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Name, Image, & Likeness (NIL) at tOSU

So, when a Collective throws a bunch of money at a player, what are they paying for? Does the Collective now own the rights to the players NIL? Wasn’t that the whole idea of this, to pay a player to use their NIL on clothing, posters, adds, etc.?
You are supposed to be paying for them to endorse your product, show up at a meet and greet. Send you a personalized message etc. Same thing pro athletes get endorsement deals through. The collectives are supposed to help facilitate those contracts...

What you actually get in most cases is paying players with them showing up to hobnob at a collective party or some cases then doing nothing at all.
 
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You are supposed to be paying for them to endorse your product, show up at a meet and greet. Send you a personalized message etc. Same thing pro athletes get endorsement deals through. The collectives are supposed to help facilitate those contracts...

What you actually get in most cases is paying players with them showing up to hobnob at a collective party or some cases then doing nothing at all.

I would agree to accept a giant novelty check for 1 million dollars with your companies logo on it.
 
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I think this one is where the whole thing will come to a head. You have two frameworks at play. The old student athlete model, where playing sports was a part of the overall development of the person, still applies to most non-revenue sports. The other reality is professional athletes making big money for the school under the guise of the traditional "scholar athlete" model. I have no idea how and there are all kinds of "what if" but I think they are going to have to tackle this dichotomy head on.

Can you make an agreement with people who have the skill to play a sport that makes the school money different than an agreement with people who play a non revenue sport? Lots of legalities and TitleIX stuff are going to jump in the way of that real quick. One work around might be making your revenue making sports a separate legal entity that exists to play that sport. Money can still change hands via rev share agreements/licensing deals etc.

Give the players health care, a G.I. bill-like opportunity for a degree when playing days are done and let the free market of that form of entertainment dictate all the economics. I don't pretend to know on any of this stuff. I'm just spitballing.

As far as #2-7, I am hesitant to keep pointing to European club soccer as the business model because I don't know it that well. What I do understand of it, many professional clubs at various level that allow teams and players to move up and down, contracts to be sold up and down etc seems to make a lot of sense for all the points you bring up. I could see an average HS football player having to earn his time at the MAC level before being able to be at an OSU level kind of thing where a HS prodigy might be good enough to play at the highest level right away. How long you keep them, cut them or sell their contract would all kind of be governed by the entertainment value they produced (I would think).

Again, no real idea better than anyone else but interesting stuff to contemplate.

I didn't want to bring up soccer because its different in different countries (also you can loan out players, which is a whole other thing kinda related to 5) but big clubs do have reserve teams but how they compete can be different.
 
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You are supposed to be paying for them to endorse your product, show up at a meet and greet. Send you a personalized message etc. Same thing pro athletes get endorsement deals through. The collectives are supposed to help facilitate those contracts...

What you actually get in most cases is paying players with them showing up to hobnob at a collective party or some cases then doing nothing at all.
Hopefully rules are put in place to stop the pay for play. The NIL situation has mutated to something it wasn't supposed to be.
 
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Not sure why CFB and NFL never just went full on the baseball route. Go to college for several(I forget the exact number) years and then become eligible for the pros, go straight to the pros from HS. Not everyone is going to make it the NFL, and I can't fault a kid for giving it a try, whether he's a 3 or 5star. Not sure why we baby athletes so much, yet the kid who graduates HS with them we could care less if they go to college or work as a mechanic. Never understood why a kid HAS to go to college for X number of years if he thinks he's ready for the NFL. We don't stop 18yos from going into the military, and say they need to go to college for a few years first, or they need 3yrs of basic training first. They're young adults and should be treated as such, and I never understood the argument of "but they get free room and board" as a proper compensation when they risk their bodies at such a young age for our enjoyment. We wear their jerseys, fork over money to watch them play. and yet we're content with them not seeing a cent.
This is going to be a long process that isn't solved anytime soon

I think the NFL benefits significantly from player development being funded at the University level.
The alternative is Minor Leagues, which aren't profitable. The multiple attempts at Arena, X, Euro, etc have demonstrated this principle as well.

It's kind of a paradox. But bottom line - this level of sports is profitable only with Universities involved.
Why HCs can make ten million in College, but the same competition level with same players wouldn't be able to support 1mil if it was a Minor League instead of Uni is a long topic.
But that is the case.
So NFL dictates 2yrs at College level, and gives some good PC sounding reasons for it. "Think about the children" will always dupe the dumb majority.
 
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I think the NFL benefits significantly from player development being funded at the University level.
The alternative is Minor Leagues, which aren't profitable. The multiple attempts at Arena, X, Euro, etc have demonstrated this principle as well.

It's kind of a paradox. But bottom line - this level of sports is profitable only with Universities involved.
Why HCs can make ten million in College, but the same competition level with same players wouldn't be able to support 1mil if it was a Minor League instead of Uni is a long topic.
But that is the case.
So NFL dictates 2yrs at College level, and gives some good PC sounding reasons for it. "Think about the children" will always dupe the dumb majority.

