Name, Image, & Likeness (NIL) at tOSU

[jwinslow]

I don't like the suggestion that it's "wrong" for NIL money to influence a kid's decision. People change jobs for more money all the time.

When you start overpaying someone for the act of signing on, before they work, and the committed employees see the disparity and the punishment for their loyalty, then things get ugly quickly.

people should be able to earn and be compensated before their value erodes. it's nothing like the workforce, where your value increases for decades with countless opportunities to try again if not completely reinvent themselves. JT Barrett had probably 1 year of profitability before he wasn't even beloved by his own fans. Cardale Jones can't earn now. Same with Tyvis Powell or Devin Smith or Evan Spencer.

in the nil era, unlike Barrett, much beleaguered stroud can earn despite the tide of support waning. He could have a career ending injury tomorrow and will have been able to earn something to help change the trajectory of his adult life.

there need to be safeguards, while still permitting guys to earn. And some of the nonsense would go away if the earning was about potential after you perform, and over 3 year periods.

Kids flipping to Oregon because they can produce and then get paid would be very different than getting paid in order to flip.

It would also minimize the collosal amount of shenanigans that are going to happen with these collectives and those in charge of the money.

get legitimate businesses involved, have sponsorships and official roles for leaders and starters on the team. Stop asking children to make life choices with hard to evaluate offers of supposedly life changing money. Start enhancing the ability for all to earn.

gene talked about Midwestern values. if you really want to go Midwestern, mobilize and monetize the peerless army of alumni. Not for payoffs to persuade decisions, but actual support systems and business partnerships. Job placements.

know that when you come to a school with absurd professional resources, that you'll be taken care of while you're here and given landing spots after you hang up your cleats. You are more than a gladiator.

schools like Purdue and Illinois can smash most of the sec on that front. they don't need to equal them, but there are so many natural and allegedly honorable ways to go about this. and restore some of the mystique, purity and religion of college football. the hypocrisy of those beliefs about purity are not a rebuttal, that delusion and tribalism about why stars come here vs sign elsewhere makes CFB silly and fun. That righteousness is what defines CFB, and if everyone accepts that everyone buys guys, that religion dies.

 

[BB73]

Great post.

And there’s the possibility of making job offers dependent on getting a degree from tOSU, which would mitigate losing guys via the portal to NIL money.

 

[Jaxbuck]

When you start overpaying someone for the act of signing on, before they work, and the committed employees see the disparity and the punishment for their loyalty, then things get ugly quickly.

people should be able to earn and be compensated before their value erodes. it's nothing like the workforce, where your value increases for decades with countless opportunities to try again if not completely reinvent themselves. JT Barrett had probably 1 year of profitability before he wasn't even beloved by his own fans. Cardale Jones can't earn now. Same with Tyvis Powell or Devin Smith or Evan Spencer.

in the nil era, unlike Barrett, much beleaguered stroud can earn despite the tide of support waning. He could have a career ending injury tomorrow and will have been able to earn something to help change the trajectory of his adult life.

there need to be safeguards, while still permitting guys to earn. And some of the nonsense would go away if the earning was about potential after you perform, and over 3 year periods.

Kids flipping to Oregon because they can produce and then get paid would be very different than getting paid in order to flip.

It would also minimize the collosal amount of shenanigans that are going to happen with these collectives and those in charge of the money.

get legitimate businesses involved, have sponsorships and official roles for leaders and starters on the team. Stop asking children to make life choices with hard to evaluate offers of supposedly life changing money. Start enhancing the ability for all to earn.

gene talked about Midwestern values. if you really want to go Midwestern, mobilize and monetize the peerless army of alumni. Not for payoffs to persuade decisions, but actual support systems and business partnerships. Job placements.

know that when you come to a school with absurd professional resources, that you'll be taken care of while you're here and given landing spots after you hang up your cleats. You are more than a gladiator.

schools like Purdue and Illinois can smash most of the sec on that front. they don't need to equal them, but there are so many natural and allegedly honorable ways to go about this. and restore some of the mystique, purity and religion of college football. the hypocrisy of those beliefs about purity are not a rebuttal, that delusion and tribalism about why stars come here vs sign elsewhere makes CFB silly and fun. That righteousness is what defines CFB, and if everyone accepts that everyone buys guys, that religion dies.

I like the idea of a "midwestern values" approach to NIL but the obvious question is will it still keep you competitive for the elite talent?

If not, you are going to want to have a midwestern values league because you've chosen to compete with a different kind of player. Time will tell but I do think tying NIL to legit business/charitable causes is the more sustainable path.

