2015-16 Ohio State Quarterback Discussion

[pnuts34]

I don't see how he wouldn't be 3rd. There's a QB coming off of a NC run, and another QB who ran the offense more efficiently than any QB we've had since Troy Smith. And even if healthy does that mean his decision making us better and he's learned to look through his progressions, and not just run after the first option is closed?

Wow. Distant 3rd. If healthy, which I'll grant, is a big IF, he's not 3rd. No way.

 

[kippy1040]

I THINK THAT TOM HERMAN HAD MUCH TO DO WITH OUR SUCESS AGAINST WISCONSIN, ALABAMA AND OREGON. WHEN J.T. WENT DOWN IN THE MICHIGAN GAME, I SUPPOSE ALOT OF US WERE BEGINNING TO QUESTION WHETHER WE HAD A CHANCE AGAINST WISCONSIN.

LIKE URBAN SAID "WE HAD TO WATER DOWN THE PLAYBOOK WHEN JT WENT DOWN" NOT TAKING AWAY FROM CARDALE AND HIS GREAT PLAY DURING THE RUN TO THE "NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP, BUT FOR SOME REASON I THINK COACH HERMAN SHOULD BE GIVEN A LOT OF KUDDO'S FOR THE WAY HE PREPARED FOR CARDALE TO PERFORM THE WAY HE DID. NOW WITH HERMAND GONE, THE HEAD COACH AND ED WARRINER HAVE A LOT PLANS ON THIER TABLE TO FIGURE OUT WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN. THIS SHOULD BE INTERESTING TO FOLLOW.

 

[Hstead]

Not to mention that JT and Cardale had a better receiving corps as well. There was a reason Braxton was two time BIG10 POY. And it wasn't just because he could run the football.

 

[HilmerJ]

philly brown might have been the best reciver of the bunch...
braxton had carlos hyde too...devin smith was still catchin deep balls...
he was protected by linsley mewhort norwell ect.

they all had nfl talent...with braxton i think stil think we get to the playoffs...can he make the throws to win the games?...i know cardale can

 

[pnuts34]

Not to mention that JT and Cardale had a better receiving corps as well. There was a reason Braxton was two time BIG10 POY. And it wasn't just because he could run the football.

Devin, Evan and Mike vs Philly, Devin and Evan...
Braxton didn't have chop liver, I can't truly believe he had bad WRs, not to mention he may have had a better O line than JT and Cardale, which is even more important, and he still couldn't crack 200yds passing against Illinois. JT and Cardale had An O line that needed to gel and get better. Braxton was a 2 time B1G POY mostly because he could run. His overall stats were always given, not just his passing, because his passing still left a lot to be desired. That was then, maybe he has worked on that since then, but idk how since he hasn't been able to throw which would put him at a distant 3rd behind the other 2 who have had a seasons worth of game reps for Barrett and 3 of the most important games of the year for Jones, and both put up better stats than Miller

 

[jlb1705]

Devin, Evan and Mike vs Philly, Devin and Evan...
Braxton didn't have chop liver, I can't truly believe he had bad WRs, not to mention he may have had a better O line than JT and Cardale, which is even more important, and he still couldn't crack 200yds passing against Illinois. JT and Cardale had An O line that needed to gel and get better. Braxton was a 2 time B1G POY mostly because he could run. His overall stats were always given, not just his passing, because his passing still left a lot to be desired. That was then, maybe he has worked on that since then, but idk how since he hasn't been able to throw which would put him at a distant 3rd behind the other 2 who have had a seasons worth of game reps for Barrett and 3 of the most important games of the year for Jones, and both put up better stats than Miller

Listing 2013 names vs. 2014 doesn't tell the whole story. That unit had problems with drops, didn't get separation as much as they should have, and lacked big play production outside of Devin Smith fly routes. The change didn't come because the quarterback changed. The wide receivers were dropping balls and holding the team back even in early 2014, notably against Virginia Tech. They grew up between that game and the Penn State game, turning into the unit that you now take for granted when you simply list their names and assume they were always productive players. Hell, Mike Thomas was redshirted as a sophomore in 2013 because he was so unprepared to contribute - he didn't become productive all of a sudden because the QB was different. He admitted himself that he had to pull his head out of his rear end and buy into the program.

Anybody who thinks Braxton Miller's passing stats are clearly inferior must be ignorant of what they really are. If you take the time to compare Miller's 2013 statistics with Barrett and Jones' 2014 stats, you'll see that the three each posted a virtually identical TD:INT ratio. Miller's completion percentage sits comfortably between Barrett's and Jones'. The only non-counting statistic where Miller is clearly behind the other two is yards per attempt. He's hardly the clear dog-meat, third-best passer that he's made out to be on here.

 

[Dryden]

Miller's completion percentage sits comfortably between Barrett's and Jones'. The only non-counting statistic where Miller is clearly behind the other two is yards per attempt. He's hardly the clear dog-meat, third-best passer that he's made out to be on here.

Yup. Rewatch the Wisconsin or Penn State games in 2013. Braxton can make every throw and has a cannon for an arm.

If Braxton is 100%, he's the starter. I just don't think he will ever be 100% after two surgeries.

 

[redguard117]

I'm just going off the "eye test", but to me Braxton has never really been an impressive passer. He has an arm and he "can" make all the throws, but to my (admittedly untrained) eyes he just holds on too long or can't get it there both accurately and with anticipation. My standard for OSU qb play has and probably always will be Troy Smith - based on the "eye test", Barrett and Cardale get a lot closer than Braxton to that standard.

