So our offense will win the game, and your D can look at the championship trophy afterwards.edhookem said:
Just an aside.....a rubber match would be the deciding game in a series, not a rematch.
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Just an aside.....a rubber match would be the deciding game in a series, not a rematch.
Texas
:osu2:WOW what a game this is going to be. I hope no one overlooks NI too much.
GO BUCKS! i can hardly wait :osu2:
:osu2:WOW what a game this is going to be. I hope no one overlooks NI too much.
GO BUCKS! i can hardly wait :osu2:
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High Lonesome
Hook 'Em
I believe that most are referring to the rubber match as being the deciding game in the historical series dating back to Sept 10, 2005
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High Lonesome
Hook 'Em
ah.
well that would mean we win the first one this year
as was stated in the original post...anyway, here's to hoping it doesn't happen
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SanAntonioBuck
RIP Our Friend and Hero
That's what us fan's do! NIU game will be a blowout.
Now back to UT...
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campies
Senior
The only reason I compare the Texas QB to the tOSU D, is that assuming comparable chances for success and failure for both squads, the Texas QB has the advantage. Reason being: the liability of a QB is judged by his ability, as an individual, to distribute the ball to the rest of his teamates, and move the offense correspondingly. He may or may not be able to do so, therefore you're putting a lot of faith in one man to make everything go. In this case, his teammates happen to be exceptional. Since the effectiveness of a unit is measured collectively, assuming the QB plays well enough to let his exceptional teammates do their thing, the unit has a chance to be exceptional. Defensively, the liability is that although working together, effectiveness comes from actually working well together, not as individuals. Because of that as well, one standout player on defense can't have the same impact that a standout QB on offense can have, because he doesn't control the abilities of his teammates like a QB does. In this case, with squads of uncertainty, Texas only needs 1 player to play better than expected, as opposed to the 8 or 9 for the Bucks, whose success depends the gelling of the unit. Since we're making predictions, I'll put my money on one player getting his head on straight in time instead of nine, despite the discrepency in inexperience. Its logical to think that inexperienced players will screw up, and in this case, I think its harder for 8 or 9 guys to limit their chances of screwups than 1 guy, especially when the defintion for screwing up is different between the two groups because one relies on their teammates for success, and the other uses them as a means.
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Wrong. If the QB screws up, it hurts the entire offense and depending upon the degree of the screw-up it could be disasterous. Conversely, if anyone one of our "nine new" defensive guys screws up, if they play isn't in the area of the screw-up, the screw-up doesn't hurt. The play of the QB affects the offense far more than any one player on defense affects the defense.
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DallasBuckeye
All-American
this doesn't even make good nonsense. Buckeye Planet posters have been so friendly to Horn fans here it's hard for those of us who live amongst them every day to believe and stomach -- because this is the kind of thing we live with everyday. Horn fans can beat anything and everything when it comes to explaining how their team is always the best, will always win, never has to rebuild, etc. ad nauseum. few seem to possess anything like the unbiased and clear thinking kind that High Lonesome and Engineer Horn demonstrate regularly here.
want to know what it is like to live in Texas? read Campies stuff. he actually has the advantage to Texas with a QB who has NEVER thrown a college pass. ever. over a defense that has many players on it who have played a lot of college ball. amazing, ain't it?
campies seems to be unable to grasp that the QB touches the ball on every offensive play. if he is ineffective the entire offense will bog down. it really doesn't matter how good the other ten guys are one bad QB can sink the whole team. if he can't throw it doesn't matter that Jordan Shipley can run like a rocket, does it? further, if he can't throw then teams will bunch up and stop Selvin Young because even he can't run on a nine man front.
campies, the QB carries the team. you're asking an awful lot of a kid fresh out of high school aren't you?
and notice -- no one is saying Colt won't be greatness. all we're asking is for you to be realistic. just nod your head up and down, and repeat after me: "Texas is starting a totally untested kid at the most important offensive position and that all by itself should be more than enough to scare the living daylights out of Texas fans -- especially when playing the number one team in the nation."
