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2008 tOSU Defense discussion (official thread)

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Oneshot;1267682; said:
Watching so many Ohio State games, it's important to realize what real pressure from a D-line looks like.

I happened to watch the Florida-Vol game last night (jesus, were there some snoozers yesterday), and Florida's D-line gets PUSH. I'm talking about collapsing the would-be pocket, forcing whoever was playing QB to throw it immediately.

I wish we could understand how Florida and LSU get their D-lines to play with such tenacity and power. If we had that D-line, we would undoubtedly be unstoppable. I believe that our linebackers play very well in space, and our back seven can shut down quick, forced passes.

But damn as I was watching those games, I really felt a strange sense of... jealousy? But then I realized I am not a Gator or a Tiger. I'm a Buckeye. Whew.
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Other than the "teaching" point, I agree. I was most certainly envious of LSU and Aburn's DL's. They are big, fast, and nasty. The reason these teams are so good is because their DL is so incredibly disruptive. In '02 our defense was so good because of our DL. I think our LB's and CB's are great...our safeties are pretty good. However, they can't do it by themselves. As grad said, they have them, we don't. I don't really see this improving anytime this year. Missing on Barksdale, Brent, etc. is hurting us. Missing on Ben Martin may be hurting us. I realize you win some and you lose some, but losing guys in the trenches hurts the most.
 
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Tresselbeliever;1267735; said:
DT Depth and Recruiting

Here's a thread that I recommend everyone to check up on. RB07 made very prescient observations about the future of the DT position. osugrad broke down the OSU DL recruiting philosophy. Overall, a lot of good arguments and counterarguments about DT recruiting. And this is before the UF game.
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I still believe in the DE to DT conversion...but for some reason, its not happening right now.

The southern schools are taking the best bigman athletes and pounding the weight on them, teaching them to put a hand down, and cutting them loose wide open.

Here is a perfect example: '07 SC ATH Carlos Dunlap

They can say he was 260 in HS, but that is not correct. More like 230-240. He was raw...but an unreal athlete. Returned kicks, played some WR...goes to Florida and they put massive weight on him and now he is a freak athlete at 290 lbs coming off the edge and occasionally moving inside.

The game is changing fast...its time to adapt the philosophy.
 
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osugrad21;1267754; said:
I still believe in the DE to DT conversion...but for some reason, its not happening right now...

...The game is changing fast...its time to adapt the philosophy.
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Not trying to put you on front street, so to speak, but in that thread, you said this...

I've said it before and I will say it one more time before we get back to Joseph, if there is one position you need not worry about on the tOSU football team, it is Jim Heacock's position.
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Do you still feel that way? I mean, if we get a couple "freak nasty" DT's, is Heacock still the coach you want on 'em? Or is his philosophy contradictory to having those types of DT's?

Don't answer if you don't want to. I was just curious.
 
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BUCKYLE;1267809; said:
Not trying to put you on front street, so to speak, but in that thread, you said this...



Do you still feel that way? I mean, if we get a couple "freak nasty" DT's, is Heacock still the coach you want on 'em? Or is his philosophy contradictory to having those types of DT's?

Don't answer if you don't want to. I was just curious.
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Buckyle...

Just wondering whether you saw the Auburn/LSU game? (probably a dumb question) LSU kept on rotating Dlines and rushing only 4, getting great pressure when it really counted. Now I think Wilson, Rose, Heyward, Gibson, and even KWells (future) are studs, but do you think our lack of pressure is scheme, coaching, or are some of our studs overrated compared to other teams?? Interested in your thoughts..
 
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BUCKYLE;1267809; said:
Do you still feel that way? I mean, if we get a couple "freak nasty" DT's, is Heacock still the coach you want on 'em? Or is his philosophy contradictory to having those types of DT's?

Don't answer if you don't want to. I was just curious.
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Absolutely. I still feel Jim Heacock is an excellent DL coach. Something has changed. Coordinator role taking away from it? Possibly. However, I just don't see the athletic maneaters in the middle. I also said in that thread that OL/DL is the hardest position to recruit...right now, I'm thinking its time for a change in our philosophy. We have the fireplug 1 tech types...but they are not getting it done. I see many people calling for the penetrating DT types...that is where we are lacking...but the penetration is not as important as the basic disruption. Right now, we have interior DL who are getting single blocked or chipped and the LBs are getting caught up in the trash. We need those dynamic 1 techs that demand a double team on every play whistle to whistle so the LBs can get downhill to stuff a play. Right now, the current batch is adequate at best. I'd love to see some of the current DEs in the 3 tech and get guys like Gibson, Wells, Williams on the edges.
 
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tbonesizzle;1267813; said:
Buckyle...

Just wondering whether you saw the Auburn/LSU game? (probably a dumb question) LSU kept on rotating Dlines and rushing only 4, getting great pressure when it really counted. Now I think Wilson, Rose, Heyward, Gibson, and even KWells (future) are studs, but do you think our lack of pressure is scheme, coaching, or are some of our studs overrated compared to other teams?? Interested in your thoughts..
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I appreciate you asking me, but don't let the rep fool you. I really don't know what the fuck I'm talking about. My overly inflated rep is mostly from smart ass comments and lot's of cursing. I usually defer to grad21 in any x's and o's discussion.
:biggrin:
 
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BUCKYLE;1267826; said:
I appreciate you asking me, but don't let the rep fool you. I really don't know what the [censored] I'm talking about. My overly inflated rep is mostly from smart ass comments and lot's of cursing. I usually defer to grad21 in any x's and o's discussion.
:biggrin:
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Well I appreciate your fucking honesty then...:biggrin:
 
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osugrad21;1267816; said:
Absolutely. I still feel Jim Heacock is an excellent DL coach. Something has changed. Coordinator role taking away from it? Possibly. However, I just don't see the athletic maneaters in the middle. I also said in that thread that OL/DL is the hardest position to recruit...right now, I'm thinking its time for a change in our philosophy. We have the fireplug 1 tech types...but they are not getting it done. I see many people calling for the penetrating DT types...that is where we are lacking...but the penetration is not as important as the basic disruption. Right now, we have interior DL who are getting single blocked or chipped and the LBs are getting caught up in the trash. We need those dynamic 1 techs that demand a double team on every play whistle to whistle so the LBs can get downhill to stuff a play. Right now, the current batch is adequate at best. I'd love to see some of the current DEs in the 3 tech and get guys like Gibson, Wells, Williams on the edges.
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Thanks for the quick reply.

A short follow up, if I may.

Hypothetically, would a big time DC like Heacock ever consider taking back the d-line and handing off the DC responsibilities? Or is that too big a step backward for a coach to take? I understand it would be speculation, at best, and understand fully if you don't want to touch the question.
 
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BUCKYLE;1267829; said:
Hypothetically, would a big time DC like Heacock ever consider taking back the d-line and handing off the DC responsibilities? Or is that too big a step backward for a coach to take? I understand it would be speculation, at best, and understand fully if you don't want to touch the question.
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Dunno...but I doubt it. I would guess Heacock's next step is retirement.
 
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