2008 tOSU Defense discussion (official thread)

[Bleed S & G]

More man, less zone. You have the talent, but you need the courage to let them do it.

Sure, you will get burned a time or two, but the freedom and flexibility it affords the d-coordinator to attack the offense with extra personnel is priceless.

Agreed. I'm tired of 'bend but don't break' and want to see the silver bullets.

 

[xcrunner]

Maybe we should wait until we actually see the '08 secondary before jumping to conclusions.

Last year, Jenkins was a junior, Russell a sophomore coming off a serious injury, Coleman a 1st year starter and sophomore, and Washington a 1st year starter and sophomore. Plus, you have guys like Chekwa, Clifford, O'Neal, and Scott who saw time last year too. Isn't the most improvement usually made from year 1 to year 2? Now, I don't want to give you the idea I expect them to be as good as the '98 secondary because that's asking a lot but I don't think there will be as wide of a gap between them as you seem to suggest.

EDIT- Our secondary will be so deep I even forgot to mention Amos who was pushing for some serious time before getting injured. Pentello and Evege are the wildcards.

And if Clifford gets out of Tressel's doghouse.. He is a serious athlete. One of the best on the team IMO.

 

[MUBuck]

Maybe we should wait until we actually see the '08 secondary before jumping to conclusions. Last year, Jenkins was a junior, Russell a sophomore coming off a serious injury, Coleman a 1st year starter and sophomore, and Washington a 1st year starter and sophomore. Plus, you have guys like Chekwa, Clifford, O'Neal, and Scott who saw time last year too. Isn't the most improvement usually made from year 1 to year 2? Now, I don't want to give you the idea I expect them to be as good as the '98 secondary because that's asking a lot but I don't think there will be as wide of a gap between them as you seem to suggest.

EDIT- Our secondary will be so deep I even forgot to mention Amos who was pushing for some serious time before getting injured. Pentello and Evege are the wildcards.

Beat me to it. Not saying that we will have 3 future 1st round CBs, but you know Jenkins will be one barring injury (knock on wood), Washington has the potential to be a first day pick for sure, and who knows how much improvement Clifford will make this off-season.

Jax, I'm not saying MJ is one of the greatest corners at OSU by any means, but I think he deserves a little more credit than a nice solid player. Antonio Smith was a nice solid player.

 

[Kickdown02]

I don't understand how people underate Michael so much. Dude is an All American, is a top 10-15 pick in '09. Plus, he's only 20 years old! He's going to be one of those players that won't get full recognition until his backups are fighting for his open spot.

 

[Sportsbuck28]

I don't understand how people underate Michael so much. Dude is an All American, is a top 10-15 pick in '09. Plus, he's only 20 years old! He's going to be one of those players that won't get full recognition until his backups are fighting for his open spot.

Uh, it's Malcolm.

Michael was the receiver that from our 02 title run..

 

[Taosman]

I'm just not sure why he(Jenkins) was played at safety so much?
Did the coaches just not have enough faith in Coleman?

 

[Kickdown02]

Uh, it's Malcolm.

Michael was the receiver that from our 02 title run..

Meant Malcolm. Sorry, message board policeman.

 

[Bestbuck36]

I'm just not sure why he(Jenkins) was played at safety so much?
Did the coaches just not have enough faith in Coleman?

That Nickel and zone look we've become so attached to recently. Put me in the group who wants to see 11 Silver bullets out there attacking every play. I prefer the attack style defenses. Take your shots on a play by play basis. Once in a while the other team will guess right and get you for a big play but more often than not, with the athletes that we have on defense, we'll get the turnovers and big plays by dictating to the offense. Mix in the zone on occasion and when the down and distance calls for it, but make the opponent fear the defense when they play Ohio State.

 

[Gatorubet]

EDIT- Our secondary will be so deep I even forgot to mention Amos who was pushing for some serious time before getting injured. Pentello and Evege are the wildcards.

And if they are playing five yards off receivers in zone coverage you will get dinked and dunked to death by a mobile qb with a quick release.

I watch your talent pool every year, and every year I think that the slightly conservative nature of your offense and defense is holding you back from even bigger things. I would love to see you guys open it up more.

