The Race Card

[AKAK]

no offense, but i don't at all follow what you're trying to say.

Depends if you think "check your priviledge" is a worldview reminder to Tal, or a bludgeon.

just curious...

for those of you who nod your head in agreement when reading fortgang's essay, do you also think christmas is being taken away from us?

yes, that's an honest question.

Christmas probably is a good as time as any to check your priviledge, it probably gift wrapped and under the tree. But, to the degree that I nodded along, which wasn't really any, and I only skimmed. I'm not sure what there is to fear from ivory tower colloquialisms.

 

[AKAK]

Maybe it's the "messenger" and not just the "message". Certainly, when they see a white guy saying they should "learn to pick cotton" that is the wrong message.

Ahhhhh, yes. the trespassing criminal that speaks for all white folks.

 

[The KSB]

just curious...

for those of you who nod your head in agreement when reading fortgang's essay, do you also think christmas is being taken away from us?

yes, that's an honest question.

I do not feel like "christmas is being taken away from us." I grow weary of being told to “check my privilege” by those who have no idea where I come from or the level of hard work and amount of sacrifice it took for me to get to where I am today. Nor will I shed one damn tear that my children will benefit from what I have done. The whole "check your privilege" nonsense is hipster nonsense and excuse making. The path I traveled is open to anyone who is willing to endure it.

 

[Taosman]

Ahhhhh, yes. the trespassing criminal that speaks for all white folks.

The "good guys" don't seem to make the news, do they? When a major network (Fox)makes him a hero, than that's a "problem" isn't it?
That's sending a very bad "message" to the whole nation regardless of race. That's more than just a media problem, that's a society that allows the media to promote the wrong "message". Who do we have as "models/heroes"?
We get what we deserve from our media and leaders. If we want a country divided along racial and income lines and all the anger and fear that comes with that then we don't deserve our democracy. All the sacrifice by our parents(the Greatest Generation) and friends means nothing.

 

[OSU_Buckguy]

I grow weary of being told to “check my privilege” by those who have no idea where I come from or the level of hard work and amount of sacrifice it took for me to get to where I am today.

 

[The KSB]

I take this as a Bill Maher tactic. In other words = I have no retort so I'll go back to logical fallacies.

 

[MaxBuck]

I certainly don't think Christmas is "being taken away from us," and find comments from Christians to the effect that "Christianity is under attack in this country" as being about as clueless as it gets. (That's something I heard nearly verbatim out of the mouth of Tommy Bowden in a radio interview this past weekend regarding the Dabo Swinney flap.) No nation in the history of earth has had the beneficent attitude that ours has in 2014 toward people of the Christian faith.

With that being said, I think lectures from either side of the racial divide to the other side lack a certain level of credibility. Certainly comments by white folk to the effect of "what those blacks need to do is this ..." typically lack understanding of the black condition in America. Similarly, comments by black folk (and their apologists) to the effect of "those whites are speaking out of racism and a sense of entitlement and privilege" are also pretty ignorant.

None of us knows what struggles anyone else has had to deal with in getting to where they are. Uncharitable comments directed at people of different ethnicities or backgrounds seldom advance understanding, in my experience. I'm not claiming that I haven't done the same thing directed toward people of "other" groups, but I hope I continue to become more aware of that tendency before, rather than after, I shoot off my big mouth.

 

[buckeyegrad]

The path I traveled is open to anyone who is willing to endure it.

This is the one statement where I do think privilege comes into play, though I see it more along the lines of education and socio-economic status than I do race/ethnicity. For individuals who come from less privileged backgrounds, they don't even know what paths are available for them to travel.

When an inner-city teenager says his only goal is to work at a fast food restaurant, that is not always the result of a lack of ambition or a desire to live off the state (this is something libertarian-learning conservatives need to acknowledge). It often times can be the result of a skilled or professional career having never been presented as a possibility, yet alone a real alternative. The idea of becoming anything other than a non-skilled laborer has never even entered into the mind of the kid, yet alone how one even stars down that path.

 

[jwinslow]

I do not feel like "christmas is being taken away from us." I grow weary of being told to “check my privilege” by those who have no idea where I come from or the level of hard work and amount of sacrifice it took for me to get to where I am today. Nor will I shed one damn tear that my children will benefit from what I have done. The whole "check your privilege" nonsense is hipster nonsense and excuse making. The path I traveled is open to anyone who is willing to endure it.

If the phrase was used responsibly, as a reminder that glory is fleeting and that all can be stripped away, it would be a wise reminder for humility.

Instead it is instead another manifestation of the hubris we all possess when it comes to judging despite life's many reminders for humility.

 

[jwinslow]

This is the one statement where I do think privilege comes into play, though I see it more along the lines of education and socio-economic status than I do race/ethnicity. For individuals who come from less privileged backgrounds, they don't even know what paths are available for them to travel.

When an inner-city teenager says his only goal is to work at a fast food restaurant, that is not always the result of a lack of ambition or a desire to live off the state (this is something libertarian-learning conservatives need to acknowledge). It often times can be the result of a skilled or professional career having never been presented as a possibility, yet alone a real alternative. The idea of becoming anything other than a non-skilled laborer has never even entered into the mind of the kid, yet alone how one even stars down that path.

And much of the middle class never considered a blue collar technical career that may have brought them satisfaction and an actual career in this college degree saturated market.

