Yahoo, Tattoos, and tOSU (1-year bowl ban, 82 scholly limit for 3 years)

[scooter1369]

My brother in law is one of the top car salesmen in Columbus. Most of his business is repeat business and word of mouth because people direct their freinds and family to him. Its how that business operates. Its sales. You build a clientele. This guy just happened to build a clientele of football players. My brother in law has lawyers, judges, baliffs, you name it coming to him, because it only takes one guy at the county courthouse to say, "You're looking for a car? I know this guy at ________. Go see him. He knows his shit"

 

[Gatorubet]

Where are you getting the wider set of data that suggests this is a 'virtual sales monopoly'? Were there really only 50-60 cars sold to this particular group during whatever time frame is being alleged here? There have been hundreds of football players and other OSU athletes and their family members in the car market over the past decade...

Then my bad. I thought it was reported that the salesperson was quoted saying that the athletes were often referred to him by the school, hence the virtual sales monopoly comment.

I really have no idea how many athletes bought autos from other people, nor do I care so much.

 

[MaliBuckeye]

Then my bad. I thought it was reported that the salesperson was quoted saying that the athletes were often referred to him by the school, hence the virtual sales monopoly comment.

I really have no idea how many athletes bought autos from other people, nor do I care so much.

I remember the same thing- I think that, during the MoC investigation, there were reports that the Compliance office referred folks to certain dealers who were historically good partners with the University... "Played by the rules", as it were.

 

[strohs]

My brother in law is one of the top car salesmen in Columbus. Most of his business is repeat business and word of mouth because people direct their freinds and family to him. Its how that business operates. Its sales. You build a clientele. This guy just happened to build a clientele of football players. My brother in law has lawyers, judges, baliffs, you name it coming to him, because it only takes one guy at the county courthouse to say, "You're looking for a car? I know this guy at ________. Go see him. He knows his shit"

Your post makes way to much sense, you need to think before you post from now on... :)
I have always made sure to refer people back to car dealers, etc. when I have had a good experience, too many jokers out there...

 

[3074326]

Why is everyone ignoring the fact that the car salesmen got tickets to bowl games? From multiple players even, correct?

It's fishy. Thad Gibson's case doesn't prove that everything was ok. It proves that the Dispatch did a shitty job of reporting. It still stinks to me. I hope it's nothing.

 

[BUCKYLE]

Why is everyone ignoring the fact that the car salesmen got tickets to bowl games? From multiple players even, correct?

It's fishy. Thad Gibson's case doesn't prove that everything was ok. It proves that the Dispatch did a shitty job of reporting. It still stinks to me. I hope it's nothing.

No one's ignoring a fucking thing. I haven't seen a confirmation that the tickets were from players. Tho, if my mom thought someone saved her son a couple grand on a car loan she was paying for, while not breaking any rules that would hurt the school I love, she may...persuade me...to hook the dude up. Also, it could've been as innocent as "hey, if you're gettin' rid of any bowl tickets...lollololololololololol"...and the first dude gives them up, the subsequent players coming in..."hey, the first Buckeye I sold a car to gave me bowl ticks...so...lololololololololol". I'm not suggesting any of what I say is true, only that it's not impossible to explain. I don't think anything I said is that far out of range, either. But whatever. You're determined to hang tOSU, and that's your right. I'm not saying you're not justified. I've just been thru this bull-fucking-shit before, and it seemed then, as it does now, there was too much smoke!!1!! OMGZ!!211!!...I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[MaxBuck]

I've worked with 2 different PhD friends of mine when they were providing expert witness testimony for cases similar to this (our product does something x% better than yous type things that someone got their balls sued off for).

If you had the accurate data (big assumption) the standard deviation from retail for the player sample and the non player sample would allow you to make a case for or against this being improper benefits.

NADA black book that the dealers use, for the month the car was purchased, far right hand column (ex clean). How much off that is each individual buyers order? All the single case good deal exceptions are taken into account by the average number.

If joe public std deviation is -$500 from retail and Joe Player's is -$650 then [censored] off, nothing to see here, go on about your bidness.

If Joe Public std dev is -$500 and Joe Player is -$1,500 then we have a problem. All the "yeah but's" would be baked into the numbers.

The other important thing I'd use to make a case is what % of the dealers business does this 50 some odd athletes represent? Is it a 100 car a month store or some big 500 plus dealership? If the players are more than say 20% of the total for the time period in question it gets harder to explain away I would think.

At least this is what seems to make sense to me for no more than I've looked at it. I haven't asked any actual expert witness/PhD types their thoughts.