Then again, hard not to give it to Beanie twenty times up the gut. Great problem to have.

 

[billmac91]

And if they are playing five yards off receivers in zone coverage you will get dinked and dunked to death by a mobile qb with a quick release.

I watch your talent pool every year, and every year I think that the slightly conservative nature of your offense and defense is holding you back from even bigger things. I would love to see you guys open it up more.

Then again, hard not to give it to Beanie twenty times up the gut. Great problem to have.

100% accurate. A secondary of Chris McCalister, Antonio Cromartie, Ed Reed, and Brian Dawkins would get dinked and dunked in our system. It's scheme not the players at this point in time. It's time to let the big dogs eat.

 

[Sportsbuck28]

Meant Malcolm. Sorry, message board policeman.

Take it easy there, not trying to police at all, but there's a good sized difference between Malcolm Jenkins and Michael Jenkins when it comes to tOSU football.

 

[Muck]

Wow, now Katzenmoyer is lauded for his ability to shed blockers?

What a difference a decade makes. :frown2:

 

[CookyPuss]

100% accurate. A secondary of Chris McCalister, Antonio Cromartie, Ed Reed, and Brian Dawkins would get dinked and dunked in our system. It's scheme not the players at this point in time. It's time to let the big dogs eat.

While I think there is some truth to that, I think it all starts up front. That system depends on getting pressure on the QB from the line or via the blitz. I think the biggest problem is that they don't change up their schemes very well sometimes. In the game against UF, my was recognizing the soft spots in the zone. If my mom can figure out the D, than you need to mix it up a bit. I think it is a fine base D, but they need to man up a little more often, disguise the coverage a little better, and jam guys at the line more... and of course, get more pressure on the QB with the DTs especially.

 

[bukIpower]

The coaches will never change or become a more man defense so it don't really matter how much I or some of us complain about the soft zone bull shit. Seriously we have the talent that everyone else has and its not a matter of the south having better athletes than ours, but its a matter of the SEC coaches let their skilled players take chances. If the coaches want to play conservative all season long fine, great, we'll probably win all of our games anyways. However, if we get to the NCG again we better see some change if we want to win that game. Like Gator said and I said previously WHO CARES if we get beat deep every so often? I'd rather take the risk of getting beat a few times a year than to play soft. I'm with most of you who want to see the silver bullets back. IMO, the defense did a good job at swarming this year, but we're just not disrupting enough things with blitzes and the sort. Instead of swarm tackling 2 yards past the ball we could be making those plays 2 yards BEHIND the ball.

Also like the guy above me said we DEFINATLY need to disguise things more often! When we blitz you know when and where its coming from. What I'd like to see more often is to see 7/8 guys right up near the ball all faking like they're going to blitz. They all might come on a blitz or we might only rush the 4 lineman and drop the other 3/4 guys. Thats the beauty of doing that once in a while because you don't know where the blitz in that sort of defense is coming from. LSU did that to us in the NCG and I rememeber thinking of fuck Todd's going to get crushed here... LSU ended up only rushing 5 but got great pressure on Todd. They didn't get the sack, but they did get a hurry and did disrupt that play of ours we had called

 

[CausticMick]

Not sure if this has been mentioned, but obviously one of the "great" teams we'll face in '08 is USC. This is a team who lost their starting TE (Davis) as well as both OTs (Baker and Radovich), as well as a starting QB (Booty). Considering how early we play them, and their schedule which includes only one game (@ Virginia) prior to the OSU match-up, I like our chances from that side of the ball with the D we have returning. VG left for a reason- his stock is very high (school record in sacks) as well as a deep corps which could see a lot of rotation at DE in 2008 (thus possibly slightly reducing his playing time). I know VG was a guy you don't take off the field often but you have to consider the prospect the coaches look at- a solid, tired VG on a long drive or some rotation that wears down the O-Line of the opposition over the course of a game. The leap from a junior to senior provides mental and physical maturity throughout a season that cannot be substituted with any talent- but we have talent too.

Again, I like our chances and love this D we have coming back.