2007 Preseason and Regular season Polls

[Jaxbuck]

The only way to stop this talk is to walk the talk on the field. Our offense was exposed yesterday in two minutes of the third quarter and it was not lost on the public or our opponents that we were outscored 17-0 to end the game yesterday.

I think some folks here should reconsider this "world is out to get us" talk.

A look at the computer ratings is a rather sobering experience this week. Not one of the teams we played is any longer listed in the top 25 in the Sagarin's. The Big Ten dropped to 6th place behind the ACC now. TSUN and Minnesota have both lost to !-AA teams. Computers don't have bias. They don't have agendas against us.

If you look at past years, posters here have argued quite passionately that it is unfair to rank teams that play easy schedules higher than those who play tough games, week in and week out. Well, it is a simple fact that the Big Ten has really fallen badly this year. People here would be reacting very differently to the rankings if we were LSU and they were us.

The Buckeyes need to win out and they need to avoid the kind of finishes we saw yesterday.

Agree with all that but just a quick comment regarding the other side of the coin.

The 2 most dominant teams of the 90's (FSU and Nebraska) both played in very, very weak conferences and I don't recall the national outrage over it then. All I remember is endless fellating of those teams and their uncanny ability to always be a NC contender.

So what would the pundits comeback be for that? "Well they took care of business in the NC games" is my guess. Bad news is, nothing could be farther from the truth.

-FSU lost the NC game in '96,'98 and '00 with the '96 loss being 56-20.
-Nebraska always took care of business but somehow their run of dominance corresponded to OU's fall due to probabtion and, amazingly enough, ended once OU became good again.

Also Miami's Big East competition was who? How good was the Pac 10 from '03 to '05 when USC was on a run?

Some very close parallels to OSU's situation in '06 and '07 but now that its OSU and not FSU/Miami/Nebraska or USC we get crucified in the national media.

There is nothing I want more this year, if we make it to NO, than for our opponent to be LSU.

 

[Best Buckeye]

In my opinion, after watch I saw yesterday, if the Buckeyes can pull it all together, and better yet, if we faced better opponents than we have, we would be the #1 team in the nation based on talent. We have a great tailback that is the center of gravity on offense, with a steady (most of the time) QB under center, and some great playmakers on the outside. And we also got the best defense in the nation.

But honestly, yesterday's LSU-Auburn game just adds to the question: how can we objectively compare two teams with very different schedules? The LSU game last night was just like the Florida-Auburn game last season, those games are common in the SEC every season. And we can't be saying that Florida lost to an overrated Auburn team last year too, can we?

If I really had to vote, I vote OSU slightly ahead of LSU for talent, but I'd vote LSU way ahead of OSU in terms of being battle tested. Whether that would make a difference in Jan., I don't know. But that's just how I see it now.

Who votes on talent as the deciding factor? JMO it is wins and losses and maybe program rep, If the NC were based on talent then Coop should have 4 or 5 NC's

 

[WaitingforKickoff]

Who votes on talent as the deciding factor? JMO it is wins and losses and maybe program rep, If the NC were based on talent then Coop should have 4 or 5 NC's

Read my statement. It basically means that if my vote was decided on talent, it would go to OSU, meaning that I think OSU has more talent. But if my votes was based on battled preparedness, meaning when faced with an equal or superior opponent, who would be more mentally prepared, my vote would go to LSU.

OSU #1, LSU #2, that's who I think should play in the NC game based on talent and merit.

BTW, I'm really impressed by how our players have come out and responded to this. I did a little digging into our reactions after last season's game at Illinois, and the mentality can basically be summarized by this line "Jim Tressel did allow that there are some concerns over and above the normal."

Article

While I really didn't find anything out of place with what Tressel said, I did find it confusing that our teams captains labeled the game as a positive thing, a "learning experience" that "we needed". Looking back on it, it's not only a sign that we were making excuses for ourselves for the poor performance, but the statement itself contained a sense of complacency, as in "like every team that's going to win the national title, we needed a little bump or two on the road to keep us humble." That's why I love the fact that this year, the players, especially Kirk Barton, are not only discontent, but flat out pissed about our mental lapse. This is a guy that went through last season, saw what happened and what kind of attitudes need to be changed, and is coming out and expressing those attitudes. So to me, what's important is that we showed championship hunger afterwards and that we have hungry players leading the team.

