Reds Tidbits (2012 Season)

[Jt4prez]

Not me. I'm lashing out because he's a first baseman and there's a day off today! Give him the day off in the middle somewhere if he needed it, which I'm not sure why he would, not at the end of the stretch when there is a day off following anyway. When Duhsty says "we talked about it" he means he told Joey he was going to get a day off. Votto is on record as saying he never wants to not be in the lineup. There are ways to give him rest without wrecking team momentum. Fuck Dusty and his apologists.

First, just because the guy is a first baseman does not mean he has experienced any less grind than anybody else. To the contrary, Votto is under more constant pressure than anybody else on this team to produce because if he does not produce then the team does not produce. This would be so regardless of the position he played. The game is both mental and physical and you cannot underestimate the grind that this pressure to constantly perform puts on a player.

Second, the day off in this case was a travel day to Houston from Pittsburgh. I'm sure that the team got to Houston sometime in the early morning. Not really much of a day off when you are on a plane all night and arrive at the airport sometime in the early morning and then have to get checked into a hotel.

Third, it's one game.

 

[Bucknut24]

First, just because the guy is a first baseman does not mean he has experienced any less grind than anybody else. To the contrary, Votto is under more constant pressure than anybody else on this team to produce because if he does not produce then the team does not produce. This would be so regardless of the position he played. The game is both mental and physical and you cannot underestimate the grind that this pressure to constantly perform puts on a player.

Second, the day off in this case was a travel day to Houston from Pittsburgh. I'm sure that the team got to Houston sometime in the early morning. Not really much of a day off when you are on a plane all night and arrive at the airport sometime in the early morning and then have to get checked into a hotel.

Third, it's one game.

so what happens if they miss the playoffs by one game?

 

[Bestbuck36]

First, just because the guy is a first baseman does not mean he has experienced any less grind than anybody else. To the contrary, Votto is under more constant pressure than anybody else on this team to produce because if he does not produce then the team does not produce. This would be so regardless of the position he played. The game is both mental and physical and you cannot underestimate the grind that this pressure to constantly perform puts on a player.

Second, the day off in this case was a travel day to Houston from Pittsburgh. I'm sure that the team got to Houston sometime in the early morning. Not really much of a day off when you are on a plane all night and arrive at the airport sometime in the early morning and then have to get checked into a hotel.

Third, it's one game.

GTFOH with that "grind" bull crap. These guys are young athletes that prepare half the year for the other half of the year that they work. Older veterans and catchers/pitchers need more time off. The days off during the week are enough time off to recover with all the measures they have to stay healthy. If he'd had and injury or something I could see it. The guy himself doesnt want out of the lineup and without him the team sucks balls. The manager's job is to put the best lineup on the field day in and day out without mismanaging. The bottom line is they are only two months into the season. If guys are too fatigued mentally or physically they need to find a new line of work. Otherwise, Duhsty is still bumbling idiot.

Oh, and 1st basemen have the easiest job in all of sports basically, endurance wise anyway. *relegated to players that actually play. The DH is probably easier.

 

[HINYG8]

so what happens if they miss the playoffs by one game?

Awww dude...way to jinx the season!

 

[scott91575]

Look at it this way;

• Marshall is better than anyone we had in the pen last year
• Latos is an upgrade to the rotation
• Votto and Bruce are a nice foundation no matter what else happens with position players
• SS was a black hole of suck last year, I'll take my chances with Cozart.
• Ditto Mesoraco except C was pretty good overall
• I'll give you CF, he sucks something fierce
• LF is most likely MLB average, not awful
• Phillips pisses me off to no end but he isn't exactly chopped liver, contract or no.
• Maybe they fuck up and do something right with Chapman
• The minors are still producing
• Two dudes named Albert and Prince aren't in the NL Central anymore.

Overall I am optam....optimys....optimistery...optimistic. Fuck it, what's the worst that happens? They suck again?

Sorry, I just have to quote this from pre season (when Jax was doped up or dying or somethin').

Oh how quickly the optimism fades.

My personal favorite...

LF is most likely MLB average, not awful

 

[Mike80]

In the trunk, NOT the hotel room!!

http://www.fannation.com/truth_and_...n-chapmans-hotel-room?eref=sihp&sct=hp_bf2_a6

Pittsburgh police confirmed on Wednesday they are investigating a Tuesday evening robbery of a 26-year-old woman who was tied up inside Aroldis Chapman's room at the Onmi Penn Hotel. Claudia Manrique, of Silver Spring, Md., a guest of Chapman, was in the Reds pitcher's room while he was at Tuesday's Reds-Pirates game. Guests who stayed in a room on the same floor heard a woman screaming for help around 10 p.m. and went to her room to check on her, police said. They found her crying and bound with cloth napkins and alerted hotel security. The woman was not injured or sexually assaulted, according to police. She was taken to a local hospital, where she was interviewed by detectives. Cincinnati Enquirer

 

[Bestbuck36]

The A's look to be big time sellers at the deadline again and I'm looking at a guy like Seth Smith who's really coming on. Guy plays LF in maybe the worst ballpark in the league. He's picking it up in May after a pretty bad April. If he can hit HR's in Oakland he can launch em in Cincy. 29 years old, makes about 2.4 mil a year. Only batting about .230 but thats .40 up from April. .280/20/80/10 are better than we are going to get as it stands out there.

