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The Race Card

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Taosman said:
How would I know churches couldn't handle the volume? Because the "numbers" say they can't. It's a matter of dollars that the churches just don't have. Many churches say just that. They don't have enough money to handle an increase in volume no matter if they could be more efficient.
Having enough money is the bottom line.
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It's not just churches doing this work but the "numbers" you mention don't "say" anything. Granted, churches and volunteer organizations would have a great deal more money if Uncle Sam would lighten his burden, but you have no idea what the organizations can do. You've acknowledged that when you asked for someone to show you what they are doing.

Meanwhile, our Fed govt is in immense debt that no other organization could ever legally get away with and you question why efficiency matters and why real people "on the ground" should be doing this.

Never mind the social implications that come from this where people come to "expect" money from the government that they would never expect from another source without at least attempting to perform work.

Then, you have the audacity to shame a McDonalds job as if it's too good for people to do. It's a JOB. Anyone actually doing a job and caring about it is to be applauded. Not everyone is going to be a doctor, scientist or financially successful entrepreneur, so not everyone will make the same cash, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with working the job at McDonalds. It's a job, take pride in it.
 
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BayBuck said:
Pretty effective argument these days.
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Pretty effective for who? Are you willing to let 170,000 veterans go without Food Stamps? Or VA services of any kind?
Are you willing to see churches get crushed by the money demands of feeding 12.8 million people? They account for 6% of the money right now.
There is a middle way to these things. Government has to be a player because of the sheer amount of MONEY involved.
Money is THE bottom line.
 
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Taosman said:
No, you give people the choice of how they spend their "assistance" If they don't want to use that to feed their kids, what can you do? You can only "police" the fraud part.
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That simply unacceptable. So not only are these people ENTITLED to "assistance" but they can choose to spend it on things other than their kids. And your response is "what can you do?"????
 
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Taosman said:
Pretty effective for who? Are you willing to let 170,000 veterans go without Food Stamps? Or VA services of any kind?
Are you willing to see churches get crushed by the money demands of feeding 12.8 million people? They account for 6% of the money right now.
There is a middle way to these things. Government has to be a player because of the sheer amount of MONEY involved.
Money is THE bottom line.
Click to expand...
Please don't be offended by this but I have to ask, are you or have you ever been a recreational drug user?
 
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Taosman said:
Pretty effective for who? Are you willing to let 170,000 veterans go without Food Stamps? Or VA services of any kind?
Are you willing to see churches get crushed by the money demands of feeding 12.8 million people? They account for 6% of the money right now.
There is a middle way to these things. Government has to be a player because of the sheer amount of MONEY involved.
Money is THE bottom line.
Click to expand...
If money is the bottom line, then enable those charitable organizations get that money rather than having the government take it. The Feds don't create money, they only spend it...and not particularly wisely.
 
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matcar said:
It's not just churches doing this work but the "numbers" you mention don't "say" anything. Granted, churches and volunteer organizations would have a great deal more money if Uncle Sam would lighten his burden, but you have no idea what the organizations can do. You've acknowledged that when you asked for someone to show you what they are doing.

Meanwhile, our Fed govt is in immense debt that no other organization could ever legally get away with and you question why efficiency matters and why real people "on the ground" should be doing this.

Never mind the social implications that come from this where people come to "expect" money from the government that they would never expect from another source without at least attempting to perform work.

Then, you have the audacity to shame a McDonalds job as if it's too good for people to do. It's a JOB. Anyone actually doing a job and caring about it is to be applauded. Not everyone is going to be a doctor, scientist or financially successful entrepreneur, so not everyone will make the same cash, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with working the job at McDonalds. It's a job, take pride in it.
Click to expand...

$7.79 an hour average at McDonalds. Try feeding a family on that.
 
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Taosman said:
Pretty effective for who? Are you willing to let 170,000 veterans go without Food Stamps? Or VA services of any kind?
Are you willing to see churches get crushed by the money demands of feeding 12.8 million people? They account for 6% of the money right now.
There is a middle way to these things. Government has to be a player because of the sheer amount of MONEY involved.
Money is THE bottom line.
Click to expand...

You are seriously retorting the "government is bad" argument with the VA? Right now?? The sheer obliviousness is astounding...
Maybe it's time to pop your head out of the bunker and take a look around.
 
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matcar said:
If money is the bottom line, then enable those charitable organizations get that money rather than having the government take it. The Feds don't create money, they only spend it...and not particularly wisely.
Click to expand...

I could go along with that if the church organizations could convince Congress that they would do a better job with very much more money.(94% more money...gulp!) Giving anyone a 94% increases should scare you though. But you get my support for such an attempt.
 
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BayBuck said:
You are seriously retorting the "government is bad" argument with the VA? Right now?? The sheer obliviousness is astounding...
Maybe it's time to pop your head out of the bunker and take a look around.
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So, I take it that you don't think things could get worse? A lot worse? So, you're willing to gamble that blowing up the VA is a better idea?
Seriously? Ask some Vets if they are willing to blow up the VA and take their chances elsewhere.
 
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Taosman said:
I could go along with that if the church organizations could convince Congress that they would do a better job with very much more money.(94% more money...gulp!) Giving anyone a 94% increases should scare you though. But you get my support for such an attempt.
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All you have to do is remove the insane amounts of money the Feds are taking from we the people and charitable contributions rise. And you then have situations where the providers actually WANT to help...that's why we volunteer...versus a government employee who sometimes is disinterested. And you also have a situation where the recipient is encouraged to have some skin in the game rather than continuing to fall back. That rarely happens with Fed handouts because it's an anonymous give.
 
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matcar said:
You can feed a family on that. Not well, but you can do it. And then then you can take pride in hard work done well. And you can work with your family and community to continue to improve your situation. But again, you are part of the problem because you belittle it.
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People also don't have minimum wage jobs forever. If you are a hard worker, often times there is advancement, even just to Assistant Manager and then Manager of a store, etc. One of the problems with the "entitlement culture" isn't just the unwillingness of some to work at all...it's the unwillingness of many to start at the bottom and work their way up. Everyone expects 6 figures as soon as they show up for a job...the working world has NEVER worked like that...ever.
 
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