Charlie Weis (ex-Kansas HC, ex-Fla OC, Notre Dame legend, UnDecided Schematic Advantage)

[xcrunner]

There are numerous folks on the ND board who are drinking this particular flavor of kool aid. They actually believe some sort of deal has been cut with Urban, but that he wants to wait till Tebow graduates.

That's the problem... yes they have a good foundation.. Although it isn't as good as they think (those recruiting classes are undoubtedly good, but not as good as they think). And their theory is that Weis will leave, a good coach will come in, and use all those amazing recruits to lead them to victory.

My question: What "good coach" will go there? Sure maybe Brian Kelly will, but in the end, I think that people are going to want to veer away from it... Maybe Brian Kelly goes, doesn't do that great because the recruits are overrated, and people expect more.. Maybe he starts getting pressure after he goes 0-3 his first 3 bowls... Simply put when expectations are absurdly high, it's not exactly a good job

 

[billmac91]

Teddy Greenstein in today's Chicago Tribune (a paper in a position to know better than any other) reported today that Weis has used profanities to insult alumni in front of their families.

This guy is just an incredibly foul human being. I don't care if he's the best coach in the world or the worst, he's scum.

I enjoy watching his son curse on the sidelines. It's like seeing Charlie at age 13.

 

[ysubuck]

It's not the money per se, it's dropping that kind of coin to admit how fucking stupid they were about a guy they said was a combination of Rockne, Jesus, and Santa Claus...as opposed to how fucking stupid they are looking (and probably racist to boot) for keeping a guy whose record after 3 years will be worse than they guy they ditched to get him.

So they have options :tongue2:

I'm not buying that anymore. Willingham proved that he sucks as a coach and ND was probably smart to get rid of him and dumb to hire him in the first place.

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

I enjoy watching his son curse on the sidelines. It's like seeing Charlie at age 13.

Neither of whom actually played the game but merely "jock sniffed" those who did.

 

[Oh8ch]

This guy is just an incredibly foul human being. I don't care if he's the best coach in the world or the worst, he's scum.

I wish folks would pay more attention to where they are posting.

This belongs in the RR thread.

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

I'm not buying that anymore. Willingham proved that he sucks as a coach and ND was probably smart to get rid of him and dumb to hire him in the first place.

Hindsight being 20-20 and all that. The counterargument is that TW had a better record than Davie, Faust or Fat Bastard after year #3, yet each of those was allowed to finish out his 5 year contract whereas Ty was whacked. Sorry, had the domer administration stuck a harpoon in the whale yesterday, I would say that race did not play a factor in Ty's demise. Seeing, however, that they let the foul-mouthed, alumni-alienating, pig of a human being finish out his 5 years despite a WORSE record than Ty Willingham (the man that they even admit did everything right off the field), speaks volumes.

I'm not one to see racism every time that it's accuse. This, however, is one of those times where I believe there to be a nasty fire beyond the smoke.

 

[martinss01]

According to Wojocieowski (or however you spell it) on ESPiN at lunch, the biggest reason they elected to retain fattie is that they were concerned with other schools "cherry picking" from Weis' stellar recruiting class that he's assembled for '09. As if that really matters....

According to Rivals, Weis' classes have ranked 40th in '05, 8th in '06, 8th in '07, 2nd in '08 and 10th in '09. Scout has them 27th, 5th, 11th, 2nd and 11th in those same 5 years.

Good recruiting classes haven't helped him significantly yet.

For comparison, over the same 5 years, OSU has ranked 12th, 12th, 15th, 4th and 2nd - accoring to Rivals and 7th, 13th, 16th, 4th and 1st according to Scout.

Maybe he really is a [censored]ty coach.....

while i would completely agree that his recruiting classes have been a little overrated, they certainly aren't chopped liver. the problem really is with fattie weis and its pretty apparent. he's an nfl coach, not a college coach. its really that simple.

last year was a perfect example of this fact. the qb center exchange. the most basic of plays in football at ANY level. how many botched snaps did they have last year again? opposing teams weren't faster physically. they weren't stronger or quicker or more agile. ntre ame blew coverages horribly, couldn't keep contain, took horrid pursuit angles, and the tackling as flat out vomit worthy. sure you can blame it on youth and inexperience. but most of the problems i saw were basic fundamentals. stuff these kids should have had drilled into them during pee wee ball.

even if their phenom recruits are actually ranked #40 rather than #10... thats still plenty good enough to walk all over half the teams on their schedule. so the problem isn't talent, the problem is fattie is treating these kids like first round draft picks with 3-4 years of college ball at an elite level under their belt. not 17/18yr olds fresh out of high school. super double ninja offensive strategies are great and all. but at this level you have to make sure the kids have the basics down solid before you move on to the west coast offense.

alot of these kids are huge talents. but many of them get by without proper technique because they are such physical freaks at the highschool level. unfortunately for them at this level talent alone simply isn't enough.

 

[Mike80]

I'm not buying that anymore. Willingham proved that he sucks as a coach and ND was probably smart to get rid of him and dumb to hire him in the first place.

I do sometimes wonder what would have happened if they had kept George O'Leary/O'Leary hadn't lied on his resume.

