Cam Newton (QB New England Patriots)

[Nutriaitch]

I love how the SEC is "one" when it's beneficial for a single program or their fans to mention it as such, but as soon as one of their "brothers" is accused of some sort of wrong doing the fingerpointing and "they deserve whatever they get" routine comes out en masse. Incredible.

if you're referring to my comment about me not crying if they get slammed, I suggest you look at my post history.

I am not your "typical" SEC fan

other than LSU, i do not wish for anything good to happen to any of them assholes.

I somewhat tolerate Vandy.
The rest can all geaux fuck themselves and jump off a cliff.

and Auburn has been at the very top of the shit list for a very long time.

 

[SloopyHangOn]

if you're referring to my comment about me not crying if they get slammed, I suggest you look at my post history.

I would've quoted you if I were specifically referring to your comments.

I'm just making a general observation based upon what you said.

 

[jwinslow]

I would've quoted you if I were referring to your comments.

And I'm getting pretty sick of this schtick. This isn't the first time you've lashed out and then tried to use this backpedal when it looked bad.

This is a discussion board. If you have a beef with a different discussion (either other message boards or real life), then call them out in THOSE discussions.

It was a pretty obvious implication that you were responding to Nutri given the nature of his post.

I'm just making a general observation based upon what you said.

Congratulations on ruining your own excuse.

You said it yourself, you were making an observation about SEC fans based on his post, hence, a reference to his comments.

 

[MaxBuck]

Then why is the church a central part of the scandal and investigation if that loophole exists?

You can't buy prospects. If all I took were a donation to a charity or church tied with the family, everyone would do that and never get in trouble.

Have the booster pay the church, and have someone at the church adopt the players expenses that year due to a broken or difficult home life.

Just to point out the possible loophole, I've taken a few choice quotes from the NCAA rules for D1 athletics. From Bylaw Article 12 on Amateurism:

12.1.2.4.4 Exception for Institutional Fundraising Activities Involving the Athletics Ability of Student-Athletes. Institutional, charitable or educational promotions or fundraising activities that involve the use of athletics ability by student-athletes to obtain funds (e.g., ?swim-a-thons?) are permitted
only if:
(a) All money derived from the activity or project go directly to the member institution, member conference or the charitable, educational or nonprofit agency; (Revised: 5/11/05)
(b) The student-athletes receive no compensation or prizes for their participation; ...

From Bylaw Article 13 on Recruiting:

13.2 oFFers AnD inDuCeMenTs
13.2.1 general regulation. An institution?s staff member or any representative of its athletics interests shall not be involved, directly or indirectly, in making arrangements for or giving or offering to give any financial aid or other benefits to a prospective student-athlete or his or her relatives or friends, other than expressly permitted by NCAA regulations. Receipt of a benefit by prospective a student-athlete or his or her relatives or friends is not a violation of NCAA legislation if it is determined that the same benefit is generally available to the institution?s prospective students or their relatives or friends or to a particular segment of the student body (e.g., international students, minority students) determined on a basis unrelated to athletics ability. (Revised: 10/28/97, 11/1/00, 3/24/05)
13.2.1.1 Specific Prohibitions. Specifically prohibited financial aid, benefits and arrangements include, but are not limited to, the following:
(a) An employment arrangement for a prospective student-athlete?s relatives;
(b) Gift of clothing or equipment;
(c) Cosigning of loans;
(d) Providing loans to a prospective student-athlete?s relatives or friends;
(e) Cash or like items;
(f) Any tangible items, including merchandise;
(g) Free or reduced-cost services, rentals or purchases of any type;
(h) Free or reduced-cost housing;
(i) Use of an institution?s athletics equipment (e.g., for a high school all-star game);
(j) Sponsorship of or arrangement for an awards banquet for high school, preparatory school or two-year-college athletes by an institution, representatives of its athletics interests or its alumni groups or booster clubs; and
(k) Expenses for academic services (e.g., tutoring, test preparation) to assist in the completion of initial-eligibility or transfer-eligibility requirements or improvement of the prospective student-athlete?s academic profile in conjunction with a waiver request. (Adopted: 4/23/08)

Again, maybe a loophole, but I see nothing in here regarding payments to a recognized charitable institution such as a church. Does that make it right? Of course not, but I don't see it as a slam-dunk violation either.

