How would you propose the Cavs guarantee an opt-in - maybe a pinky swear?
The Cavs had a guarantee from Boozer too. The Cavs can't make moves (or fail to) by acting all worried about who might turn out to be a dick.
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How would you propose the Cavs guarantee an opt-in - maybe a pinky swear?
The Cavs had a guarantee from Boozer too. The Cavs can't make moves (or fail to) by acting all worried about who might turn out to be a dick.
OleOleOleOle
World Class Scorer
By having him opt-in before we trade for him.... obviously. Or essentially the second we agree to the deal.
Cavs also can't make moves based on our sudden desperation for a title. I would love a title as much as the next guy, but right now Love seems unsure on what he wants to do, and seeing as he has been rumored for a long time to want to head back to LA, who is to say he doesn't give it one year in Cle, see another great option out West and take it? With Love, Kyrie, and LeBron all maxed out, that leaves us no room to maneuver at all. At least with Wiggins, and whoever we'd keep from Waiters, Bennett, and Thompson, we would have young guys that still can get good and produce past a few seasons.
It's very obvious, we taste a solid ring chance, so we want to make a move as fast as we can to add Love, it's basically "ring or bust" right now, which never pans out very well. I thoroughly am excited to have Love on our team, but we are letting Minn have far more leverage than we need to.
So therefore, needing more of a commitment out of Love before we pull any deal is not only necessary, it's smart basketball sense. Whether you agree or not, you cannot deny there is reason not to be hell bent on sending Wiggins and Bennett and picks to Minn w/o assurance Love will be here past a year or two.
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ethan
Senior
Its not worth giving up our last 2 #1 picks and a future first rounder.
Its not only one instance, Howard took less money to leave the Lakers. LeBron took less money to leave Miami.
Consider the location of those two teams, I don't think Love wants to live in Cleveland. He would only be here...to win.
If the Cavs don't get to the Finals in year 1, He may think of it as a waste of his time to stay in Cleveland.
Its one thing to pin your hopes on getting Love to stay long term without trading Wiggins.
Its another thing to risk losing your best young talent and to be stuck with Kyrie and LeBron recruiting Free Agents who don't want to come to Cleveland.
Cavs cant risk losing Wiggins AND Love. Its NOT worth it. I don't trust a "promise" from Kevin Love.
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OleOleOleOle
World Class Scorer
So we've got, what, two more months to go back and forth arguing whether the Cavs should include Wiggins in a trade offer for Love?
At the minimum 3 more weeks haha.
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BuckeyeMafia
A Leaf on the Wind
Brewer is actually a decent defender, so I'd be okay with that. You could put him at the 3 in crunch time with LeBron at the 4 and Love playing center.
There's no way the Cavs wouldn't make the Finals with a healthy Love, Kyrie, and LeBron next year. The Pacers are done and the Bulls are pinning all hopes on Derrick Rose and the Cavs getting no better than they already are.
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ethan
Senior
I think with Love the Cavs definitely have a very good chance of getting to the Finals but its not a certainty.
The biggest worry is that kyrie and kevin have never played a single playoff game.
Miami and Chicago are going to be tough teams to beat. (If Rose and Wade can play healthy)
Since its looking like a done deal...
If we trade Wiggins for Love we wont actually know if it was a good trade, until next year. (If Love re-signs)
Its hard to blame the Cavs for taking the risk. Its a huge risk, but they want to win now and that's what they have to do.
If anyone is worth the risk, Love is probably one of them. The best thing about him is that he is still young. Only 25.
He is only at the beginning of his prime. The Cavs can have 5 really great years of basketball.
Amazing to think, none of this would be possible if they didn't hit the lottery.
The biggest worry is that kyrie and kevin have never played a single playoff game.
Miami and Chicago are going to be tough teams to beat. (If Rose and Wade can play healthy)
Since its looking like a done deal...
If we trade Wiggins for Love we wont actually know if it was a good trade, until next year. (If Love re-signs)
Its hard to blame the Cavs for taking the risk. Its a huge risk, but they want to win now and that's what they have to do.
