no backup RB, a weak TE position, and a conservative coach is a recipe for disaster on offense. These are explanations, not excuses.

 

[ysubuck]

I think the talent is lacking in 3 ways:
1) Our 5th year players are from a mediocre recruiting class. We still are not beyond the bare cupboard cooper left, in that the 2001 recruiting class was not that great b/c OSU was not very good.
2) All of our eggs are in Zwick/Smith's basket. Neither Zwick/Smith are good enough to run the table. I think that is partially a talent problem.
3) We need a TE. Irizarry would likely be starting or contributing, but he messed that up. Frost seems to be doing something wrong behind the scenes. Hamby can't catch a pass anymore, tho he never gets a break so any weaknesses will be amplified. A converted defender is our backup.
4) We do not have a backup RB. Clarett left us with nothing, causing recruits to head elsewhere and even a RB to transfer. Hiley ruined his career with troublemaking. Our first good recruiting class was 2004, and they are only sophomores.

A team with avg QBs, a non-20 carry RB1, no backup RB, a weak TE position, and a conservative coach is a recipe for disaster on offense. These are explanations, not excuses.

Great post. The hangover from the tail end of John Cooper's era hasn't completely gone away. Coach T always got a lot of heat for "winning with Cooper's guys," but I rarely see the fact that Cooper let recruiting go to hell those last few years addressed.

Part of the problem is also that this offensive team doesn't excel at anything. They can kind of run sometimes. They can kind of pass sometimes. They sometimes do both pretty well. But there is no identity on this offensive team. They don't line up and say, "Stop us from doing this, because we do this well."

jwinslow, when do you make a change at QB? I'm not sold on Troy Smith, as you know, and I'm also not sold on Justin Zwick, but I feel he's the best QB for the offense that the staff seems to want to use this season.

 

[jwinslow]

Not sure. I can't wait to see what Robbie brings to the table, but that's clearly not realistic this year If I were the coach, I would let my ones scrimmage the ones. Run all of our different schemes (and they sure are diverse and confusing) and see if Troy can pick them up. Something tells me this has happened and he hasn't been as awful as his PSU performance.

I want them to call more short routes for Troy, which seem reserved for Zwick. They called them in the 1st half vs. Texas and Smith completed them. We haven't seen them since (IMO, perhaps smith has just missed reads). This week that will be entirely possible against an awful defense.

Short passes will get Ginn going as well. Throw a freaking slant, for crying out loud. Run a little trickeration that isn't our amazingly predictable reverse/sweep to Ginn. Gonzo's trick plays have done well, where did those go?

The offense will get back on track this week. TS and Ginn are not on the same page, and that is the lifeline of this offense (see Michigan game, without those hookups we could lose that game). Holmes is the best wideout, but Teddy was TS' go to man, especially when things break down.

 

[MililaniBuckeye]

4) We do not have a backup RB.

Uh, yeah we do, but unfortunately both of them are for some reason sitting being Schnittker. I would love to see Wells and Haw been given a solid half of carries behind decent blocking.

 

[bkochmc]

But doesn't the responsibility for a lack of execution also lie with the coaches? This lack of offense isn't a new problem, it's an ongoing problem. The question needs to be asked "Why aren't the players executing?"

I should have elaborated a bit more in my last message. IMO, a lack of execution lies evenly on both the players and coaches shoulders... so I agree with you. If coaches see a lack of execution it is obviously their job to do everything in their power to fix it. If they aren't addressing something that should be addressed then it is a big mistake on their part. But once they do address those areas and work with the players to correct those mistakes it lies on the players to execute. Since the players are human too, unfortunately there will be games where these mistakes compound. I think that is what we saw at Penn State and I have every reason to believe the coaches will address those shortcomings and the players will respond and play a much improved game against scUM Lite.

 

[stagtennis]

Hypothetical Offensive Coordinator Option...

Mods please move or delete if necessary.


With all the buzz and Monday morning QB'ing going on, I wanted to post a scenerio/option and see what other INTELLIGENT posters thought of the idea.

As most of you know from my other posts, I am a huge Coach Tressel fan/supporter. I think the guy is one of the greatest collegiate coaches of all-time. Just look at the # of championships he's won, regardless of division.

If there was some heat from alumni/administration etc to get an offensive coordinator, I think Josh Mcdaniels would be a great fit for our program. Coach Tressel has made it relatively clear that he is reluctant to turn over the reigns of playcalling. I think that he could mesh well with the young Mcdaniels and also groom the young Mcdaniels to potentially run our program years down the road, after coach T leaves on his own terms.

Josh Mcdaniels has had a brilliant short career learning from Charlie Weiss and Bill Belichik. Josh is currently working with Belichick as the QB coach/OC. Josh has worked with Tom Brady for a few years now, and he would be a great asset to Coach Daniels and our Qb's. He could also help in recruiting etc.

With such strong ties to Ohio football, could we get him away from the NFL? Could we make this his next coaching job?

And most important, do all of you think this would help our program?

 

[crazybuckfan40]

We did when Clarett was 100% in 2002, which unfortunately wasn't very often.

Well with a better running back we had a more effecient offense. That was my point, That we can have an effecient, just like against Iowa, besides the fumbles, but we never be prolific. A Prolific offense was something like Miami had in 02', but you see that a good defense can shut down a prolific offense.

 

[crazybuckfan40]

Mods please move or delete if necessary.


With all the buzz and Monday morning QB'ing going on, I wanted to post a scenerio/option and see what other INTELLIGENT posters thought of the idea.

As most of you know from my other posts, I am a huge Coach Tressel fan/supporter. I think the guy is one of the greatest collegiate coaches of all-time. Just look at the # of championships he's won, regardless of division.

If there was some heat from alumni/administration etc to get an offensive coordinator, I think Josh Mcdaniels would be a great fit for our program. Coach Tressel has made it relatively clear that he is reluctant to turn over the reigns of playcalling. I think that he could mesh well with the young Mcdaniels and also groom the young Mcdaniels to potentially run our program years down the road, after coach T leaves on his own terms.

Josh Mcdaniels has had a brilliant short career learning from Charlie Weiss and Bill Belichik. Josh is currently working with Belichick as the QB coach/OC. Josh has worked with Tom Brady for a few years now, and he would be a great asset to Coach Daniels and our Qb's. He could also help in recruiting etc.

With such strong ties to Ohio football, could we get him away from the NFL? Could we make this his next coaching job?

And most important, do all of you think this would help our program?

Sounds like a good idea, but I still think Tress would be in control.

 

[jwinslow]

Uh, yeah we do, but unfortunately both of them are for some reason sitting being Schnittker. I would love to see Wells and Haw been given a solid half of carries behind decent blocking.

I love wells as much as the next guy, but he is not a proven commodity. I think if you gave him blocking, he'd amaze you. And Haw is nothing but hype at this point. His good carries in the spring game came against the 2nd-3rd teamers. I think both could be great contributors, but we don't know that they are yet. I agree that they should be tried ahead of #43. That being said, we don't have a backup RB right now.

 

[BGriffBuckeye]

Sounds good to me, but what are his ties to Ohio football?