 

[jwinslow]

Good research, I'll do some digging myself. I know they use indirect donations or benefits to muddy the waters, but I thought that was to make it less traceable, not legal.

 

[MaxBuck]

Just as an aside, how likely is it that an exceptional Catholic player's local parish might benefit if the athlete elects to attend Notre Dame rather than, say, Ohio State? Not sure how anyone could really trace this sort of thing, but also not sure how fundamentally different such a thing would be from what Newton's father's church has (allegedly) done.

Just wondering ...

 

[jwinslow]

Now for some random stuff:

http://sixpackspeak.yuku.com/topic/54130/t/Auburn-s-donation-to-Cam-Newton-s-father-s-church.html

FWIW I have seen the facebook page of some one of his former teammates discussing what Cecil got- I went back the next day to see what had been added and the entire page had disappeared. Out of curiosity, I checked a few weeks back when we played Auburn and the page was back up, but the 2 posts discussing the $200k had been deleted- HOWEVER... I copied the original thread because frankly, I could not believe they were discussing it and here are the two "deleted posts"... (Yes, I removed the name of the player who owned the page)...


Tim ****
Naw, Karl. Cam ain't goin' to Miss. State. From what I hear, Auburn spent around $200,000 to get Newton. Cecil is set for life!!!
January 5 at 1:35am


Tim****
Auburn straight up made it rain on Cam Newton - an Cecil Newton is already scoping out a new ride!!!!
January 5 at 1:39am

 

[jwinslow]

Even if the church donation is shady but legal, it would seem like the contact with the agent (particularly to get $$$) would be enough of a violation, wouldn't it?

Just as an aside, how likely is it that an exceptional Catholic player's local parish might benefit if the athlete elects to attend Notre Dame rather than, say, Ohio State? Not sure how anyone could really trace this sort of thing, but also not sure how fundamentally different such a thing would be from what Newton's father's church has (allegedly) done.

Just wondering ...

A good question indeed.

 

[jwinslow]

A bit more random rival board commentary:


http://forums.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=14&f=1016&t=6646144&p=2

Whether or not Auburn was involved in him being shopped around is immaterial. What matters is whether or not Cam and his family gave verbal consent for his services to be shopped.If that can be proven, then Auburn will have been found guilty of playing an ineligible player, and will be forced to vacate the wins he played in... even if Auburn had no knowledge of his backdoor dealings.The fact that he is still playing in spite of Auburn being aware of these charges for a while either suggests they don't believe there's anything to the story, or they're willing to take a calculated risk with the hope that nothing turns up.For Auburn's sake, they better have launched a very thorough and exhaustive investigation into these charges. If not, they could end up like Oklahoma did a few years ago when they closed an investigation regarding Bomar and Quinn, only to have the NCAA re-open it and find the violations literally hiding in plain sight.

As I understand the agent contact rule, IF an underclassmen--which is what Cam is---has contact with an agent or his family had contact with an agent it MUST be reported-----depending on the length of contact it could go from no punishment to being ruled ineligible. At this juncture, Cam "COULD" be ruled ineligible meaning ALL games he has participated in TO THIS POINT will have to be forfeited and then Cam would have to serve whatever suspension the NCAA deems appropriate---probably the final three games.

All of this is contingent upon the NCAA actually working in a timely manner, which they won't and Herby is right...Cam will declare for the NFL about 1.25 minutes after the bowl game and be gone and will never have to worry about the shambles he's left the barn program in.