it's tough to be in Texas. but it seems that there is more than good chance that the Buckeyes may find Longhorn fans unwilling to talk to them on September 10. :)
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campies
Senior
Sorry, I made some revisions to my post because I realized I was stumbling over my words. The point I'm trying to make it that "team" matters, and what is the essence of a "team?" Well, people working together for one. Offense and defense are not the same, however, they still rely on cordinating of talents for a common goal. Given that there is inexperience, which is a limiting factor of cordination, I'll take less inexperienced guys at a position opposed to more every day of the week. Obviously, the defense has each other to rely upon, but they are just as vulnerable to 1 person hurting them with a screwup as the offense is. A blown coverage or missed call can result in a quick score just as easily as a pick or a fumble. In this case, OSU has more opportunities to screw up (more inexperienced players), and less corresponding chances for success because of it with respect to Texas. Texas still has the opportunity to hand the ball off, play short, smart passes, minimize the QB's effect on the game, and still be devestating. OSU has to get a bunch of inexperienced players on the same page to be devestating. Texas has an easier chance to be good than OSU. Thats why I say there's an advantage.
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campies
Senior
Wow, maybe I shouldn't post while drinking. My logic goes to shit. I guess my point is that I believe its less likely for Colt to screw up than for tOSU's new defense to be successful as a unit because its harder to get a new defense on the same page early than it is to get a talented QB, albeit a new one, to play smart football and rely on his teammates. Now there's no way to objectively prove that but I guess its just that I've seen Colt play, and I know the guys we have around him, and I'm a homer who doesn't believe the OSU D will be gelled as a unit that early in the year when faced with our playmakers, and I'm coming up with bullshit reasoning to justify my position. I will be happy to admit that I was wrong if I'm unpleasantly suprised. Sorry for the confusion. 
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thackattack
Poison in a Pretty Glass
Campies: since you backtracked (and are apparently drinking 
:cheers: ), I won't quote the things that you just said. I was just wondering what you thought about the common conception that a defense has an easier time dealing with inexperience due to the aggressive nature of that side of the ball and the fact that the opposing quarterback has to effectively exploit mistakes they make for it to matter. It seems that you're saying offense (specifically, a redshirt freshman QB) has an easier time with inexperience because of the teamwork aspect, whereas most people contend that defensive inexperience is easier to overcome. If your point is that you're only throwing one inexperienced player out there versus our 9, then I see your point. I don't necessarily agree with it, but I can see where you're coming from.
:cheers: ), I won't quote the things that you just said. I was just wondering what you thought about the common conception that a defense has an easier time dealing with inexperience due to the aggressive nature of that side of the ball and the fact that the opposing quarterback has to effectively exploit mistakes they make for it to matter. It seems that you're saying offense (specifically, a redshirt freshman QB) has an easier time with inexperience because of the teamwork aspect, whereas most people contend that defensive inexperience is easier to overcome. If your point is that you're only throwing one inexperienced player out there versus our 9, then I see your point. I don't necessarily agree with it, but I can see where you're coming from.
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sandgk
Watson, Crick & A Twist
Calling UTMNC, calling UTMNC, you've got a new motivational speaker for your support group.Wow, maybe I shouldn't post while drinking. My logic goes to shit. ...
To be fair about this whole discussion here is how it seems to balance out.
The losses on Texas' D were significant, but they have a large core of players returning.
The players not returning to Ohio State's D were large in number and in presence last year. However, the returning players often have significant experience in D-1A play, either with the Buckeyes, or in the case of Kerr for a full season at Indiana.
No loss though can really compare to what was a hearbreak of an early exit for Longhorn fans in the party of Vince Young. Like Brown himself said, you can no longer count on 3rd and 30 (or I suspect 3rd and 10) conversions being exciting and frequent occurences. Tack on the loss of Ramonce Taylor and suddenly you have a lot of last years scoring taken off the field of play.
Unlike the players who have to step up into the shoes of the Ohio State D '05 starters the key player(s) who fill the gaping void left by Vince Young have not had a start. I know we keep harping on this, but it is true. Had Troy Smith left early we would have been looking very hard at the capabilities of Schoenhoft and Boeckman in Spring Game settings. Because we were looking forward we did that anyway. Like some Texas fans concerning McCoy or Snead, our general feeling is that these guys are "doing better than we hoped for." Realistically though that does not mean they would step in and run the offense with the same smooth and instinctive quality that Smith brings to the table. He evades trouble from the back side and makes the extra yard with his own legs if the play breaks down in front of him. Which was exactly part of the extra special pizazz Young would bring to the UT offense with frequency.
