Yahoo, Tattoos, and tOSU (1-year bowl ban, 82 scholly limit for 3 years)

[Wingate1217]

From what I gather this is just a huge [censored]ing match and nothing more as it pertains to the NCAA investigation

And ESPN wants to further rub OSU's nose in it by retelling information that the public and certainly the NCAA already knows.....

 

[CONGERSBUCKEYE]

All about the money

ESPN is in bed with the SEC and this is going to be the next thing the NCAA is going to have to tackle. The Big Ten Network is a direct competitor and there is nothing better than for ESPN than bad pub for OSU and them hurting on the field in the long run. Is ESPN suing for every Cameron Newton email from coach to dad? Is ESPN suing to see every email that Nick Saban has put out with regards to over signing? I am fine with freedom of information but what is the benefit for ESPN or anyone to have these emails released? If these emails are open game then lets start to sue every program for text messages sent to recruits. Joke...

 

[Gatorubet]

and I do believe the Ohio Supreme Court case ESPN cited in its argument was subsequently overturned by a federal district court. so, that argument probably isn't going to fly again.

Well only the U.S. Supreme Court can overturn an Ohio Supreme Court case. Don't want to get into semantics, but perhaps you are right that a federal court has questioned the correctness of the Ohio Supreme Court's decision---which might give the Ohio Supreme Court reason to revisit the decision---but that is not the same as having the decision overturned.

An Ohio Federal District Court interpreted the law in light of an injunction asked for by the United States arising out of a request for information on student disciplinary records. The Federal District Court examined FERPA privilege policies and its exceptions - and, disagreeing with the Ohio State Supreme Court's interpretation of FERPA's provisions, noted that student disciplinary records fall within FERPA's definition of an "educational record".

The Federal Sixth Circuit affirmed that ruling:

http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/F3/294/797/545772/

The holding certainly is limited to the issue of student disciplinary records as far as invalidating the legitimacy of the entirely of the state supreme court decision, but it does lend support to the general proposition that the scope of FERPA is not as narrow as ESPN and the Dispatch would like everyone to believe.

 

[NateG]

And ESPN wants to further rub OSU's nose in it by retelling information that the public and certainly the NCAA already knows.....

You mean like while reporting the win vacations bringing up the fact that Tressel resigned and that players are going to miss games. And that they should have self imposed a bowl ban and scholarship reductions.

 

[Gatorubet]

I thought the NCAA already had the emails?

From the attachments submitted with tOSU's response to the NOA, I do not see where copies of the e-mails to Sarniak from Tress were provided to the NCAA, or even discussed for that matter.

 

[buckeyeinfla]

but espn is still digging to come up with anything against osu at this point

 

[Folanator]

I hate those motherfuckers at ESPN. I would love it if the next time Game Day is on campus the students throw all of their equipment in the Olentangy. There is nothing that would make me happier. Well...maybe if Fowler was lashed to one of the speakers.

This is straight slander because the B10 network is taking cash out of their pockets.

FUCK Mickey Mouse.

 

[Bucknut24]

think would be awesome is once gameday starts the whole crowd just turns around and walks away singing "we don't give a damn for the network of ESPN" not as catchy but you get the point

 

[tsteele316]

From the attachments submitted with tOSU's response to the NOA, I do not see where copies of the e-mails to Sarniak from Tress were provided to the NCAA, or even discussed for that matter.

the emails could have been turned over during the initial investigation. If OSU contends that said emails are protected by FERPA, they probably wouldn't be included as attachments to their response, which is out there for public viewing.

I think ESPN has realized that OSU isn't going to get the NCAA hammer that their network had hoped for. Secondly, ever since TP got into a public pissing match with KH, he's been in ESPN's crosshairs.

 

[jlb1705]

I just found this - tOSU official position on FERPA and records release/protection. Look at:

http://registrar.osu.edu/policies/privacy_release_student_records.pdf

Here, I seriously doubt that the release to Sarniak is what was meant by "revealed to any other person", and that statement more relates to whether the record is made accessible to other departments or employees for work/institution education related reasons. IOW, sending a private e-mail containing otherwise non-accessible information to a non-institution, non-academically related third party does not magically turn it into an "education record".

I think by tOSU's own interpretation it would be a stretch to label the e-mails as FERPA protected.

If the emails are not educational records then that would make them "sole posession records" belonging to the individuals who created them. If that's the case, ESPN is suing the wrong party.

Besides, the distinction between "educational record" and "sole possession record" is one that determines whether or not Terrelle Pryor himself has a right to view it, not an outside party like ESPN. My understanding is that in order for ESPN to have a right to it, the record would have to be neither of those things, which seemed to be what they were asserting.

In my experience, "sole possession record" is defined so narrowly that it's almost impossible in my job to actually create one that would stand up to scrutiny. In practice, my understanding is that literally no one would be able to know I even possessed it in the first place.

