I am not all in

[ORD_Buckeye]

I think is is at least interesting that Gordon Gee, President of Ohio State, who makes 1.6 million dollars per year and Gene Smith, Athletic Director of Ohio State, who makes about 1.1 milllion dollars per year have both unequivically staked their professional reputations to Jim Tressel. .

That's a huge stretch. They've backed him, but it's a lot more nuanced behind the scenes than you portray it to be. The only people who have Gee's true opinion on this are the Board, The Ohio State University Foundation Board, Gene Smith and the Provost and Deans.

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

Ohio State isn't going to fire Jim Tressel. If the NCAA brings the hammer down he'll almost certainly resign/retire and ride off into the sunset at this point.
.

This. JT won't be fired. He might be asked to resign. He might voluntarily resign. He won't be fired.

 

[BUCKYLE]

That's a huge stretch. They've backed him, but it's a lot more nuanced behind the scenes than you portray it to be. The only people who have Gee's true opinion on this are the Board, The Ohio State University Foundation Board, Gene Smith and the Provost and Deans.

Whatever you need to think to support your opinion.

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

1. First sentence is absolutely on target.

2. Tressel, like him or hate him, has had an enormous positive influence on fundraising, which in turn has had an enormous influence on such things as our new library, new medical college facilities, and new student recreational facilities. Any objective analysis would confirm this.

JT has helped out in fundraising, particularly with the library renovation, but his overall influence has been marginal (a literal drop in the bucket) in terms of overall fundraising. Study after study continually shows no link between athletic success and overall academic fundraising, and on a personal level, I know every member on the board of Chicago's fundraising office and none put any stock in a link between athletics and fundraising.

Look at our last two campaigns. The one in the mid 80s set a record for public universities, yet came at a time that football was mired in 9-3 seasons and basketball sucked. The Affirm Thy Friendship Campaign came in the late 90s when basketball again sucked and football was slightly more successful but led by an unpopular coach who couldn't beat Michigan or win a bowl game. That campaign had an initial goal of $850MM and raised $1.23B with no time extension--at the time making Ohio State one of only a few public universities successfully completing a billion dollar campaign.

I appreciate and respect JT taking the time out to lend his presence to university fundraising operations. That doesn't mean his influence is all that significant and that the money would not still be raised in his absence.

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

GPA.

I don't think we can have it both ways. One side is saying the man clearly shamed himself and Ohio State to the point that he should be fired while a distinctly smaller subset of that group is saying his impact on the university isn't anything special.

I don't think that's logical in the least. Either he has had a positive impact in the past on the university at large or what he does doesn't matter at all in the grand scheme of things.

I've never said he should be fired; although I wouldn't shed any tears. I think he should have been given a year off. Lacking any new details coming to light, and the NCAA not dropping the hammer on him, I'm fine with the five games.

As to the larger issue, I think JT is significant. He's the most visible employee at the university and one running the university's most visible operation. As such, he's in a rather unique position to bring a lot of publicity (good or bad) to the university. Given the bizarre role of big time intercollegiate athletics, he's also in a position--based on how he runs that program--to have an undue influence over how people perceive the overall values and priorities of the university.

What I don't buy is this notion that he's the center of all things Ohio State and without his beneficent presence: our fundraising would dry up, faculty would flee and student recruitment would suffer.

 

[GomerBucks]

No matter what happens here, my opinion will not effect the outcome... What I will do is, support the Buckeyes no matter how this stuff shakes out. I love the University and the Football Program and I just want our guys to keep their honor clean and win football games....

If Tress stays, AWESOME.... If we end up with some major changes, so be it. It will all work out in the end.

 

[MaxBuck]

What I don't buy is this notion that he's the center of all things Ohio State and without his beneficent presence: our fundraising would dry up, faculty would flee and student recruitment would suffer.

Well, since no one but you has suggested such an absurd thing, if you don't buy it, where did you get the idea?

I'm flummoxed that everyone seems to have a completely binary notion: either Jim Tressel is the Second Coming of the Risen Lord, or he is a venal, sin-ridden hypocrite who ranks with a syphilitic ocean-bottom tubeworm in the ethical hierarchy of life. It's as though half of Buckeye Nation has Tressel hanging above their bedframes and the other half (notably featuring Bruce Hooley) wanting him literally hanging from a noose.

Tressel is an excellent man who is perfectly capable of making poor decisions, and even disastrously poor ones. His feet are clay, just as all of us have. But his great leadership has been a blessing for countless young men who have played football for him and whose lives have been improved immensely by the experience, and by his example. Whether you regard the terrific good he has done (and likely would continue to do) as sufficiently counterbalancing the damage done in this mess to support his continuing as our coach, or not, is a matter of individual judgment. But he's neither perfect nor "just as bad as" an axe-murderer or Bernie Madoff. I wish we all could get better perspective here.

 

[Moose]

I think is is at least interesting that Gordon Gee, President of Ohio State, who makes 1.6 million dollars per year and Gene Smith, Athletic Director of Ohio State, who makes about 1.1 milllion dollars per year have both unequivically staked their professional reputations to Jim Tressel. It is at least equally interesting that we have not heard one Ohio State recruit for the highly ranked 2011 class lament their choice. We have not heard one of their parents lament their son's choice. We have not had one of the awesome 2012 verbal commitments even waver in their decision. These people, to varying degrees have tied their professional, financial, educational, and football futures to Jim Tressel while the entire print, radio, and television sports media world tell us that the end is nigh for Jim Tressel and that Ohio State's football program is set to be bombed back to the stone age. I'm more than a little curious as to whether all the facts necessary to draw an intelligent conclusion in this saga have been placed in the public domain.

