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Your HS team is awful...the BP Football Team would put up 60 on them.

Hey we're goin to the playoffs to get pasted by Licking Valley, so there :p

You are correct, but I love how nobody blames the coaching. Even though, success or not, I have seen the same thing for years. "Just enough to pass by" should be our motto. That doesnt work in modern day football. That is why USC killed us. That is why we lost last night. I usually just keep my mouth shut and laugh at some of the comments and opinions on here, but no more. I know what I see. Alot of you are in denial, and that's fine. In fact, that may be the better way to live with it. :biggrin:

Now, what if the Buckeyes had been leading 42-39 with ten minutes to play, and Penn State would have scored ten unanswered points to win 49-42? Would you be happy with the defense blowing the lead in that case? I doubt it, because good defenses shouldn't give up ten points down the stretch in a losing effort. But because the score was only 6-3 with ten minutes left to play, it was okay for the defense to give up those same ten points down the stretch in a losing effort? Really?

Ok I think you just compared the D giving up 49 points, to giving up 6 points. I am losing intelligence trying to figure out your logic. That makes absolutely no sense. So our Offense played great last night. Great effort in getting 2 field goals, but shame on our defense for giving up 13 points to a team averaging like 40. WTF are you smokin.
 
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BrutusMaximus;1306979; said:
You are correct, but I love how nobody blames the coaching. Even though, success or not, I have seen the same thing for years. "Just enough to pass by" should be our motto. That doesnt work in modern day football. That is why USC killed us. That is why we lost last night. I usually just keep my mouth shut and laugh at some of the comments and opinions on here, but no more. I know what I see. Alot of you are in denial, and that's fine. In fact, that may be the better way to live with it. :biggrin:

Given the history around here, I can see that point. However, I would also say that there has much more blame pointed to the coaching philosophies this season than those of the past.
 
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LordJeffBuck;1306501; said:
1) If last night had been my first experience with American football, then I'd never watch another game again. That was quite simply the lamest, ugliest excuse for a football game that I've ever seen, and both teams were equally at fault. The one and only big play in the entire game resulted from a boneheaded move on the simpliest play in football - the quarterback sneak (but more on that later). It wasn't a defensive slugfest ... it was offensive ineptitude at the highest level.

2) Terrelle Pryor is a true freshman, and we certainly expect him to make freshman mistakes. But his fumble on the aforementioned quarterback sneak was not a freshman mistake ... it was a stupid play. Pryor has played enough football to know that his job is to take the snap, follow his center, fall forward, gain eighteen inches, and go back to the huddle to call the next play. You can't become a hero on a quarterback sneak, Terrelle ... but you certainly can become a goat.

3) Before the year started, I thought that Pryor would win a game all by himself, and he did that at Wisconsin. And now he has the distinction of losing a game all by himself. It's generally pretty difficult to identify a single play throughout the course of a game that was the definitive turning point, but his fumble was that play. At that time, Ohio State was up 6-3, with 11:03 left in the game, with third down and inches to go. The Buckeyes had just run five straight times for a combined 22 yards, and had crossed into Penn State territory. The Nittanty Lions' defense looked like it was finally wearing down, and a successful quarterback sneak would have given the Buckeyes further momentum and a fresh set of downs ... and capping the drive with a touchdown would have essentially ended the game. But after the fumble, Penn State got the ball in great field position and eventually scored the game-winning touchdown against a rather dis-spiritied Ohio State defense. Although they had a final chance (see below), the Buckeyes never really recovered from that unfortunate play.

4) The fumble was definitely Terrelle Pryor's "Joe Pisarcik Moment", but he did have a chance to redeem himself at the end of the game. Down 13 to 6 with 1:07 left, the Buckeyes began their final drive of the game at their own 20-yard line after a touchback. Pryor completed a couple of passes to Ray Small to move the ball into Penn State territory, and then he tried to play the hero once again. After a fierce pass rush from Aaron Maybin (more on that later), Pryor rolled out to the right, set himself, somehow found Brian Hartline engulfed in a sea of white jerseys, and with plenty of time to throw launched a bomb into triple coverage that was promptly picked off. On that play, the four Penn State pass rushers were all caught inside, three pass defenders were following Hartline to the endzone, and the short zone on that side of the field had been vacated. Pryor was already near the right sideline, so all he had to do was take off running, gain ten or fifteen yards for the first down, go out of bounds to stop the clock, and then run the next play. But instead, Terrelle thought with his ego and not with his reason, and he went for the highlight reel play instead of the sure thing. Now of course, we can write that off as a "freshman mistake", but we also have to wonder if Pryor is one of those players who will always try to win the game all by himself ... and if that is the case, does he have the talent to do so? If the answer to the latter question is "yes", then we may have the next Vince Young in Columbus ... but if the answer is "no", then we might just have a problem on our hands....