Statistical analysis to "prove" anything regarding transactions involving Buckeyes, their families and this dealership would be meaningless. Statistics can be made to prove whatever point you care to make.

Football players EVERYWHERE (including many high schools) get especially good deals at car dealerships. Fans of other schools who claim otherwise are naive. Or idiots. Or both.

 

[Gatorubet]

Football players EVERYWHERE (including many high schools) get especially good deals at car dealerships. Fans of other schools who claim otherwise are naive. Or idiots. Or both.

This is totally true. Which is why the NCAA sniffing around any school - anywhere - always produces nervous twitches. The reason the NCAA will not find improper benefits at Florida right now is because they are not looking for improper benefits at Florida right now.

 

[MaliBuckeye]

Titus weighs in:

All I'm saying is that I won't be surprised in the slightest if the NCAA digs up some serious dirt on the Ohio State football team (especially the stuff surrounding the discounted and/or free cars) because it's something I've been scratching my head over for years. So if you're an OSU football fan, I'd suggest not getting your hopes up. There's a solid chance that this won't end well.

I'll be shocked if the NCAA doesn't find anything when they look into this car scandal, but again I feel like I need to stress that I?m only basing this viewpoint off of information that every OSU student from 2006-2010 should have (after all, the football players weren't exactly discreet with their cars).

Although he goes on to say that the concerns about Buford are inaccurate.

And of course, he's getting crucified on Twitter. *Sigh.

 

[Jaxbuck]

Statistical analysis to "prove" anything regarding transactions involving Buckeyes, their families and this dealership would be meaningless. Statistics can be made to prove whatever point you care to make.

Football players EVERYWHERE (including many high schools) get especially good deals at car dealerships. Fans of other schools who claim otherwise are naive. Or idiots. Or both.

As I said before, if I had the data I could show how much/how little discrepancy there was bewteen the discounts given to the two different samples. The larger the sample size(s) the more statistically significant the results would be but you can rest assured 2+2 is always 4 and would have meaning one way or the other.

If a large discrepancy showed up it would be up to lawyers/investigators to argue the "why" but the bigger the sample and the bigger the difference the harder it would be to argue OSU's case.

Your second point is exactly what I have been saying for untold pages now. Gibsons car deal is significant if it gets the NCAA looking no matter the Dispatches angle/shitty reporting/rental car or anything else because anyone who's really looking is probably going to find something.

 

[Tlangs]

Titus weighs in:
Although he goes on to say that the concerns about Buford are inaccurate.

And of course, he's getting crucified on Twitter. *Sigh.

so the football players are guilty but Bufford (and Diebler/Dieblers dad) who bought cars at the same place are ok. good to know.


I wonder if Titus knows that if the football program comes down, basketball is too. 2 guys out of 10 is 20% of the hoops team getting extra benefits.

 

[Steve19]

Let's keep a few things straight.

When the NCAA assesses whether Ohio State athletes received cars at prices that constitute an improper benefit, then it must find that athletes received cars at prices below those other college kids received cars that were in similar condition.

A straight comparison to book values is not meaningful, even if statistically significant, because a lower price might be due to another more general factor that is not consistent with the receipt of an improper benefit but rather the age and lifestage of the college student. For example, most college kids would be more likely to buy a bit of a clunker than a business person buying the same model car.

 

[bassbuckeye07]

My guess is we are fixated on this car thing which will yield nothing......if more were to come out its going to come from a blind spot (just a guess)...all I know is Tress has dug in and that gives me a small amount of solace....albeit small

 

[Jaxbuck]

Let's keep a few things straight.

When the NCAA assesses whether Ohio State athletes received cars at prices that constitute an improper benefit, then it must find that athletes received cars at prices below those other college kids received cars that were in similar condition.

A straight comparison to book values is not meaningful because a lower price might be due to another factor that is not consistent with the receipt of an improper benefit. For example, most college kids would be more likely to buy a bit of a clunker than a business person buying the same model car.

That's one way you could try and play it if you are an OSU lawyer/AD rep, perhaps the only way if a large discrepancy were shown to exist, but if the same pattern of discounts comes up for the families of players where do you go with it? But that's what I meant by saying the lawyers would have to argue the "why".

Bottom line is if the sample size were large enough "yeah but's" like that would be discounted by the numbers. Not every college kid buys a clunker and not every joe public buys a nicer model. The averages discount everything, that's why the larger the sample size the more statistically significant the findings would be.

 

[BB73]

A discussion of how the media members have handled things involved with the JT story, it's a worthwhile read.

Ozone

Around the-Ozone Water Cooler - Has the Media Handled the Jim Tressel Scandal Fairly?

Cont'd ...