Oh and he's another Lefty bat.

 

[Mike80]

The A's look to be big time sellers at the deadline again and I'm looking at a guy like Seth Smith who's really coming on. Guy plays LF in maybe the worst ballpark in the league. He's picking it up in May after a pretty bad April. If he can hit HR's in Oakland he can launch em in Cincy. 29 years old, makes about 2.4 mil a year. Only batting about .230 but thats .40 up from April. .280/20/80/10 are better than we are going to get as it stands out there.

Oh and he's another Lefty bat.

Which means Dusty will bat him ninth AFTER the pitcher if the pitcher is a right-handed hitter....

 

[Jaxbuck]

Sorry, I just have to quote this from pre season (when Jax was doped up or dying or somethin').

Oh how quickly the optimism fades.

My personal favorite...

LF is most likely MLB average, not awful

That's what I get for trying to be positive.

If you see my pictorial representation of the stages of a Reds fan season, you'll notice I clearly recognize and allow for early optimism.

Followed of course by soul crushing disaster and defeat.

I honest to God didn't think LuHsey could suck so badly playing half its games in a bandbox. I missed my guess like Drew Stubbs missing a baseball.

 

[Jt4prez]

GTFOH with that "grind" bull crap. These guys are young athletes that prepare half the year for the other half of the year that they work. Older veterans and catchers/pitchers need more time off. The days off during the week are enough time off to recover with all the measures they have to stay healthy. If he'd had and injury or something I could see it. The guy himself doesnt want out of the lineup and without him the team sucks balls. The manager's job is to put the best lineup on the field day in and day out without mismanaging. The bottom line is they are only two months into the season. If guys are too fatigued mentally or physically they need to find a new line of work. Otherwise, Duhsty is still bumbling idiot.

Oh, and 1st basemen have the easiest job in all of sports basically, endurance wise anyway. *relegated to players that actually play. The DH is probably easier.

I'm not even talking about the physical aspect of the game. Sometimes its necessary to get a break from the mental aspect of the game, especially in Votto's case where he has so much pressure on him day in and day out to carry the offense. One way to ensure that you are putting the best lineup on the field is to give guys a chance to rest in order that they be fresh and able to perform up to the level they're expected to. I do know that I'd rather give the guy one day off now, two months into the season, than to continually run him out there and risk fatigue in the latter portion of the season(yes, even if Votto himself did not openly ask for the day off).

Also, let me add that you are discounting how difficult a position 1st is to play. I'm not saying it is the hardest position to play or even that it is not among the easiest, just that there is enormous responsibilty to playing 1st base. 1st basemen have coverage responsibilities on doubles, relay responsibilities, pickoff responsibilities and fielding responsibilities just as 3rd baseman do. Votto himself has said he has spent numerous extra hours learning how to play the position when he was moved there in the minors.

Everybody needs a day off, whether they openly admit it or not. If we lose the division by one game then you can point to the blown saves by Marshall, the lack of hitting with runners in scoring position, the lack of offense in general OR I guess you can point to the day off for Votto. That's your choice. Managers give their superstars days off all the time, despite the negative consequences on team performance. Giving Votto one day off is not such an asinine thing to do to be met with such backklash.

 

[Jaxbuck]

What, was Skip Schumakers price tag too high?

Actually I'm indifferent to mildly disappointed, which is about my standing off season heart rate as a Reds fan.

They are spending money on a shitty player that Dusty has a hard on for, hoping said shitty player can replicate his one good career year (sounds a lot like the Willy Tavaras signing to me).

There is a chance they get the big year for a minimal expense, but odds are they get get the shitbird player he has been every year but one and the functional retard of a manager they employ gives the shitbird player way too many AB's.

He's probably not going to outproduce Heisey and they just flushed 2MM+. Not a lot of money in baseball terms but 2 MM here and 2MM there saved on shit like Ludwick can turn into an actual player sometime if you haven't wasted it.

Anyway, it wouldn't be the Reds if they didn't do something at least mildly stupid so lets all join the Reds braintrust in executing their strategy and hope the motherfucker has a good year.

Actually this was what I said right after Luddick was signed.

Where did you lift that other line out of context from?

 

[jlb1705]

Also, let me add that you are discounting how difficult a position 1st is to play. I'm not saying it is the hardest position to play or even that it is not among the easiest, just that there is enormous responsibilty to playing 1st base. 1st basemen have coverage responsibilities on doubles, relay responsibilities, pickoff responsibilities and fielding responsibilities just as 3rd baseman do. Votto himself has said he has spent numerous extra hours learning how to play the position when he was moved there in the minors.

Yet John Kruk was able to do it.

[/argument]

 

[Jt4prez]

Yet John Kruk was able to do it.

[/argument]

He certainly wasn't able to do it well. Mike Piazza played catcher and Jose Canseco played RF. Does that discount the difficulty in playing catcher/RF the same way you imply it does for 1st? It shouldn't.