 

[Waller]

Computers don't have bias.

That is the funniest line I have read all day. Of course they don't have bias, they are programmed by other non-biased computers, and numbers never lie, and the tooth fairy is coming by later tonight.

 

[Waller]

The Buckeyes need to win out and they need to avoid the kind of finishes we saw yesterday.

The funniest until I read this one. Again, I don't care if we blow 50 point leads, get taken to triple OTs in every game, don't score another offensive point, as long as we win, we are in. Repeat it 10 times.

 

[Jaxbuck]

That is the funniest line I have read all day. Of course they don't have bias, they are programmed by other non-biased computers, and numbers never lie, and the tooth fairy is coming by later tonight.

The funniest until I read this one. Again, I don't care if we blow 50 point leads, get taken to triple OTs in every game, don't score another offensive point, as long as we win, we are in. Repeat it 10 times.

Might I suggest a civil explination of why you disagree rather than attacking other posters?

As for the second point you made thats not 100% accurate. If we win ugly the national perception of OSU could very well lead to the pollsters dropping us from 1 to 2(or worse depending on how bad it was) and in that case we'd be in peril of being jumped in the BCS.

 

[Waller]

Might I suggest a civil explination of why you disagree rather than attacking other posters?

As for the second point you made thats not 100% accurate. If we win ugly the national perception of OSU could very well lead to the pollsters dropping us from 1 to 2(or worse depending on how bad it was) and in that case we'd be in peril of being jumped in the BCS.

I wasn't attacking him, I was dismissing his comment. Of course computer programs have bias. They are designed by humans. The criteria of evaluation is determined by humans. You know, GIGO.

The pollsters still have a very, very hard time dropping a team because of a bad win. Oklahoma barely beat one of the worst teams in the nation, and they...stayed exactly where they were. Since I don't think any of the unbeaten contenders will remain unbeaten, we don't need style points. Simply running the rest of a tough schedule is sufficient. Now, I would love to beat everyone 38-0, and I want the team to continue to improve, but the performance against MSU, or any others like it, will not affect our chances to get to NO. If that is the question, then if we win, we will be going.

 

[billmac91]

Read my statement. It basically means that if my vote was decided on talent, it would go to OSU, meaning that I think OSU has more talent. But if my votes was based on battled preparedness, meaning when faced with an equal or superior opponent, who would be more mentally prepared, my vote would go to LSU.

OSU #1, LSU #2, that's who I think should play in the NC game based on talent and merit.

BTW, I'm really impressed by how our players have come out and responded to this. I did a little digging into our reactions after last season's game at Illinois, and the mentality can basically be summarized by this line "Jim Tressel did allow that there are some concerns over and above the normal."

Article

While I really didn't find anything out of place with what Tressel said, I did find it confusing that our teams captains labeled the game as a positive thing, a "learning experience" that "we needed". Looking back on it, it's not only a sign that we were making excuses for ourselves for the poor performance, but the statement itself contained a sense of complacency, as in "like every team that's going to win the national title, we needed a little bump or two on the road to keep us humble." That's why I love the fact that this year, the players, especially Kirk Barton, are not only discontent, but flat out pissed about our mental lapse. This is a guy that went through last season, saw what happened and what kind of attitudes need to be changed, and is coming out and expressing those attitudes. So to me, what's important is that we showed championship hunger afterwards and that we have hungry players leading the team.

I'll go ahead and disagree....LSU is definately more talented than Kentucky and lost, and more talented than Auburn and got lucky to win

LSU is completely overrated....again their offense is poor at best

Not to say OSU is amazing and can't be beat, but LSU isn't the second best team in the country

 

[Jaxbuck]

I was attacking him, I was dismissing his comment. Of course computer programs have bias. They are designed by humans. The criteria of evaluation is determined by humans. You know, GIGO.