5) Two big games, nine total points. That ain't gettin' it done, folks. It all starts up front, and after a few solid (but certainly not spectacular) games in a row, the Buckeyes' offensive line reverted to their true form ... getting blown up on running plays and blown by on passing plays. Blame the coaching all you want, but the talent ... and the depth ... just isn't there.

6) And another thing about the offensive line ... have the Buckeyes had a truly athletic offensive lineman since Orlando Pace? Maybe LeCharles Bentley and Nick Mangold, but that's about it. Brewster, Shugarts, and Adams seem to be a huge step up in terms of athleticism ... and Justin Boren is a proven commodity ... so let's hope that the offensive line gets a huge upgrade next season.

7) While the offense was anemic last night, the defense wasn't anything special. Yeah, they held the allegedly high-powered Nittany Lion offense to 13 points and 281 total yards (both season lows), but we all watched the game last night, and none of us was impressed with that Penn State team. The defense made no big plays (no turnovers, one sack), did nothing to change the momentum of the game, couldn't hold Penn State to a field goal after the Pryor fumble, and couldn't force the Lions to punt on their final drive. In general, the Buckeyes' defense got "out-hit" by the Lion's offense ... the Penn State offensive line won most of the battles in the trenches, and the Penn State ball carriers were consistently able to fight through tackles for extra yardage. Oh, it wasn't a bad game by the Buckeye defense by any means, but when they were called on to win the game in spite of the Buckeye offense, they just couldn't do it ... and that is what separates a truly great defense (2002) from a merely good defense (2008).

8) Penn State was called for exactly one penalty last night (it was declined by Ohio State). If those had been two SEC teams, then we'd all be saying that the officials (with orders from the league office) were trying to help the undefeated team stay undefeated so that they could get to the big money national championship game. But those were Big Ten officials last night, so we can just blame it on plain old incompetence.

9) I don't care what anyone says, games like last night's hurt worse than the blow-out losses. Yeah, we can try to rationalize those games away with a bunch of "what ifs", but in reality we know that our team got beat from start to finish by the likes of Florida, LSU, and USC. Last night, however, we really should have won the game, and but for perhaps the single most ill-advised, momentum-killing play in the history of Buckeye football, we probably would have won the game. And that just plain sucks....

10) Was it just me, or did the whole team seem flat for most of the game? For a homecoming night game against the #3 team in the country, it sure seemed like the visitors were way more pumped up than the home squad.

11) I am convinced that several players on this team "mailed in" the season from day one. Fortunately, they'll all be gone next year. No names, please, but I am not referring to Jenkins, Laurinaitis, or Boeckman....

12) This is Ohio State. There are no moral victories, no good losses, no learning experiences. The Buckeyes are supposed to win 80-90% of their games, and last night's contest was one that should have gone in the "win" column. No excuses.

13) After the USC game, I said that the Buckeyes' season was officially "over", and that Tressel should start Terrelle Pryor for the remainder of the year so that he could gain valuable experience for the 2009 season. It worked. Now I'm saying that the Big Ten season is officially "over", and that Tressel should open up the offensive play book so that Pryor can gain valuable experience for the 2009 season. Please listen....
Gotta disagree with you LJB, about Pryor losing that game. His fumble was the deciding factor, but far from the only reason the Buckeyes lost.

I do agree with your assessment of the Offensive Line. It has been a concern of mine for years. The fact that in recent years we have had so many walk-ons in the two deep is not encouraging. Please let me say that I am not trying to run down those guys' efforts nor take anything away from them. It's just that we must have whiffed on so many of our Oline recruits. The game is won in the trenches, we have been losing that for years.
 
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osugrad21;1306983; said:
Given the history around here, I can see that point. However, I would also say that there has much more blame pointed to the coaching philosophies this season than those of the past.