Somehow I don't think they would be in this position.

 

[BB73]

Hindsight being 20-20 and all that. The counterargument is that TW had a better record than Davie, Faust or Fat Bastard after year #3, yet each of those was allowed to finish out his 5 year contract whereas Ty was whacked. Sorry, had the domer administration stuck a harpoon in the whale yesterday, I would say that race did not play a factor in Ty's demise. Seeing, however, that they let the foul-mouthed, alumni-alienating, pig of a human being finish out his 5 years despite a WORSE record than Ty Willingham (the man that they even admit did everything right off the field), speaks volumes.

I'm not one to see racism every time that it's accuse. This, however, is one of those times where I believe there to be a nasty fire beyond the smoke.

Ty's 3-year record was in the middle of that group, not the best.

Weis was ahead of that group after 3 years; in the middle after 4. Of course, Lou Holtz won the NC in his third year.

Faust first 3 years - .544 (18-15-1)
Davie first 3 years - .568 (21-16)
Ty W first 3 years - .568 (21-16)
Weis first 3 years - .595 (22-15)

Faust first 4 years - .554 (25-20-1)
Davie first 4 years - .612 (30-19)
Weis first 4 years - .571 (28-21)
(toilet bowl pending)

Faust fired after 5 years - .535 (30-26-1)
Davie fired after 5 years - .583 (35-25)

I'd speculate that Charlie needs to win at least 8 games next year, plus win a bowl game either this year or next; or win at least 9 games next year if he doesn't get a bowl win, in order to keep the job.

 

[Sdgobucks]

Ty's 3-year record was in the middle of that group, not the best.

Weis was ahead of that group after 3 years; in the middle after 4. Of course, Lou Holtz won the NC in his third year.

Faust first 3 years - .544 (18-15-1)
Davie first 3 years - .568 (21-16)
Ty W first 3 years - .568 (21-16)
Weis first 3 years - .595 (22-15)

Faust first 4 years - .554 (25-20-1)
Davie first 4 years - .612 (30-19)
Weis first 4 years - .571 (28-21)
(toilet bowl pending)

Faust fired after 5 years - .535 (30-26-1)
Davie fired after 5 years - .583 (35-25)

I'd speculate that Charlie needs to win at least 8 games next year, plus win a bowl game either this year or next; or win at least 9 games next year if he doesn't get a bowl win, in order to keep the job.

He needs to do the impossible next year ... Win a BCS game.

 

[methomps]

ND is just wasting another year of their talent by dumping Weis. Clausen is a soph. Get a new coaching staff to develop him as a junior so he can shine as a senior. It worked with Brady Quinn and Carson Palmer. Instead, Clausen is going to have to learn a whole new system his senior year.

Edit: Oh, and:

http://www.ndnation.com/boards/showpost.php?b=football;pid=108990;d=all

ND will break its school record for most consecutive weeks
by ShermanOaksND (12/04/2008 20:37:04)​

unranked in the AP poll. The old record is 32 weeks, from October 30, 1961 to the preseason poll in 1964 -- and all of those polls only ranked the top 10, except the final poll in 1961 had a top 20. ND will tie its old record when the next AP poll comes out on Sunday, and break it when the final poll is released after the BCS championship game.

1962, 1963, 2007 and 2008 are the only four seasons in which ND has spent the entire season unranked, since the AP poll started in 1936.

 

[NFBuck]

1962, 1963, 2007 and 2008 are the only four seasons in which ND has spent the entire season unranked, since the AP poll started in 1936.

That says a lot considering some of the shit teams they've fielded.

 

[OregonBuckeye]

ND is just wasting another year of their talent by dumping Weis. Clausen is a soph. Get a new coaching staff to develop him as a junior so he can shine as a senior. It worked with Brady Quinn and Carson Palmer. Instead, Clausen is going to have to learn a whole new system his senior year.

Funny you use him as an example considering it was Weis that came in his junior year.

 

[daveeb]

ND is just wasting another year of their talent by dumping Weis. Clausen is a soph. Get a new coaching staff to develop him as a junior so he can shine as a senior. It worked with Brady Quinn and Carson Palmer. Instead, Clausen is going to have to learn a whole new system his senior year.

I'd be surprised if Dayne Crist didn't start to pressure Clausen and his starting spot, if Clausen continues to be as terrible as he was to end this season.

 

[Bucklion]

Hindsight being 20-20 and all that. The counterargument is that TW had a better record than Davie, Faust or Fat Bastard after year #3, yet each of those was allowed to finish out his 5 year contract whereas Ty was whacked. Sorry, had the domer administration stuck a harpoon in the whale yesterday, I would say that race did not play a factor in Ty's demise. Seeing, however, that they let the foul-mouthed, alumni-alienating, pig of a human being finish out his 5 years despite a WORSE record than Ty Willingham (the man that they even admit did everything right off the field), speaks volumes.

I'm not one to see racism every time that it's accuse. This, however, is one of those times where I believe there to be a nasty fire beyond the smoke.

+1

Just because Willingham sucked somewhere else AFTER they fired him, doesn't mean race wasn't a factor when they did.