Expecting someone to even be a pale shadow of that well honed player is unreasonable. To quote Brown, literally this time:
And the unwritten part of that is how much game experience will be needed. Its game two, September 9th, remember? I honestly find it hard, well nigh impossible to believe that a firm, fixed and constant fixture decision will have been made at QB by then - when your warm up is against North Texas.
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txbuckeye1983
We are the innovators, they are the imitators
I am becoming more and more convinced we are coming out of Austin with a W. I think Texas fans are really underestimating Troy Smith's Vince-ability. Just take a look at the plays he made at the end of the games against Michigan and Notre Dame. After seeing what Troy did on those last two drives in Ann Arbor, I believe the man will absolutely not allow us to lose this coming game is Austin.Calling UTMNC, calling UTMNC, you've got a new motivational speaker for your support group.
To be fair about this whole discussion here is how it seems to balance out.
The losses on Texas' D were significant, but they have a large core of players returning.
The players not returning to Ohio State's D were large in number and in presence last year. However, the returning players often have significant experience in D-1A play, either with the Buckeyes, or in the case of Kerr for a full season at Indiana.
No loss though can really compare to what was a hearbreak of an early exit for Longhorn fans in the party of Vince Young. Like Brown himself said, you can no longer count on 3rd and 30 (or I suspect 3rd and 10) conversions being exciting and frequent occurences. Tack on the loss of Ramonce Taylor and suddenly you have a lot of last years scoring taken off the field of play.
Unlike the players who have to step up into the shoes of the Ohio State D '05 starters the key player(s) who fill the gaping void left by Vince Young have not had a start. I know we keep harping on this, but it is true. Had Troy Smith left early we would have been looking very hard at the capabilities of Schoenhoft and Boeckman in Spring Game settings. Because we were looking forward we did that anyway. Like some Texas fans concerning McCoy or Snead, our general feeling is that these guys are "doing better than we hoped for." Realistically though that does not mean they would step in and run the offense with the same smooth and instinctive quality that Smith brings to the table. He evades trouble from the back side and makes the extra yard with his own legs if the play breaks down in front of him. Which was exactly part of the extra special pizazz Young would bring to the UT offense with frequency.
Expecting someone to even be a pale shadow of that well honed player is unreasonable. To quote Brown, literally this time:
And the unwritten part of that is how much game experience will be needed. Its game two, September 9th, remember? I honestly find it hard, well nigh impossible to believe that a firm, fixed and constant fixture decision will have been made at QB by then - when your warm up is against North Texas.
Here is a reminder in case anyone forgot:
http://www.mililanibuckeye.net/clips/2005/gonzalez_big_catch_mich_2005_play.mpg
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Nytejag
Sophmore
Campie
I do see Campies' point, though I don't greatly agree. It is ALWAYS faster for the defense to gel, than the offense. Defense is reaction, offense is timing. The only reason I somewhat support Campies' theory, is that tOSU lost NINE starters. Five, MAYBE six, is not a big issue most times, but nine starters, you have to admit, is a lot. IMO, this game will depend on the coaches. Who has the kahoonas to make a risky call?!?! Will tOSO DC stack the box every down, and leave the inexperienced defense in a lot of one-on-ones? Will Texas' OC have the faith to pass downfield? He OWNS the infamous 3-yard out, that killed VY in his early years. The ones that call the plays will determine this outcome, IMO. Last year the players, this year the play callers.
I do see Campies' point, though I don't greatly agree. It is ALWAYS faster for the defense to gel, than the offense. Defense is reaction, offense is timing. The only reason I somewhat support Campies' theory, is that tOSU lost NINE starters. Five, MAYBE six, is not a big issue most times, but nine starters, you have to admit, is a lot. IMO, this game will depend on the coaches. Who has the kahoonas to make a risky call?!?! Will tOSO DC stack the box every down, and leave the inexperienced defense in a lot of one-on-ones? Will Texas' OC have the faith to pass downfield? He OWNS the infamous 3-yard out, that killed VY in his early years. The ones that call the plays will determine this outcome, IMO. Last year the players, this year the play callers.
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