True. However, this is also the year that a SR quarterback was pulled to what I believe amounts to shielding the bad OL play that we are getting. So in essence, while the OL coaching and development has always been the problem, the players are taking the heat, and not the coaches that are actually getting paid to do this. If there's a problem, it's got to be addressed at the root.
 
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I wonder if Shugarts doesn't get hurt and plays if the whole offensive line is not better? And we are saying what a genius Bollman and Tressel are? :tongue2: And TP just splits time with Boeckman.....................

Why do I have this feeling that State Penn loses at Iowa?
 
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LordJeffBuck;1306977; said:
If Ohio State had lost 49-42, would you have been happy with the performance of the defense? I highly doubt it ... but in reality, it would have been the same result ... their defense would have still been seven points better than out defense ... and the Buckeyes would still have lost the game.

Now, what if the Buckeyes had been leading 42-39 with ten minutes to play, and Penn State would have scored ten unanswered points to win 49-42? Would you be happy with the defense blowing the lead in that case? I doubt it, because good defenses shouldn't give up ten points down the stretch in a losing effort. But because the score was only 6-3 with ten minutes left to play, it was okay for the defense to give up those same ten points down the stretch in a losing effort? Really?

Again, it may not be entirely fair to put that much pressure on your defense, but that is what JT usually does in games like last night's. And yes, the defense cracked under that pressure. Is Tresselball a better strategy than Bob Stoops's, who puts an equal amount of pressure on his offense, but loses to Texas 45-35 because his O can't pile up points quite as fast as Mack Brown's?

I just don't see your point. You're really reaching on this blame the D point you're trying to make.

And the D was put in a very very bad place after the PRyor fumble. PSU only had to go 30 or 40 yards to score.

Blaming the D in this game would be like blaming the O in the 2006 UM game if UM had come back and won 46-42. Sure, maybe the O couldn't get it done on the final drive, but they were certainly not to blame for losing the game.
 
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If last night had been my first experience with American football, then I'd never watch another game again. That was quite simply the lamest, ugliest excuse for a football game that I've ever seen,

You and I would make great bar hoping buddies - because we wouldn't end up fighting over the same girl.

I thought the PSU game was an absolute classic and - other than the outcome - loved every minute of it.

As an OSU fan I have issues with the way JT managed the game offensively and in particular they way he "used" Pryor - but I love straight up smash mouth. I would take a game like that over some sissified spread 60-59 shoot out any day.


(I'll take the chubby eskimo chick and you can have the blond.)
 
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I actually missed the fumble play and just assumed that they had missed the first down and had to punt, so it wasn't until a few plays later that I heard them say TP had fumbled. Maybe because I missed that play, I didn't feel the same level of frustration with this game that others felt. It's funny how one play can make that kind of difference. Anyways, always great insight Oh8ch. This season is kind of reminding me of 2005. I'd certainly take a repeat of the 06 regular season next year.
 
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Ive seen Adams play in highschool and he might be the most athletic big man ive seen in a while... And why is everyone surprised tp made a mistake, i know it was a big play but understand that he is a true freshman. Wait when he has a whole offseason to work with the playbook and his fundamentals and HOPEFULLY some changes in the offensive line and with our great recievers 2009 will be great....:osu:
 
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Here are my thoughts:

1. Guys, he's a True Freshman playing in the Big Ten. His center is a True Freshman. One of his Wide Receivers and possibly his favorite target is a True Freshman. His second running back is a Redshirt Freshman. His kick returner, the guy who sets up where he starts, is a True Freshman.

Just wait. Trust me. Next year, you will all be singing this song by the greatest band ever.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLaGPmvCBL8]YouTube - The Beatles - Getting Better[/ame]

2. Wow, Penn State is really good. Their QB is very reliable and into the game. Their backup can step in when Clark can't see straight. They don't have Morielli anymore. They have an incredible athlete in Williams, who is finally being utilized in the way he should be. Their stable of receivers are great. They don't have Morielli anymore. Their running back is reliable and can fight for tough yardage. Their backup running back pwns Morgan :slappy:Trent. They don't have Morielli anymore. Their line plays very well for it's size. Their linebackers are as solid as ever (Although we clearly had the better cast yesterday, that one LB on Penn State really stood out). They don't have Morielli anymore. They have a great kicker. Their DBs are reliable. They don't have Morielli anymore. Their return game is very solid with Williams. Jay Paterno put away the PS3. They don't have Morielli anymore.