Buckshot63,
Thanks sooo much for your insightfulness!!! Its true the media doe NOT give an "Unbiased" view. Great post!!

Moose

 

[SloopyHangOn]

I wish we all could get better perspective here.

It's easier to justify your own perspective when you simplify all other perspectives to as black or as white as you can possibly get them. That's where all the polarization is coming from. Not to say that those that are guilty of this are simple minded, but it's usually the lack of security in one's beliefs on a particular subject that causes a person to dilute a complex situation into an "a or b" scenario. A lot of this discussion has ceased to be about what's at hand and has devolved into a fight for some to tell others they're wrong and others to prove that they are smarter, wiser (or even something as petty as a better fan).

But then again, it's not like this is a phenomenon uncommon to large gatherings of opinions, especially gatherings where personal accountability is subject to one's own honor; so I'm not condemning anyone or suggesting an alternative with any hope of it actually occurring, I'm merely stating the obvious in hopes to rationalize the dumbfuckery that we're all partaking in, myself included.

Carry on.

:osu:

 

[MaxBuck]

...I'm merely stating the obvious in hopes to rationalize the dumb[censored]ery that we're all partaking in, myself included.

Count me as a member of that club, too. :(

 

[Jake]

Whatever you need to think to support your opinion.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDAmPIq29ro"]Animal House - All Is Well![/ame]

 

[Gatorubet]

It's easier to justify your own perspective when you simplify all other perspectives to as black or as white as you can possibly get them. That's where all the polarization is coming from. Not to say that those that are guilty of this are simple minded, but it's usually the lack of security in one's beliefs on a particular subject that causes a person to dilute a complex situation into an "a or b" scenario. A lot of this discussion has ceased to be about what's at hand and has devolved into a fight for some to tell others they're wrong and others to prove that they are smarter, wiser (or even something as petty as a better fan).

But then again, it's not like this is a phenomenon uncommon to large gatherings of opinions, especially gatherings where personal accountability is subject to one's own honor; so I'm not condemning anyone or suggesting an alternative with any hope of it actually occurring, I'm merely stating the obvious in hopes to rationalize the dumb[censored]ery that we're all partaking in, myself included.

Carry on.

:osu:

It often takes at least a year for the NCAA to complete an investigation about a major violation like what Coach Tressel allegedly did.

Next year is 2012.

The Ancient Mayans played a kind of ball game with the death penalty being involved.

Just sayin'.

 

[SloopyHangOn]

It often takes at least a year for the NCAA to complete an investigation about a major violation like what Coach Tressel allegedly did.

Next year is 2012.

The Ancient Mayans played a kind of ball game with the death penalty being involved.

Just sayin'.

Stop quoting me when you're speakin' da crazy, you old bastard.

 

[O'Rourke]

I think is is at least interesting that Gordon Gee, President of Ohio State, who makes 1.6 million dollars per year and Gene Smith, Athletic Director of Ohio State, who makes about 1.1 milllion dollars per year have both unequivically staked their professional reputations to Jim Tressel. It is at least equally interesting that we have not heard one Ohio State recruit for the highly ranked 2011 class lament their choice. We have not heard one of their parents lament their son's choice. We have not had one of the awesome 2012 verbal commitments even waver in their decision. These people, to varying degrees have tied their professional, financial, educational, and football futures to Jim Tressel while the entire print, radio, and television sports media world tell us that the end is nigh for Jim Tressel and that Ohio State's football program is set to be bombed back to the stone age. I'm more than a little curious as to whether all the facts necessary to draw an intelligent conclusion in this saga have been placed in the public domain.

That's what kills me about this whole thing. JT is not that stupid, period. He's not some idiot who doesn't know who to report infractions to, we're talking about a man who has 20+ years under his belt and is a VERY smart guy. Forget the "aww shucks" answers, JT is a very intelligent man, My gut tells me there's a hell of a lot more to this, which could be a good or bad thing for us.

I don't know and don't expect that the whole story will ever be public. I just hope that if it does our program is not destroyed and JT is the kind of man I think he is. I feel kinda like the kid asking "say it ain't so Joe". There's more to this than what we have heard, bet your ass on that. I just don't get it. Tress isn't an idiot or new to NCAA rules, there is more to this story IMHO.

 

[Gatorubet]

That's what kills me about this whole thing. JT is not that stupid, period. He's not some idiot who doesn't know who to report infractions to, we're talking about a man who has 20+ years under his belt and is a VERY smart guy. Forget the "aww shucks" answers, JT is a very intelligent man, My gut tells me there's a hell of a lot more to this, which could be a good or bad thing for us.

I don't really think there will be "a lot" more. There were no criminal and no confidentiality concerns that could possibly apply (I personally think there never legitimately were, absent the PR spin aspect) by December when the feds told tOSU of the facts of tat-gate. I can not think of any "good thing" reason for Tress to be sitting next to Gene at the December press conference and saying nothing except for the obvious one. He knew he had broken a rule by not disclosing - for whatever reason - and he hoped the fact that he had known would go unnoticed.

If he had initially not disclosed for a good reason, now was the time to bring it up, when he was asked by tOSU about it in December. But he did not tell them. So logic tells me the only reason he did not tell his employer is a "bad thing" issue.

Which is the Occam's razor thing, being the simplest explanation.