I agree that the minor/alternative football leagues haven't been profitable but this is different. These current major college football brands are huge. In some places they are much more popular than the NFL.

When you say "University involved" that is the point where I think they could make it work. They own those brands. License them out to a minor league football team and the money will flow just like it did before (if not much more with expanded CFP). However they do it, thinking in terms of brand and licensing this doesn't have to be such a binary win/lose situation for the sport or the schools. The only thing I don't see surviving is the old (largely mythical) marketing ploy that these high level football and basketball players are the same as other student athletes.
 
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I agree that the minor/alternative football leagues haven't been profitable but this is different. These current major college football brands are huge. In some places they are much more popular than the NFL.

When you say "University involved" that is the point where I think they could make it work. They own those brands. License them out to a minor league football team and the money will flow just like it did before (if not much more with expanded CFP). However they do it, thinking in terms of brand and licensing this doesn't have to be such a binary win/lose situation for the sport or the schools. The only thing I don't see surviving is the old (largely mythical) marketing ploy that these high level football and basketball players are the same as other student athletes.

I can tell you full stop, if the Columbus clippers with buckeye leaves on their helmets play the Toledo mudhens with an M on their helmet I will not give one single solitary fuck.

Which is to say that I don't think the money will flow like before.... at all.

Whatever you guys think are marketing ploys now, need to continue to be marketing ploys or its all over.

The only thing I don't see surviving is the old (largely mythical) marketing ploy that these high level football and basketball players are the same as other student athletes.

Your sentence here is one word too long. The ploy needs to be that they are the same as other students. They just happen to also be famous and can make money because of that.

The minute you fully professionalize this, no one will give a shit. What are the ratings of the Little League world series vs The AAA Baseball Championship? (what do you even call that now? I have no idea)

I realize there are all these rando caveats like "well, its going to consolidate into super conferences" and all that shit... but take UCLA for example, they have 25 guys on active NFL rosters. Probably (easy math time) 18 of those guys are from the last 4 years (and the rest are outlier guys that have been around awhile. Obvious superconference member is putting 4.5 guys a year in the league (and 4 are on IR). 4. From 85 dudes that they turn over 25 of them a year. TCU is in the College football playoff and has 20 and two of those are Jerry Hughes and Andy Dalton, (and 6 are on IR) - the only reason I mention the IR guys and omit PS guys is to point out that its even a smaller number at any given moment against the 53.

Sure Ohio State is in the 40's in any given week, but, the point is those numbers fall really fast. That means 3 things, one is a lot of NFL guys come from outside what you would think are the top 40 teams (which is probably why drafting 18 year olds is a bad idea else those guys would have been recruited differently) and second, most college football players ARE in fact the same as other student athletes in the end, and the money they can make from their fame is largely going to be a product of how many stars they have next to their names. (Which is to say, speculative) So, third, if recruiting becomes a professionalized venture where minor league teams attract talent to college branded professional sports operations, how long are they going to shell out 1.5 million to kids that are busts more than half the time? I mean, they are paying the universities for the rights to use their brands so the money can flow like before, that's not going to be cheap, especially if they can't sell the contracts on to the NFL.

What's my point? Well, its pretty simply that if you don't have a bunch of motivated psycho boosters ready to shell out piles of their own cash for NIL, and leave it to the marketplace, I have a feeling that you're going to find out that free school plus stipend etc is closer than you think to the market value for the rank and file. Conferences may be better than at extracting TV revenue than ever, but ratings are going in the wrong direction. Are they going to keep getting that money if they change the game completely?
 
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I can tell you full stop, if the Columbus clippers with buckeye leaves on their helmets play the Toledo mudhens with an M on their helmet I will not give one single solitary fuck.

Which is to say that I don't think the money will flow like before.... at all.

Whatever you guys think are marketing ploys now, need to continue to be marketing ploys or its all over.



Your sentence here is one word too long. The ploy needs to be that they are the same as other students. They just happen to also be famous and can make money because of that.

The minute you fully professionalize this, no one will give a shit. What are the ratings of the Little League world series vs The AAA Baseball Championship? (what do you even call that now? I have no idea)

I realize there are all these rando caveats like "well, its going to consolidate into super conferences" and all that shit... but take UCLA for example, they have 25 guys on active NFL rosters. Probably (easy math time) 18 of those guys are from the last 4 years (and the rest are outlier guys that have been around awhile. Obvious superconference member is putting 4.5 guys a year in the league (and 4 are on IR). 4. From 85 dudes that they turn over 25 of them a year. TCU is in the College football playoff and has 20 and two of those are Jerry Hughes and Andy Dalton, (and 6 are on IR) - the only reason I mention the IR guys and omit PS guys is to point out that its even a smaller number at any given moment against the 53.