The pollsters still have a very, very hard time dropping a team because of a bad win. Oklahoma barely beat one of the worst teams in the nation, and they...stayed exactly where they were. Since I don't think any of the unbeaten contenders will remain unbeaten, we don't need style points. Simply running the rest of a tough schedule is sufficient. Now, I would love to beat everyone 38-0, and I want the team to continue to improve, but the performance against MSU, or any others like it, will not affect our chances to get to NO. If that is the question, then if we win, we will be going.

I agree, its not likely and even if we dropped to #2 it would be a stretch to not stay top 2 in the BCS.

That said, we did lose ground in the coaches poll iirc and thst just from a two series brain cramp in a game we otherwise completely dominated.

A full blown 2002-2003 win ugly fest the rest of the way would make things very interesting if BC manages to win out and LSU stays with just 1 loss(I don't think either will happen, I'm just saying). The national media has a severe distaste for us, there is no doubt in my mind on that point.

 

[osugrad21]

CPD

Ohio State-Florida national title game rematch is unlikely, but the possibility is there



Monday, October 22, 2007 Doug Lesmerises

Plain Dealer Reporter
It's . . . of the Week, the best of a weekend that was. Why does LSU make everything so hard?

Game of the Week
Florida 45, Kentucky 37: Let's get nuts. Let's talk about Ohio State-Florida III: The Game the World Will Hate. After meeting for the football and basketball national titles last year, is a football rematch possible? But Florida already has two losses, you point out. Let's think about it.




Cont...

 

[Waller]

I agree, its not likely and even if we dropped to #2 it would be a stretch to not stay top 2 in the BCS.

That said, we did lose ground in the coaches poll iirc and thst just from a two series brain cramp in a game we otherwise completely dominated.

A full blown 2002-2003 win ugly fest the rest of the way would make things very interesting if BC manages to win out and LSU stays with just 1 loss(I don't think either will happen, I'm just saying). The national media has a severe distaste for us, there is no doubt in my mind on that point.

We actually picked up one first place vote in one poll, and 2 first place votes in the other. And I completely agree that the vast majority of voters out there are hoping OSU loses so we do to ourselves what they can't yet do themselves. However, with what this defense has shown thus far, I don't think that is likely.


GO BUCKS!

 

[osugrad21]

DDN

Ohio State has been only sure thing in '07

By Marc Katz
Staff Writer

Tuesday, October 23, 2007
Making game predictions is always a dicey proposition because, after all, there's only a 50 percent chance of being correct.
Still, there were certain givens entering this college football season, especially in the Big Ten. For instance, Ohio State pasted together a ridiculously easy schedule, helped along by a stunningly underachieving Big Ten.



Cont...

 

[osugrad21]

DDN

In the BCS, LSU might have best road to title game

Tigers done with most difficult games and are waiting for others to fall.

​

By Kyle Nagel
Staff Writer

Tuesday, October 23, 2007
Now that some college football teams are down to four games on their schedules, which fans can start making plans for New Orleans and the national championship game? With the upsets, it's not so easy to tell, even for the Top 5 in the BCS:



Cont...

 

[Steve19]

That is the funniest line I have read all day. Of course they don't have bias, they are programmed by other non-biased computers, and numbers never lie, and the tooth fairy is coming by later tonight.

All the computers can do is analyze objective information, i.e., scores, offensive yardage, etc. Those comprising the BCS score are under considerable scrutiny. The statistical models may not include strength of schedule, etc. So, the source of your belief that the human (i.e., computers) are programming in bias remains unclear.

We have a number of professors on BP who teach multivariate statistical modeling and we are always excited about new opportunities to learn.

Your post seems to suggest that you have some wisdom not available to others here? Like to share it?

 

[DaddyBigBucks]

...Those comprising the BCS score are under considerable scrutiny...

You know I like you Steve. I hate having to take issue with anything you write...

But those who "scrutinize" the computer models have to be 10X as smart as those who write them to truly hold them accountable.

Have you ever noticed that the computer models based on the west coast consistently rate the PAC-10 teams higher than the other models - sometimes to a ridiculous extreme?

The bias comes from the assumptions that you make about what is important. For example: If you want to pimp the buckeyes, place a high value on efficiency and rushing defense (the Buckeyes are almost always good at both under Tressel).