 

[jwinslow]

FOIA requests are simply met with printouts right? How does the requesting party know they received all of the documents? Or is it something where they should fear the threat of a formal investigation and stiff penalties for withholding part of the requested documents?

 

[BB73]

And - you know - that is EXACTLY also the job of an institution and its top employees. There is a balance between wanting to have a program that follows the rules and one that is voluntarily sanctioned into oblivion. I would expect Florida to want to make sure that rules were followed. But if they were not - I'd hope to hell that they did everything they could outside of unethical behavior to defend the institution from sanctions if they could be avoided or minimized. They have a duel role, like OH10 brings up. And just as making the state prove a case while defending a client is not wrong, implementing a strategy to avoid or lessen penalties and sanctions by making the NCAA prove a case is not wrong either.

tOSU's relationship with ESPN does indeed conjure up images of a meeting at dawn, with the flintlocks!

 

[Gatorubet]

If the emails are not educational records then that would make them "sole posession records" belonging to the individuals who created them. If that's the case, ESPN is suing the wrong party.

Besides, the distinction between "educational record" and "sole possession record" is one that determines whether or not Terrelle Pryor himself has a right to view it, not an outside party like ESPN. My understanding is that in order for ESPN to have a right to it, the record would have to be neither of those things, which seemed to be what they were asserting.

In my experience, "sole possession record" is defined so narrowly that it's almost impossible in my job to actually create one that would stand up to scrutiny. In practice, my understanding is that literally no one would be able to know I even possessed it in the first place.

But wouldn't the fact that the e-mails were on tOSU server in an official e-mail account belonging to James Tressel, a University employee, make that record still the property of tOSU, a public institution, and subject to the FOI absent some privilege like FERPA?

Edit: here the fact that other university personnel searched his e-mails (that started this whole deal) makes me assume that the e-mail account it is not in his "sole possession". Could be wrong. I think you are right about a professor's private notes not being subject to a FOI request.

 

[BigWoof31]

If these emails are open game then lets start to sue every program for text messages sent to recruits. Joke...

Your two years late. That's almost exactly what Arkansas alums did to Houston Nutt under the freedom of information act. He resigned after the following season.
Deadspin Link below has actual link to PDF report


http://deadspin.com/249866/ever-wonder-who-houston-nutt-talks-to-todays-your-lucky-day

 

[BB73]

From the attachments submitted with tOSU's response to the NOA, I do not see where copies of the e-mails to Sarniak from Tress were provided to the NCAA, or even discussed for that matter.

Actually, it was reported to be a single email from JT to Sarniak, and a simple acknowledgement of its receipt being Sarniak's only email back to JT. They were discussed in the primary response document.

page 40

On April 2, 2010, Chris Cicero, a former football student-athlete at the University in the early 1980s, sent an e-mail to Tressel. This started a series of e-mails over the next two months between Cicero and Tressel concerning Ed Rife, a local tattoo parlor owner who possessed numerous Ohio State University memorabilia. Tressel forwarded one of these e-mails to Ted Sarniak,

pages 41-42 (redactions were by tOSU, not by me)

Ted Sarniak owns a company that employs many youth in Jeannette, Pennsylvania, the
.
,
. Sarniak reported that
. The University monitored the
. The University has no concerns that
to NCAA legislation and has regularly and successfully used Sarniak's
is contrary with
.
Sarniak reported that prior to receiving the e-mail from Tressel on April 3, 2010, he had a telephone conversation with Tressel. (University telephone records indicate a call occurred from Tressel?s cell telephone to Sarniak?s cell telephone on April 2, 2010, for 15 minutes at 9:19 p.m.). Sarniak did not have a detailed recollection of the call but remembered that Tressel said he would be sending him an e-mail. He recalled Tressel informing him that .? Sarniak stated that while he may call Tressel on an occasional basis, it is unusual for Tressel to call him. This was the only conversation he recalled having with Tressel about this situation. He did not recall Tressel mentioning during this conversation that Tressel had received information about apparel nor did he remember Tressel saying the phrase ?selling of memorabilia.? Sarniak had not heard any information about student-athletes selling memorabilia prior to this e-mail. Sarniak recalled asking subsequent to Tressel?s telephone call and e-mail
,
. Sarniak stated he did not mention Rife nor did he have any other conversations
about this subject.

page 43, following the table of emails involved, which stated that #3 was JT forwarding Cicero's original email to Sarniak

3. April 3, 2010, 8:01 a.m., Tressel to Sarniak - This guy, Chris Cicero, is a criminal lawyer in town. He played here when I was an assistant coach in the early 1980's. He has always looked out for us.

4. April 3, 2010, 10:12 a.m., Sarniak to Tressel - Received the information.

Since tOSU self-reported JT's emails which were found while researching another topic in January, I can't imagine the single email the JT sent to Sarniak being any kind of smoking gun, except for the flintlocks pictured above.

It seems like a pissing contest by ESPN to me.