Penn State Aftermath

[osugrad21]

if you invert 2 safeties and say beat us, you have to beat them with the pass. or line up and bunch them in the mouth. as ljb said the defense played good but they had two chances late in the game to stop psu, they failed to. just like they failed to get off the field vs ill last year.

Absolutely. Even spreading them out still leaves 7 on 5 in the box...Throw in a TE and you have 8 for sure. Motion can help, formation strength shifts can help, but ultimately it comes down to being able to punish the defense for getting so top heavy. That didn't happen.

 

[helmdoggie]

I have to agree the fumble was a huge momentum killer. I had just texted a buddy who couldn't watch the game that Beanie seemed to be getting going. It reminded me of the Wisconsin game last year. You could just tell he was a few plays from breaking one. That fumble and ensuing TD by PSU effectively took him out of the rest of the game.

 

[GoodLifeSean]

My, God, with some of the comments you'd think we got Wisconsined or something. It was two very good Ds and the better statistical offense for the year came out on top. Instead of bitching let's look at the good.
1. PSU is the Number 8 offense and before the game was averaging around 42 ppg. We held them to 13 and only one touchdown, against a QB the D had not really prepared for.

2. Evan Royster was held to 77 yards on 19 carries for a 4.1 average, what we did to Ringer quite, but still for a kid averaging 7.7 a tote, I'll take it.

3. Clark was held to his lowest yardage total of the year passing, and we held a mobile QB (Remember Boo Jackson) to 39 rushing yards.

4. Pettrey is looking more and more like a bonified field goal kicker every week.

5. In Flash it seems we might have an actual return threat.

6. Yes Pryor underthrew balls, but people were bitching when he overthrew as well. Remember all those long bomb TDs Todd had last year that were due to spectular comebacks by Robo. Troy had 3 years before he was dropping perfect bombs. Relax

7. Saine better fit than Beanie? Crack much. This offense line could not open holes for Beanie to save their life in that game, it looks like they do good a game, get cocky, drop off, get bitched out and do well, maybe it was PSU's defense, maybe it was this pattern, but either way it sure as hell wasn't due to Beanie.

8. 1 reciever long patterns. What is up with these, lets send one reciever to get double covered long, and dink and dunk underneath, there needs to be levels of options long, medium, and short.

9. Wahh, we have two losses, wahh, we still have a shot at a BCS bowl, if not we can go Capital One Bowling on New Years day and get some SEC vengance and prove we can win. Are we that spoiled of a fan base (I know most here aren't in freak out mode, but still I've seen a few hear and a lot elsewhere). I'll tell you what, if a two loss season when we are predicted to go undefeated is tradgedy, I think I'll survive.

10. Though I don't like to say it we are going to be tough next year. I think offensively we add more speed . Yeah, Boone is a heck of a player, he will be greatly missed, but he hasn't played with that chip that lineman have, it's gotta be you touched my QB, I'm gonna break your arm.

11. What does all this mean, OSU 7-2, 4-1 in the Big Ten, Michigan is 2-6, 1-3, It's not such a bad year after all
12. As an afterward, I hope PSU takes it from here on out, wins the whole thing and sends JoePa off into the sunset, let the man have a damn retirement. They've had their off the field problems, but the team I watched on Saturday didn't do anything to make me hate them, after all is it really so bad to lose to USC and a nat'l champ, Me thinks not.

 

[buckeyesin07]

I have to agree the fumble was a huge momentum killer. I had just texted a buddy who couldn't watch the game that Beanie seemed to be getting going. It reminded me of the Wisconsin game last year. You could just tell he was a few plays from breaking one. That fumble and ensuing TD by PSU effectively took him out of the rest of the game.

We certainly had the momentum up until the fumble. On that drive, it seemed like the wind was taken out of PSU's sails--we had more success on that drive running the ball than at any other time in the game. It was as if they were on the ropes physically and mentally. Unfortunately, they got a really lucky break. Not taking anything away from PSU, because I think they played a great game. However, if Pryor runs that play 100 times, I'd bet he only fumbles once. And the way the game was going, if Pryor gets a first down, with us up 6-3, around 10:00 to go with the ball in PSU territory and with the clock running, I really like our chances. I've said before that for a team to go undefeated and win a NC, it'll take at least one game that the ball just bounces your way and you get really lucky to come out of there with a W. Saturday night was that game for PSU.

 

[unionfutura]

Here's the thing

As soon as JT announced that Pryor would be the starting QB, he sent a signal to the team that the best chance to both win now and the future would be to start a true freshman. I didn't agree with that notion now, but I have to admit Pryor is doing better than expected IMO.