 

[sflbuck]

I think one reason southern schools are ahead of those like OSU is that They had an existing "shadow" infrastructure that was funneling money to players. Those boosters just came out of the shadows with NIL. OSU and others are building out this infrastructure on the fly.

 

[jwinslow]

I like the idea of a "midwestern values" approach to NIL but the obvious question is will it still keep you competitive for the elite talent?

If not, you are going to want to have a midwestern values league because you've chosen to compete with a different kind of player. Time will tell but I do think tying NIL to legit business/charitable causes is the more sustainable path.

I'm not sure if it keeps up with bama, but then no one has ever in history.

there's also too much focus given to the desperate 4 schools with possibly direct funding from shoe brands (not possibly in Oregon's case). and so far it's gone terribly for aTm and there's little reason to think it will end better for Miami.

the bigger deal is how it elevates the waters for the flyover teams in the b1g. there is so much academic, business and financial might that could be mobilized. Creating far more Wisconsin and Kentucky like squads (who stole Spartys mojo and players).

 

[Jaxbuck]

I think one reason southern schools are ahead of those like OSU is that They had an existing "shadow" infrastructure that was funneling money to players. Those boosters just came out of the shadows with NIL. OSU and others are building out this infrastructure on the fly.

There can be zero doubt of this

 

[DaveyBoy]

I'm not sure if it keeps up with bama, but then no one has ever in history.

there's also too much focus given to the desperate 4 schools with possibly direct funding from shoe brands (not possibly in Oregon's case). and so far it's gone terribly for aTm and there's little reason to think it will end better for Miami.

the bigger deal is how it elevates the waters for the flyover teams in the b1g. there is so much academic, business and financial might that could be mobilized. Creating far more Wisconsin and Kentucky like squads (who stole Spartys mojo and players).

you're on to some good stuff

The BigTen dominates in sheer size and scale of connections. Most are, however, in the northern half of the country where a lot of southern folks don't plan to ever live or work if their choice. In other words, our "Midwestern Values" influence will drop quickly once we get south. If we are to capture the imagination and devotion of the coveted southern recruits, it will probably be pure up front or guaranteed $.

For this reason I feel the BigTen needs to expand its footprint into Georgia, Carolinas, and Florida. Texas is even a possibility. That way, those southern states suddenly in the B1G footprint can hopefully strengthen the existing but outpost B1G alumni bases.

For example, if the B1G admitted GaTech, I feel that the OSU Alumni influence in Atlanta area would grow through natural conference rivalry and affiliation of a local school. This would strengthen OSU's recruiting reach there by elevating the status of the OSU alumni and their businesses as more "local" than currently

 

[Jaxbuck]

I'm not sure if it keeps up with bama, but then no one has ever in history.

there's also too much focus given to the desperate 4 schools with possibly direct funding from shoe brands (not possibly in Oregon's case). and so far it's gone terribly for aTm and there's little reason to think it will end better for Miami.

the bigger deal is how it elevates the waters for the flyover teams in the b1g. there is so much academic, business and financial might that could be mobilized. Creating far more Wisconsin and Kentucky like squads (who stole Spartys mojo and players).

To me, the market is irrational right now so the Miami's of the world likely can't keep up this pace but as the old saying goes, the market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent.

They better get the "midwestern values" model stood up and producing asap because the "talent follows money" model is in the lead right now.

 

[Thump]

To me, the market is irrational right now so the Miami's of the world likely can't keep up this pace but as the old saying goes, the market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent.

They better get the "midwestern values" model stood up and producing asap because the "talent follows money" model is in the lead right now.

I equate NIL to the crypto market two years ago and the Crypto market now is what NIL will look like in 2 years or less.

 

[Jaxbuck]

I equate NIL to the crypto market two years ago and the Crypto market now is what NIL will look like in 2 years or less.

We better hope so because another old saying is that it gets incredibly expensive to be stubborn and wrong.

If Gene and company are wrong about the market coming back to them while stubbornly holding onto the "midwestern values" worldview the may be setting the program up to pay a price that the majority of people aren't going to want to pay.

 

[Thump]

We better hope so because another old saying is that it gets incredibly expensive to be stubborn and wrong.

If Gene and company are wrong about the market coming back to them while stubbornly holding onto the "midwestern values" worldview the may be setting the program up to pay a price that the majority of people aren't going to want to pay.

I see it getting regulated in that time.

 

[Jaxbuck]

I see it getting regulated in that time.