 

[pnuts34]

Wow, you certainly blew that WR listing out of proportion. Yes there are other factors, but it is also very realistic that WRs become better(or worse) with a QB. Happens all the time, Eric Decker going from Peyton Manning to Geno smith, Greg Jennings from Aaron Rodgers to Matt cassell , etc. Our WRs certainly grew up, Idk where I said they didnt, but his O line also made a big difference, which I did state. And anyone who thinks that's after the year we had at the QB position, that Braxtons previous play will garner a starting position is being ignorant. He is behind Barrett in terms of reading defenses and going through progressions. And he hasn't shown much touch in throwing, can he make all the throws? Yes. Does he? Not at all. And I cab bet NFL scouts have told him as much, and he's the least likely to be an NFL QB. Hes still an athlete playing QB. The MSU and Clemson games alone show that. It says a lot when people were saying the offense ran more efficiently under Guiton than Braxton in his few reps. The offense for 2014 was a machine, Braxton didn't have that offense looking nearly as dangerous, our offense lived and died on his and Carlos' legs, in 2014 so many more weapons were used because we had a QB that could get the ball to those weapons consistently instead of relying on himself

It also must be factored in, regardless of what any of us think about what Braxton did in 2013 or how our QBs worked in 2014, Braxton is still coming off of 2 shoulder surgeries and won't be throwing for a few more months for real. And it remains to be seen how his arm has progressed since

Listing 2013 names vs. 2014 doesn't tell the whole story. That unit had problems with drops, didn't get separation as much as they should have, and lacked big play production outside of Devin Smith fly routes. The change didn't come because the quarterback changed. The wide receivers were dropping balls and holding the team back even in early 2014, notably against Virginia Tech. They grew up between that game and the Penn State game, turning into the unit that you now take for granted when you simply list their names and assume they were always productive players. Hell, Mike Thomas was redshirted as a sophomore in 2013 because he was so unprepared to contribute - he didn't become productive all of a sudden because the QB was different. He admitted himself that he had to pull his head out of his rear end and buy into the program.

Anybody who thinks Braxton Miller's passing stats are clearly inferior must be ignorant of what they really are. If you take the time to compare Miller's 2013 statistics with Barrett and Jones' 2014 stats, you'll see that the three each posted a virtually identical TD:INT ratio. Miller's completion percentage sits comfortably between Barrett's and Jones'. The only non-counting statistic where Miller is clearly behind the other two is yards per attempt. He's hardly the clear dog-meat, third-best passer that he's made out to be on here.

 

[pnuts34]

Rewatch the Illinois game through the rest of the 2013 season and he didn't make nearly every throw and relied heavily on his legs. Than watch OSU vs IU, UI, MSU and scUM and see how much better our offense ran...

Yup. Rewatch the Wisconsin or Penn State games in 2013. Braxton can make every throw and has a cannon for an arm.

If Braxton is 100%, he's the starter. I just don't think he will ever be 100% after two surgeries.

 

[MaxBuck]

Braxton Miller's arm strength has never been the issue. But it may be now; we'll just have to see.

 

[RB07OSU]

Being able to make every throw and actually making every throw with consistency are two different things. I personally do not care much about the stats at all. I just watch JT and his awareness and intangibles are far superior to Braxton. Our offense runs much more efficiently with him at the helm. And Cardale has a lot to work with as well, he is as talented as anyone in the country. The big difference in my books for what Braxton had versus JT/Cardale is Jalin, Dontre, and an effective Thomas. I think at the end of the day, involving Braxton in the JT/Cardale debate will be moot...I just don't see him being able to come back at 100%. If he comes back at anything less than 100%, he will not win the QB derby.

 

[Bucknut24]

Being able to make every throw and actually making every throw with consistency are two different things. I personally do not care much about the stats at all. I just watch JT and his awareness and intangibles are far superior to Braxton. Our offense runs much more efficiently with him at the helm. And Cardale has a lot to work with as well, he is as talented as anyone in the country. The big difference in my books for what Braxton had versus JT/Cardale is Jalin, Dontre, and an effective Thomas. I think at the end of the day, involving Braxton in the JT/Cardale debate will be moot...I just don't see him being able to come back at 100%. If he comes back at anything less than 100%, he will not win the QB derby.

I haven't read many posts in this thread but I would think most people would be in an agreement that the only way Braxton is starter, is if he's 100%

 

[bukIpower]

Being able to make every throw and actually making every throw with consistency are two different things. I personally do not care much about the stats at all. I just watch JT and his awareness and intangibles are far superior to Braxton. Our offense runs much more efficiently with him at the helm. And Cardale has a lot to work with as well, he is as talented as anyone in the country. The big difference in my books for what Braxton had versus JT/Cardale is Jalin, Dontre, and an effective Thomas. I think at the end of the day, involving Braxton in the JT/Cardale debate will be moot...I just don't see him being able to come back at 100%. If he comes back at anything less than 100%, he will not win the QB derby.

I agree this is where I'm at as well. He may come back at 100% sometime in the year but IMO you don't throw a QB who's taken zero reps for 2 years and have him starting game one. By that point you also cannot afford to mess with chemistry by putting him in mid season so by process of elimination I feel that Braxton is going to be our gadget player with a strong focus on showing well at his pro day next spring. He has a gift with the ball in his hands and I like to think Urban knows this better than anyone.

Braxton will certainly play, and heck he might even throw the ball a bit this year but he will not be throwing the ball 20 times a game I can tell you that much. Unless Braxton is ready from the start of fall camp and is showing zero signs of regression (I'd imagine they'll once again work him along slowly) then I just don't know how we put him as starter at Va Tech

 

[TDunk]