Did you guys see what point I was trying to make? I tried to make it as obvious as possible. They don't have Morielli anymore. I'm not saying that 2006 or 2007 would have been any different if a better QB was in. Maybe the game would have been closer, but the result would have stayed the same. But, honestly, Anthony Morielli really killed that program for two years. He's gone. The Robinson clone is in.

2009 will be tough too.

3. Our running game got slapped in the face last night, far worse so than it was without Beanie at USC. I mean, honestly, wow. Penn State has a great defensive line, possibly one of the best in the country. I never in my wildest dreams thought that Beanie "Beard" Wells would ever get shut down like that. Our offensive line woes really need to be addressed.

4. Hey guys, Smith didn't look too hot against Penn State in 2005 either. And, hey, he won a Heisman and threw a giant pass to Joe Flacco today. Just think of it that way.

5. Guys, Boeckman wouldn't have made a difference. We all know his story. Penn State lost to us big last year, but they have film on him now. They bring the house. Our O-Line is underperforming this year. He gets embarrassed.

6. Really upset to see MoWells muff that kickoff. He's been a very reliable player over the last few years, and this was his chance to shine. It just didn't happen that way.

7. From what I heard, the reception for Coop was less than favorable. Very disappointed.

8. Hey guys, 10-2 and a Fiesta Bowl birth sounds pretty nice right now. Let's just aim for that. Beat Northwestern, Beat Illinois, and Beat TSUN! We win the Fiesta, we get a BCS victory and some national reputation back. 11-2 is always a good year.

:oh:
 
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Grad, how much of a difference do you think a healthy Adams or Shugarts would've made to the oline this year?

Not grad, but this relates to one of my other observations on this game.

We spend all summer trying to predict how the season will play out. So here comes OSU with AA/All Big Ten OL candidates in Boone and Rehiring. We have a ton of other returning OL plus three stud Frosh. Unprecedented depth. NOBODY saw the line as a problem.

PSU on the other hand lost enough DL to discipline and injury to cripple any team. We all knew it was a death knell for their program this season.

So we match up and what happens? We trot out our Heisman candidate Tailback and our all world QB whose greatest asset is his running ability. And we rush for 61 yards. Two yards per carry.

You simply can't explain things like that. Sure, we all want to point at game planning and play calling. But on paper we shouldn't need to resort to trickeration. Up the gut should have worked just fine.

It is the beauty - and the agony - of CFB.
 
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LordJeffBuck;1306977; said:
If Ohio State had lost 49-42, would you have been happy with the performance of the defense? I highly doubt it ... but in reality, it would have been the same result ... their defense would have still been seven points better than out defense ... and the Buckeyes would still have lost the game.

Now, what if the Buckeyes had been leading 42-39 with ten minutes to play, and Penn State would have scored ten unanswered points to win 49-42? Would you be happy with the defense blowing the lead in that case? I doubt it, because good defenses shouldn't give up ten points down the stretch in a losing effort. But because the score was only 6-3 with ten minutes left to play, it was okay for the defense to give up those same ten points down the stretch in a losing effort? Really?

Again, it may not be entirely fair to put that much pressure on your defense, but that is what JT usually does in games like last night's. And yes, the defense cracked under that pressure. Is Tresselball a better strategy than Bob Stoops's, who puts an equal amount of pressure on his offense, but loses to Texas 45-35 because his O can't pile up points quite as fast as Mack Brown's?
My thoughts
1-To be quite honest, fans will give a team/coach/coordinator a LOT more rope if they see a lot of 45-35 games-win or lose vs. a lot of 13-6 games-win or lose. Fans want to be entertained and as a whole, will tolerate losses a lot better if their team scores a lot of points in the loss, even if the D also gets shredded.

2-As far as the D on Saturday goes, giving up 6 yards a pop straight up the gut is pathetic-period. Overall the D played well, but no team should be able to run between the tackles like PSU did.

3-Eventually Tressel is going to have to have an uncomfortable conversation w/ Gene Smith about the o-line and the play calling/coaching, unless he takes the bull by the horns. If Krenzel and Spielman are critical of the playcalling on the radio, I don't think Smith would feel uncomfortable upsetting the football alumni by having such a conversation.
 
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