http://www.shaggybevo.com/board/sho...ng-about-Cam-Newton-and-NCAA-Violations/page7

haha - remember when tubberville was let go and auburn assistant coaches' wives were calling local call in shows? i remember. i distinctly remember it, and her accusations that tubberville was fired because he wouldn't pay players, and that was the only way to beat saban, because saban was paying players too. that was awesome. i can't find the recording, but i remember the tang in amy enzminger calling in and just throwing bombs:

http://sportsbybrooks.com/auburn-lea...-and-dry-21226

Amy’s call was exactly what you would expect from someone who had just found out her husband was fired under such circumstances, if not (a little) more cordial. There was no stream of F-bombs, S-bombs, or Z-bombs, just righteous indignation. “This is how Auburn runs things,” she says, right before avowing that “nobody will beat Nick Saban in this state” unless Auburn hires someone to “shake hands and put a couple hundred dollars in a recruit’s pockets like they did in the past,” a not-so-subtle nod to Terry Bowden. “And they’re looking for someone to buy players.” Yes, all this came out of a coach’s wife’s mouth. In the span of about 20 seconds.

http://deadspin.com/5101925/do-not-m...rn-coachs-wife

yeah, i remember that. that was pretty funny back then. i wonder if they hired a coach of the ilk she was indicating?

 

[SloopyHangOn]

And I'm getting pretty sick of this schtick. This isn't the first time you've lashed out and then tried to use this backpedal when it looked bad.

This isn't the first time you've gone out of your way to make an incorrect assumption on something I've said either, I'm getting pretty tired of that myself.

This is a discussion board. If you have a beef with a different discussion (either other message boards or real life), then call them out in THOSE discussions.

Naturally, I do. Forgive me for bringing up conversations that don't spawn from this board from time to time. I wasn't aware that personal experiences are disallowed.

It was a pretty obvious implication that you were responding to Nutri given the nature of his post.

Pretty obvious because I straight up said I was. Good call, Sherlock.

Congratulations on ruining your own excuse.

Thanks!

You said it yourself, you were making an observation about SEC fans based on his post, hence, a reference to his comments.

Oh. Oh, I get it. You just like to play semantic and argue. That's fair. I bit, you win.






Point still stands, as Nutri said himself:

"Typical" SEC fans react this way. I respect those fans of SEC programs that legitimately despise/respect the rest of their conference. That takes balls to swim upstream in such a way. It's just ridiculous how the hivemind of the SEC works at times.

 

[Nutriaitch]

I would've quoted you if I were specifically referring to your comments.

I'm just making a general observation based upon what you said.

i actually agree with your observation.

I hear members of our fanbase like "well, if we can't win the BCS title this year, I hope y'all do." when talking to an fan of whatever SEC school is in the best position to win it.

EFF THAT!

the last thing I want is the coach of another SEC school flashing that Crystal Football at a recruit we're going after. Saying shit like "Look what we got last year. We are obviously better than them guys."

of course because I have no morales, when an SEC team does win the title, I will use that as evidence that we're the greatest conference in the history of the universe

 

[SloopyHangOn]

Even if the church donation is shady but legal, it would seem like the contact with the agent (particularly to get $$$) would be enough of a violation, wouldn't it?

I think it would. I have a hard time believing that there aren't stipulations in all of these bylaws that specifically mention things like that.

I'm sure the NCAA has been witness to ALL kinds of ridiculous attempts at workarounds.

 

[SloopyHangOn]

of course because I have no morales, when an SEC team does win the title, I will use that as evidence that we're the greatest conference in the history of the universe

You must spread some reputations around before giving it to Nutriaitch again.

 

[jwinslow]

This isn't the first time you've gone out of your way to make an incorrect assumption on something I've said either, I'm getting pretty tired of that myself.

Both times others got the same impression from your post. It's your responsibility to communicate yourself properly, whether that is with a qualification or separation from the poster you were referencing.

Naturally, I do. Forgive me for bringing up conversations that don't spawn from this board from time to time. I wasn't aware that personal experiences are disallowed.

Your sloppy callouts continue to haphazardly callout our posters. If you have a beef with them, try addressing or quoting them instead. I see what you meant, but it didn't come across that way to Nutri (who I think was the subject of the last time also).

Pretty obvious because I straight up said I was. Good call, Sherlock.

No, you said you weren't referencing his post, and then turned right around and said you were.

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

Jeezus. Laundering payola to a recruit via donations to his father's church. If the SEC would put half the effort towards their actual academics as they put into cheating in football, they'd corner the market on Nobel Prizes every frickin' year.