 

[jlb1705]

Look at it this way;

• Marshall is better than anyone we had in the pen last year
• Latos is an upgrade to the rotation
• Votto and Bruce are a nice foundation no matter what else happens with position players
• SS was a black hole of suck last year, I'll take my chances with Cozart.
• Ditto Mesoraco except C was pretty good overall
• I'll give you CF, he sucks something fierce
• LF is most likely MLB average, not awful
• Phillips pisses me off to no end but he isn't exactly chopped liver, contract or no.
• Maybe they fuck up and do something right with Chapman
• The minors are still producing
• Two dudes named Albert and Prince aren't in the NL Central anymore.

Overall I am optam....optimys....optimistery...optimistic. Fuck it, what's the worst that happens? They suck again?

I don't think most of what you said back then was too far off how I feel now. The Reds are in first place, so we can't say that you were too far off base with your hesitant optimism.

I think the one thing that everybody has underestimated to some degree is just how bad things are in CF and LF. I don't expect the Reds to have a Murderer's Row lineup, but the lack of production there puts a ton of pressure on the three positions where the Reds are relying on rookies to produce.

CF is going to be difficult to upgrade. I think we are stuck with Stubbs there. LF should be easy to upgrade though if the Reds have the will, and the nice thing there is that if a legit option is acquired, then Heisey can be used more in CF in place of Stubbs. Maybe that would light a fire under one of their asses. Nothing is going to change at catcher. Fortunately Hanigan is there, and Mesoraco has shown some strides so maybe he will continue to grow into his role as the season wears on. I don't think we'll see another option as SS, so they are going to sink or swim with Cozart. That leave 3B, and Todd Frazier. On the one hand I don't think he has done that bad. On the other hand it may be other place besides LF where an upgrade is attainable. My biggest fear is that the Reds will fail to make a move there because they think they might hurt the kid's feelings. If a legit 3B is there, the Reds have to go get him. Frazier is versatile at least and can be used in LF and perhaps at 1B as well.

...Which brings me back to the issue of backing up 1B. My biggest problem with Joey Votto missing a game right now is that Cairo and Costanzo suck so, so bad. With so many question marks at other positions, the Reds can't afford create more, even if just for one game. Get Votto his rest when you have a more legit player on the bench who can spell him, or when you have enough bodies on the other side of the field that you can afford to slide Todd Frazier over there for a day if needed. Sure, it was just one game - one in 162. That's easy for people to say in April or May. Nobody who contends ever says that in September but those games count just the same. That's why I hate to see the Reds throw games away with Sunday Special lineups. When there is more depth on the active roster it will be easier to justify rotating players.

Finally, the more I think about Costanzo's presence, the more pissed off I get. Here's what I imagine has happened. Jocketty picks the 25th man for the big league roster every year. Dusty takes that guy on as a pet project and completely overuses the guy and it starts to cost the team games. Jocketty, realizing that he can't replace Dusty's pet with somebody worth a damn on such short notice tries instead to replace him instead with somebody so fucking bad that Dusty will just leave the guy on the bench. Jocketty has underestimated Dusty's tardness though, and everybody is miserable watching this poor chump Costanzo try to play major league baseball. It's so pathetic that it could even come to something like that. I have learned one lesson from it though. Between Costanzo and Jamie Moyer, I've resolved that if I'm ever reincarnated it's going to be as a left-handed baseball player. Pitcher, hitter - doesn't matter. That shit is like being on a government pension. It doesn't matter how good or bad you are, you just have to show up and somebody will pay you decent money for just about the rest of your life.

 

[scott91575]

Actually this was what I said right after Luddick was signed.

Where did you lift that other line out of context from?

You were replying to this post from me.

I'm not so sure. There is still a cripple at 3B, an unkown at SS, a 2B who likely won't be back next year, LF is awful, catcher is an unkown, the center fielder couldn't hit the ball if he used a door as a bat, and noodle arm Arroyo is still in the pitching rotation (let's not forget Homer, and I don't think Cueto will duplicate last year). On top of that, no closer.

Honestly, I see this as a .500 team and no one who will step up and fill the huge hole at 3B, LF, and soon 2B. Catcher and SS might be ok, but still too early to tell.

I hope I am wrong, but I am not as optimistic as Jax (which is rather alarming).

I think Phillips signed his deal a few days later. I was also off on some stuff so far. Arroyo has not sucked, and so far Cueto has been very similar to last year.

BTW, I was responding to a post about the Reds long term and some other optimism you had going.

So far I am not about to back off on this team being a .500 team. This team simply cannot hit right now and has zero bench. Sadly this team is a few mediocre players from being a good team. Really, they just need some mediocre hitting instead of the complete crap at some positions. They have a solid core of hitters, a good rotation, and a great bullpen. If they could simply put some middle of the road hitters at the top of the order this team would be much better. Of course it would also help if the manager put one of the better OBP players at the top of the order instead of batting him 8th due to the fact he is not fast. Yet that would take a lobotomy (for which I will gladly donate for if it's simply a cost issue).