If anyone is worth the risk, Love is probably one of them. The best thing about him is that he is still young. Only 25.
He is only at the beginning of his prime. The Cavs can have 5 really great years of basketball.
Amazing to think, none of this would be possible if they didn't hit the lottery.
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buckeyesin07
Veni. Vidi. Vici.
I'm not sure how you reach that conclusion. The T-Wolves basically have no other offer on the table, so Bennett, whomever the Cavs would've taken at #9 overall, and the 2018 first-rounder still likely would've been the best offer Minnesota had for Love. Just another illustration of why the Cavs shouldn't be giving up Wiggins here...
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I don't want to give up Wiggins either.. but the math has to work...
You can't add $15M without parting with approx same 'value'.. it's not allowed
Look at Cavs assets and ain't a lot of ways to come up with $15M
when you take LBJ, Irving, Andy and Tristan out of the equation
Basically $5M each of: Wiggins, Bennett, Waiters
then the 3 new guys combined are about $3M in total
Haywood is $2M this year.. but a $10M bartering chip next yr
Dunno how they value future Rd 1 picks
You can't add $15M without parting with approx same 'value'.. it's not allowed
Look at Cavs assets and ain't a lot of ways to come up with $15M
when you take LBJ, Irving, Andy and Tristan out of the equation
Basically $5M each of: Wiggins, Bennett, Waiters
then the 3 new guys combined are about $3M in total
Haywood is $2M this year.. but a $10M bartering chip next yr
Dunno how they value future Rd 1 picks
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That's a good point.
$5mil though for Waiters, Bennett and the Utah guys is pretty close. Add in a first rounder and that has to add up.
$5mil though for Waiters, Bennett and the Utah guys is pretty close. Add in a first rounder and that has to add up.
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Ask me how loud my scream would be .. if this was the accepted offer...
plus (in a wink wink deal) give them first dibs on the Haywood bartering chip for next yr (that chip is huge)
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ethan
Senior
Golden State would still give up David Lee and Chicago would still give up Taj Gibson. (plus draft picks)
That's better than Bennett, #9 and another draft pick.
Minnesota doesn't want draft picks. Otherwise the Cavs could give them 4 first rounder's next year. They want an impact player.
Im thinking Minnesota has demanded to get Wiggins. Minnesota would have no reason to cave to the Cavs.
Even if Love demanded to go to the Cavs Minnesota could still demand Wiggins.
As a Free Agent we couldn't sign Love outright without a sign and trade, which means Minnesota would demand Wiggins.
If that is the case...the Cavs would have to either give up Wiggins...or pass on Love.
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"Its not worth giving up our last 2 #1 picks and a future first rounder."
One of those #1 picks is arguably one of the worst #1 picks in quite some time. To keep referring to him as a #1 pick as though that makes him something he is not is disingenuous. That he has "looked good in the summer league" is a weak argument for assigning him much value.
The second player in the mix is an unknown quantity. Sometimes you get a LeBron James or Derrick Rose. Sometimes you get a Greg Oden, Kwame Brown, or Michael Olowokandi. The #1 pick on average does not turn out as good as a Kevin Love. And certainly not in the short term.
And any future first round Cavs pick will come late in that round. No more winning lotteries in Cleveland until LeBron moves on.
All that said, if Love is really saying it is Cleveland or nobody the Cavs should be able to cut a better deal.
One of those #1 picks is arguably one of the worst #1 picks in quite some time. To keep referring to him as a #1 pick as though that makes him something he is not is disingenuous. That he has "looked good in the summer league" is a weak argument for assigning him much value.
The second player in the mix is an unknown quantity. Sometimes you get a LeBron James or Derrick Rose. Sometimes you get a Greg Oden, Kwame Brown, or Michael Olowokandi. The #1 pick on average does not turn out as good as a Kevin Love. And certainly not in the short term.
And any future first round Cavs pick will come late in that round. No more winning lotteries in Cleveland until LeBron moves on.
All that said, if Love is really saying it is Cleveland or nobody the Cavs should be able to cut a better deal.
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