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Indians Tidbits (2009 season)

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I said the same thing when I heard them bitching about this trade on the radio here in Columbus.

Lee ain't Halladay on his best day so I wouldn't expect the same thing from Philly. There is a reason that Philly "settled" for Cliff. I'm not going to write this off as a bad trade just yet.

I'm anxious to see what players like Laporta and Rondon can do. Not to mention Fausto if he ever gets his head out of his ass.

I think if they are rebuilding again then they have to keep Victor in the locker room. If they deal Victor then they have no interest in rebuilding, they are just giving up.
 
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NFBuck;1506882; said:
What are the chances Fausto comes back to be a viable #2? What are the chances Westbrook can be a legit #3 after 18 months out of the league? What are the chances any of Huff, Laffey, Sowers, etc., etc. etc. can be capable bottom of the rotation guys? What are the chances this absolute disaster of a bullpen can do a complete 180 and become compitent??? Look at the talent there...not real good. Most of those are longshots and almost all of them are needed for this team to have a prayer. You're just putting off a needed rebuild on the very small chance this team can compete next season.
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(To all of the above) Better than the chance of being led to anything with a rotation pitcher who can't get his ERA under 5.00 in AAA.

What the fuck are we rebuilding with???? I'd rather take a chance on the above become true, because: 1) We've seen Lee be a strong ace for two years in a row; 2) We've seen Fausto be unhittable and dominating before; 3) We've seen Westbrook jam teams into double plays all day and night; 4) We didn't need guys like Laffey, Sowers or Huff to be anything more than 4 and 5 starters.

We all thought the roster was good enough before the season started. So the hacks in the bullpen blow up, the managers shits the bed and we just give up and pick up some guys that should be bagging my fucking groceries? Fuck that!!
 
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Better than the chance of being led to anything with a rotation pitcher who can't get his ERA under 5.00 in AAA.
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I have to agree here

Carrasco's minor league stats leave a lot to be desired

his ERA in AAA this year is over 5 and his career minor league ERA is 4.14

if you cant get minor league hitters out, how are you going to get major league hitters out?
 
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OH10;1506889; said:
We all thought the roster was good enough before the season started. So the hacks in the bullpen blow up, the managers shits the bed and we just give up and pick up some guys that should be bagging my fucking groceries? Fuck that!!
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Not true. A number of us, myself included, said this was a .500 team at best.

And again, we'll agree to disagree. I heard the same cries (albeit slightly louder because there were more fans) back in 2002 when they shipped off Colon and allowed Thome to walk away. All those moves resulted in a pretty decent run from 2004-07. A run that with a compitent manager should have netted at least 3 playoff runs and probably a WS win. They're taking the same approach now and are filling the farm system to build from within. It's worked the previous two times they did it and I believe it will again. Yep, we're in for a couple rough seasons, but I'd rather a couple seasons of 90-100 losses if the end result is a better team 2-3 years down the road then a couple of 79-83 or 84-78 teams (if they even got there) and starting from scratch in 2-3 years.

Now, if they can just get a GM that is willing to improve the drafting and a manager that deserves a job, I'll be happy.
 
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buckeyemania11;1506892; said:
I have to agree here

Carrasco's minor league stats leave a lot to be desired

his ERA in AAA this year is over 5 and his career minor league ERA is 4.14

if you cant get minor league hitters out, how are you going to get major league hitters out?
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1 - He's 22. Not like he'll never grow as a pitcher. If you give up on every player at the age of 22, you're doomed. Especially when said player is one of the top pitching prospects in the nation.

2 - From MLB.com: ranked as the #28 prospect in the minors and they have this to say:

Carlos Carrasco Top 50 Prospects Profile | MLB.com: Minors (talks about last year)

Carrasco finished 13th among all Minor Leaguers and second in his organization with 155 strikeouts. His 3.69 ERA was fifth in the system. Take away one bad start in Triple-A -- 5 IP, 9 H, 6 ER -- and the young right-hander had a 0.28 ERA (he allowed eight unearned runs) and a .224 batting average against in five starts during his Triple-A debut.
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Lou Marson is rated as the #43 prospect. One of the better catcher prospects in the nation. He's 23.

Jason Knapp is huge and can hit the mid/high 90s with his fastball. In class A he had 111 Ks in 85 innings. Pretty sure he's only 18.

Jason Donald is the oldest player in the deal coming to Cleveland, and he's 24. Looks like he has pretty decent potential.

I'm with NFBuck. Cleveland got two really good prospects, a third who has top of the rotation potential, and an infielder who might have starting potential. The current players aren't working out too well, might as well clear them out and get some young guys with potential. They could've traded Lee for average MLBers or young guys who could become above average MLBers. Not going to win with average players.
 
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3074326;1506932; said:
1 - He's 22. Not like he'll never grow as a pitcher. If you give up on every player at the age of 22, you're doomed. Especially when said player is one of the top pitching prospects in the nation.

2 - From MLB.com: ranked as the #28 prospect in the minors and they have this to say:

Carlos Carrasco Top 50 Prospects Profile | MLB.com: Minors (talks about last year)



Lou Marson is rated as the #43 prospect. One of the better catcher prospects in the nation. He's 23.

Jason Knapp is huge and can hit the mid/high 90s with his fastball. In class A he had 111 Ks in 85 innings. Pretty sure he's only 18.

Jason Donald is the oldest player in the deal coming to Cleveland, and he's 24. Looks like he has pretty decent potential.

I'm with NFBuck. Cleveland got two really good prospects, a third who has top of the rotation potential, and an infielder who might have starting potential. The current players aren't working out too well, might as well clear them out and get some young guys with potential. They could've traded Lee for average MLBers or young guys who could become above average MLBers. Not going to win with average players.
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Why do we need Marson when we have Santana who everyone is so high on?
 
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aurorabuckeye13;1506939; said:
Why do we need Marson when we have Santana who everyone is so high on?
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a- it never hurts to have depth in your minor league system. Yes, everybody is high on Santana, but few prospects are a sure thing. Marson is young and has a nice upside.
b- he could be used as a bargaining chip in future moves. Catching prospects are always in demand.
 
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buckeyemania11;1506940; said:
Andy Marte was the #1 ranked prospect for 2 different organizations

shows how much prospect rankings mean
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Yep, one example certainly means that all prospect rankings are useless.

I guess teams should just stop rating their minor league players and give every one of them a shot. From AAA to rookie league.
 
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Lost in all the trade hoopla, what's left of the Tribe got pounded 9-3 today. Laffey got roughed up again (I'm telling ya, he'd make a decent long/middle reliver) and the team managed 4 hits...two of 'em by Captain K.

Get used to these kind of games, without Lee as a stopper, 100 losses is a very good possibility (need to go 20-40 the rest of the way). The good news is that it's the A.L.'s turn for the #1 pick in the draft, so we'll have that going for us...
 
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NFBuck;1506950; said:
Lost in all the trade hoopla, what's left of the Tribe got pounded 9-3 today. Laffey got roughed up again (I'm telling ya, he'd make a decent long/middle reliver) and the team managed 4 hits...two of 'em by Captain K.

Get used to these kind of games, without Lee as a stopper, 100 losses is a very good possibility (need to go 20-40 the rest of the way). The good news is that it's the A.L.'s turn for the #1 pick in the draft, so we'll have that going for us...
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Chris Perez managed to pitch 2 innings without allowing any runs, I guess thats a plus
 
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