Sure Ohio State is in the 40's in any given week, but, the point is those numbers fall really fast. That means 3 things, one is a lot of NFL guys come from outside what you would think are the top 40 teams (which is probably why drafting 18 year olds is a bad idea else those guys would have been recruited differently) and second, most college football players ARE in fact the same as other student athletes in the end, and the money they can make from their fame is largely going to be a product of how many stars they have next to their names. (Which is to say, speculative) So, third, if recruiting becomes a professionalized venture where minor league teams attract talent to college branded professional sports operations, how long are they going to shell out 1.5 million to kids that are busts more than half the time? I mean, they are paying the universities for the rights to use their brands so the money can flow like before, that's not going to be cheap, especially if they can't sell the contracts on to the NFL.

What's my point? Well, its pretty simply that if you don't have a bunch of motivated psycho boosters ready to shell out piles of their own cash for NIL, and leave it to the marketplace, I have a feeling that you're going to find out that free school plus stipend etc is closer than you think to the market value for the rank and file. Conferences may be better than at extracting TV revenue than ever, but ratings are going in the wrong direction. Are they going to keep getting that money if they change the game completely?

My scenario (and that's all it is, not trying to predict the future) is one in which this same team we see today, The Ohio State Buckeyes, may have a different legal structure behind it instead of being a department with the Ohio State University. The team represents, and is fully affiliated with, the school. Nothing changes from today from a fans perspective. With that major assumption in place (and again, I have no idea if it really could work any better than someone who thinks it wouldn't) I don't think the dollars change at all. Broadcasting rights drives the whole thing.

When I watch a pro sports team, or now a college football team, my interest and enjoyment never have been, nor ever will be, affected by their ownership structure or how much a player makes. Likewise, if I knew that each kid I saw wearing the scarlet and gray on 12/31 wasn't an actual student at OSU right now, I couldn't give two shits. The name on the front of the jersey not the back kind of thing.

To each their own but if the new normal was that I knew Stroud wasn't enrolled at OSU right now but could come back and complete his degree at OSU whenever his playing days might be over, it wouldn't change anything about my level of interest or financial commitment. He plays for the Buckeyes right now and that's all I really care about.
 
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The NCAA literally does everything to make the wrong decision, and try and live in the 1950s. The whole change in age limit for the NBA was laughable, there was nothing wrong with HS kids going straight to the NBA. And now they've made CBB an absolute laughingstock, and the NBA in turn thumbed their nose at the NCAA and let kids go to the G league now(and overseas has become option moreso as well). There was a world where both entities could co-exist and thrive, and now CBB is a watered down version of itself filled with guys who are only at college for a few months before bolting.

That decision was part of the NBA collective bargaining agreement and had nothing to do with the NCAA. The NCAA does not set any rules on who can or cannot be drafted by professional sports leagues.
 
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I see many people that mention "revenue sharing". How is a public university, all of which are non profit organizations going to be able to do "revenue sharing"? Now maybe you mean "profit sharing", but universities work on a break even budget. While the football program generates more revenue (in most years) than the expenses incurred, that "profit" goes back into spending of other university programs and is part of the budget. There is no profit to share.

One other point on what I think would almost certainly become reality is that teams that choose to enter into a pay to play model would not be part of a conference and at least half the P5 conference teams would not participate in a pay to play model as there would be no way for them to be competitive.
 
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My scenario (and that's all it is, not trying to predict the future) is one in which this same team we see today, The Ohio State Buckeyes, may have a different legal structure behind it instead of being a department with the Ohio State University. The team represents, and is fully affiliated with, the school. Nothing changes from today from a fans perspective. With that major assumption in place (and again, I have no idea if it really could work any better than someone who thinks it wouldn't) I don't think the dollars change at all. Broadcasting rights drives the whole thing.

When I watch a pro sports team, or now a college football team, my interest and enjoyment never have been, nor ever will be, affected by their ownership structure or how much a player makes. Likewise, if I knew that each kid I saw wearing the scarlet and gray on 12/31 wasn't an actual student at OSU right now, I couldn't give two shits. The name on the front of the jersey not the back kind of thing.

To each their own but if the new normal was that I knew Stroud wasn't enrolled at OSU right now but could come back and complete his degree at OSU whenever his playing days might be over, it wouldn't change anything about my level of interest or financial commitment. He plays for the Buckeyes right now and that's all I really care about.

The highest rated college football game ever was played 16 years ago.

The broadcast rights and revenue are going to continue to be pushed by cable subscriptions and those kinds of things. Direct dollars in coffers. (BTN vs Ad revenue)

Lots of people watch lots of college football games and root for teams that don't have a snowballs chance in hell of winning a conference division nevermind a P5 title or a playoff spot

Why is that?
 
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The highest rated college football game ever was played 16 years ago.

The broadcast rights and revenue are going to continue to be pushed by cable subscriptions and those kinds of things. Direct dollars in coffers. (BTN vs Ad revenue)

Lots of people watch lots of college football games and root for teams that don't have a snowballs chance in hell of winning a conference division nevermind a P5 title or a playoff spot

Why is that?
Ratings =/= ad revenue

Right?

That's what's different now, I think.
 
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