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GoodLifeSean
Proud to be born in the best state in the Union!
No like against App State, they aren't regional.Tresselbeliever;1357403; said:
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BrutusBobcat
Icon and Entertainer
HailToMichigan;1356972; said:
In all seriousness, what are some things you point to as signs of progress? Beyond any arguments of what RR did at some other school, what's he done this year at Michigan that gives you reason to think that you'll even be back up to the level of a "regional power", never mind "national power", anytime soon? Do you see improvement in any phase of the game?
RR was supposed to bring an upgrade in strength and conditioning and team discipline over the "fat, lazy and too easygoing" Carr days. I don't see that on the field at all. I also don't see how players yelling at coaches shows any sort of team discipline, and I certainly don't recall that ever happening under Lloyd's watch. I also don't see any upgrade in recruiting.
The main argument you guys seem to be making with each other is that RR had a bad first season everywhere he went until his team "learned the system" and he "got his guys". Is that it? Is that all you have? You're waiting around for him to turn Shavodrick Beaver into Pat White?
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BuckeyeBill
All-American
BrutusBobcat;1357675; said:
While I think much of the criticism of RR goes over the top at times, these are fair (and tough) questions. I would be surprised if UM doesn't show some improvement next year, but I'm curious what gives their fans such optimism.
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HailToMichigan
Maize and Blue Wahoo
Obviously not. At least not from year to year. From beginning to end of this season? Absolutely. But in any case, it's the height of foolishness to take the results of one year and assume it will continue that way for all time.BrutusBobcat;1357675; said:
I do. It's why Ryan Mallett wasn't in Carr's good graces all year. Voices were not raised except by Carr, but still.
Don't you?
Going by Rivals' list, there are 13 four-stars or above (in this case, no five stars yet) in the class, and Will Campbell will probably be back, making it 14. Since 2002 when Rivals first started keeping track, there have been a couple other Michigan classes with that many, but never any more than 13 - the lone exception being last year, with 17, five of which RR was directly responsible for and a couple more that he had to recruit so as not to decommit. And this is only his first-and-a-half recruiting season at Michigan. I could be argued down to believing there isn't really any up-or-down difference, but I think recruiting has gone very well. And anyone who tries to claim he's done worse is just nuts.
You say that like you're incredulous it could ever happen. But Pat White was a meh-rated three-star guy, two stars if you prefer Scout. Beaver and Forcier are probably the most talented QBs coming out of high school that RR's ever coached.
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generaladm
Legend
HailToMichigan;1357879; said:
So, you remember players yelling at coaches during Carr's tenure, but Carr was the only one yelling? That makes no sense. Every coach yells at their players, it's part of their job. But, to see a player screaming in the face of a coach is something you rarely see, even at the professional level. Even if you claim that there were player/coach altercations behind closed doors, I can't recall that sort of public fracas at UM before. The only times I can remember a similar scene in a college game, it was indicative of a team that was not under the control of it's coach (Holtz at USC, Coker at Miami, Smith at MSU, etc.).
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generaladm
Legend
osugrad21;1357893; said:
Now that you mention it, I think there may have been more than one incident involving Clarett. We all know the story behind that.
I thought we were supposed to be on the same side.
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