 

[DubCoffman62]

This is the one statement where I do think privilege comes into play, though I see it more along the lines of education and socio-economic status than I do race/ethnicity. For individuals who come from less privileged backgrounds, they don't even know what paths are available for them to travel.

When an inner-city teenager says his only goal is to work at a fast food restaurant, that is not always the result of a lack of ambition or a desire to live off the state (this is something libertarian-learning conservatives need to acknowledge). It often times can be the result of a skilled or professional career having never been presented as a possibility, yet alone a real alternative. The idea of becoming anything other than a non-skilled laborer has never even entered into the mind of the kid, yet alone how one even stars down that path.

I feel that I can relate to this. The first ten years of my life was spent in a fairly privileged environment. Although my father was crazy my grandparents (his parents) always made sure that we had a decent place to live in a safe neighborhood and that we had what we needed. Although my mother had severe emotional problems and was incapable of demonstrating true motherly love she was a good mother in her own way. She always took an interest in my education, she taught me how to read, write and to do arithmetic before I ever entered school, I was doing algebra by the time I was in 5th grade. She also took interest in teaching me how to play baseball. It was her rather than my father that used to play catch with me, she taught me how to swing a bat, field a grounder, catch a pop-up, run the bases... We never missed a Reds game when it was on TV (this was the 1970's mind you). When I was old enough to enter little league at 8 years old I was playing just as well if not better than the 10-11 year old.
After she eventually had a breakdown and left and my father packed us up and headed west things changed drastically for us. Suddenly we were for the most part homeless, our clothes were worn and tattered, we didn't have enough to eat, our health and hygiene were neglected and we as kids found ourselves amongst what many would consider the losers or the rejects. I was able to maintain my grades for a bit but by the time i got into high school i was probably a below averages student. D's and F's started showing up on my report card. I could no longer play baseball. The kids that I hung around were kids in my same situation. The difference from me and them was that they have never been lucky enough to know the kind of life that I had come from. They knew nothing but poverty, their parents, if they had more than one, were almost all alcoholics or some other kind of addict or they only had their mother with them and had very little supervision or mentoring of any kind. Most of these kids that I knew went down the wrong path, got heavy into drugs or other criminal activity. I always avoided this, never drank or did drugs, never got some girl knocked up while i was dropping out of high school, stayed out of trouble and respected my teachers. I feel that the years i spent in the good environment at the beginning of my life is what saved me from ending up like them despite my similar circumstances from the ages 10-18. I think that knowing there's a possibility for something better is very important. These kids had no clue how much better life could be. For me, knowing was my privilege.

 

[bigdog3300]

My grandparents left Poland in the 30's and came to America with nothing; like most, they picked up work on a farm, saved up and eventually had two children whom they could comfortably raise and lived in inner-Cleveland. My father had a similar upbringing although, unfortunately, in Detroit (you want to talk about privilege...poor guy). In turn, they began to work at a young age and worked multiple jobs to put themselves in positions to pursue much higher career aspirations than their parents could have, i.e. nursing school for my mom and dentristry for my dad. I, in turn, grew up with a doctor for a father and a hospice manager for a mother. On the outside, I think it'd be easy for most to tell me that I need to 'check my privilege' as I was born on 3rd. On the inside, I'd see a history of family who came from nothing, not speaking the native language or have any certifiable skill but quickly and efficiently worked their way up. As a kid I saw that hard work, dedication, and sacrifice can take you to any base you want. The lack of those can also put you on the bench (okay, I'm done with metaphors for now).

My parents did not spoil me; I started with Kool Aid stands on the street, then raking leaves when I was 9 for $5 a pop...now that was child labor....working on farms, etc. to where I am now. The only privilege I inherited was living with parents who instilled the morals in me I needed to succeed. Too often the focus of those who do not have are the material things and not the non-quantitative that truly matter, although now I'm sure for just saying that I'll be told to check my.....

Sincerely,

A Proud Blue Eyed, Blonde Haired, Heterosexual, White Male

 

[OSU_Buckguy]

I take this as a Bill Maher tactic. In other words = I have no retort so I'll go back to logical fallacies.

which logical fallacies?

 

[Taosman]

I have to say, I am pleased to see so many taking part in this "dialogue".

 

[The KSB]

This is the one statement where I do think privilege comes into play, though I see it more along the lines of education and socio-economic status than I do race/ethnicity. For individuals who come from less privileged backgrounds, they don't even know what paths are available for them to travel.

I can see that. However, not knowing what path to take is not the first step. Just knowing that it is possible to adavance yourself and deciding that you are going to try can be the hardest first step in areas with persistent poverty.

When an inner-city teenager says his only goal is to work at a fast food restaurant, that is not always the result of a lack of ambition or a desire to live off the state (this is something libertarian-learning conservatives need to acknowledge). It often times can be the result of a skilled or professional career having never been presented as a possibility, yet alone a real alternative. The idea of becoming anything other than a non-skilled laborer has never even entered into the mind of the kid, yet alone how one even stars down that path.

That's not just inner-city. Any area with persistent multi-generational poverty the young are on the whole not given to requisite life skills to advance to a higher socio-economic level. Not to mention those around you will not be happy for you or even the least bit supportive, perhaps to the point of trying to drag you back down.