You see the P5 schools from the SEC, Texas and Oregon volunteering to give away and advantage they have right now to help out the schools who are at a disadvantage right now in the next 2-3 years? They don't strike me as being all that magnanimous but you never know.

The other "hope" is that Congress passes some new law to allow the schools to work around a SCOTUS ruling. Maybe, maybe not but in the next 2-3 years?

Last hope is that the "talent follows money" NIL outfits can't keep up this pace because the ROI isn't there. The thing about that is they have been throwing that kind of money at kids for years. It's just out in the open now. Again I don't see that falling apart in the next 2-3 years.

I keep using 2-3 years because if you fall well off the pace for that kind of time in recruiting you aren't going to be able to compete at the highest level.

Simplest answer is to decide what level you want to play at and go compete by the rules of that level. The "midwestern values" thing sounds to me like what Penn State and tsun fans say after a loss when they start on "our kids do it the right way, yadda yadda yadda". It's a bullshit excuse.

 

[cincibuck]

I loved coaching. It gave me information about my students, and the students of other teachers, that I could use to good affect in my classroom. I enjoyed seeing my students as athletes. I loved watching them interact with each other, form friendships, develop teamwork and team goals. I worked with them to enjoy victory and to learn from defeat.

But I also saw what sports took from education. It began with distorting the purpose of physical education. Instead of teaching life long skills to ALL students, it took a handful of students and gave them a superb education in one or two sports. It stole time from academics for pep rallies and team travel time. It stole money from the general fund to buy uniforms, equipment, coaches, and support staff. It taught several generations of poor kids, especially black kids, that athletics were more important than academics. It created scouting and recruiting of athletes from one school to another, from one school district to another. It has now created private high schools whose sole purpose is developing athletes in two or three sports.

Then there's the coach/teacher aspect. I know a few teachers who were able to teach as effectively in season as out. I know more whose devotion was never to their subject, but to their sport. The Ohio State Board of Education knew this as early as the 1950s when they recommended that the history minor be dropped because too many coaches were teaching social studies and the results were telling in the the scores on proficiency tests and SATs. (Of all Ohio colleges, only Ohio State followed this guideline.) Woody Hayes recognized this problem in his coaching course by including a ten-question current events quiz every Friday along with a ten-question quiz over the material he had taught. When asked why, he stated, "Because in a few years most of you are going to be standing in front of a classroom full of kids and I don't want them thinking that the only thing you know is football."

When we celebrate our schools, it's for sports, not academics, for football, not music, for basketball not art, for scholarships not scholarship. We are ignoring the development of teachers, engineers, medical personnel, writers and artists. We are giving money in the form of entrance to schools and scholarships based on physical skills and ignoring those with academic potential.

I sense that there has also been a greater separation/isolation of jocks from the student body. At Ohio state in the sixties, I went to class with All-Americans and lesser jocks. They took the same tests and were held to the same academic requirements. I wonder if that is true today. I wonder if it's even possible for the vast majority of scholarship athletes to be part of a normal student life. The time demands for practice, games, and media events have increased greatly. The time left for academics has to be the loser with more classes taken on-line, more "non-fail" courses developed to replace the established curriculum, and major programs designed to keep the athlete eligible as opposed to finding a career path.

Now comes NIL and the portal and if you can see this as anything less than the professionalization of "collegiate sports" you're way ahead of me.

As much as I have loved Ohio State football, I'm fast approaching a dilemma; can I continue to ignore what has happened to the ideal of "student athlete?" It's not the fault of the athletes. It's the fault of our education system, our institutions, and folks like me to continue to insist on bread and circuses while greater needs are ignored.

It's time to say:

1. The purpose of colleges is to educate, not create professional athletes.
2. Let MLB, NBA, and the NFL pay for the development of athletes.
3. Get sports out of ALL schools, K - 12.
4. Local clubs, associations such as the AAU will emerge on their own. Cities, towns, and villages can put sports into their parks and recreation budgets.
5. Let's stop prostituting education for the good of a handful of kids and make it about reaching more of our youth.

 

[Steve19]

We may not agree on all the points, but I support the intent, Cinci. If it means that we field a team with a bunch of 18-year old millionaire hired guns who don't have any loyalty to Ohio State, then I would be quite happy to see Ohio State drop in the ratings and even quit the sport. This is not college football.

 

[NJ-Buckeye]

States that have no NIL law: Alaska, Delaware, Hawaii, Idaho, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Maine, Massachusetts, Minnesota, New Hampshire, New York, North Dakota, Rhode Island, South Dakota, Utah, Vermont, Virginia, Washington, West Virginia, Wisconsin and Wyoming