Sure the loss to Penn State was rough but that's a very veteran team with guys who got a ton of playing time during their careers, and we came within a whisker of taking them out. I didn't expect that.

We beat a mediocre Wisconsin team on the road snatching a win from them in final moments of a game. I didn't expect that.

I expect now this team to steamroll the rest of the big ten this year with Illinois the only team with a pulse to beat us. However JT is pretty good at motivating revenge scenarios. 10-2 probably gets us a BCS game, not bad for a true freshman.

As for Pryor's mistakes well good coaching will let him know that a desperation heave isn't a good choice when there's plenty of time on the clock to get what you can and get out of bounds.

I also agree the fumble was stupid, however in practice he's done that same thing in scrimmages and they praised him for his improvising.

I love Aaron Maybin's first step. Brutal for anyone to handle one-on-one.

 

[Fungo Squiggly]

Judging from the number of people who picked OSU to win this game in the various contests on the board, I feel like I'm in a very small minority. Most of you kept holding out hope that the team would somehow "wake up". I did too I suppose, but in the same way that I hope that a meteorite full of money will land in my backyard. There wasn't a lot of expectation attached to it.

As far as I recall, we were the only pessimists to pick a loss in the BP-SC contest. SO we've got that going for us. Which is nice.

I love Aaron Maybin's first step. Brutal for anyone to handle one-on-one.

Roger that. He's been abusing everyone he's gone against with the speed rush. The coaches had to have known that Browning wouldn't be able to handle him 1-on-1. Any play that had that matchup was in a world of trouble from the get-go.

 

[ysubuck]

Jim Tressel will be on the Big Show (Bruce Hooley, Chris Spielman, and Kirk Herbstriet is usually on on Mondays during the season) here in Columbus (1460 THE FAN) this afternoon. The show starts at 4:00 pm but I don't know what time Coach will be on.

This doesn't happen very often.

 

[MililaniBuckeye]

And there's no reason they should be the better team. We've underachieved big time. 7-2 with losses to the #1 and #3 teams looks alright on paper but this isn't like '05.

I got a news flash for ya...despite our "returning 20 starers" (including the kicker and punter), we weren't loaded to the brim with talent. Aside from Laurinaitis, Jenkins, Beanie, and Freeman, what other major talent did we have coming back? Boeckman has been replaced by a true freshman. Robo has still been fairly solid, but not what we expected. Hartline is in his own little world lately. Boone has been, well, Boone. And those are seniors I'm talking about. Note where the problems have mostly been--on offense. Aside from Beanie, we have no major playmakers amongst the returning starters. Beanie being hurt for three games didn't help either.

Bottom line is that while we have a pretty good team, the lack of development on offense has kept us from being a great team. Penn State loaded the box all fucking night because they knew we weren't going to throw the ball downfield. Pryor hasn't had the chance to get much passing experience so far this season because the OL rarely gives him time to learn how to go through his progressions. Because he hasn't learned yet, he fails to find open receivers (case in point in the PSU game, he threw an out pattern to the left sideline for a first down without even seeing the TE who was streaking down the middle with no one with five yards of him....a sure TD if Pryor saw him).

An 11-2 season (counting a major bowl win) with another win over Michigan would still be a great season...maybe not what many of us hoped for or even expected, but still better than about 90% of major college teams.

 

[BuckNutty]

Absolutely. Even spreading them out still leaves 7 on 5 in the box...Throw in a TE and you have 8 for sure. Motion can help, formation strength shifts can help, but ultimately it comes down to being able to punish the defense for getting so top heavy. That didn't happen.

I don't remember if it was Nicol or not, and I haven't mustered up the courage to watch it again, but there was a play where I think Nicol went right down the seam and likely would have scored. There were other opportunities where Pryor just underthrew his receiver or delivered the ball late.

Could have been more creative, could have executed a little better. Despite that had we played mistake free, like Penn State did, the Bucks probably get the W.

 

[jwinslow]

I don't remember if it was Nicol or not, and I haven't mustered up the courage to watch it again, but there was a play where I think Nicol went right down the seam and likely would have scored.

It was definitely a TE, would have to check the film (I was thinking Ballard).

There were other opportunities where Pryor just underthrew his receiver or delivered the ball late.

Yup, and that will come with time. I haven't had the heart to rewatch the film yet, but were there any risky throws the first 55 min, other than the bomb to Robiskie? I can certainly live with some slow decision making or missed reads much more than the throws into coverage you'd expect from a true frosh. But then again, he's already set different expectations above that stereotype.

 

[ScriptOhio]

So - does Penn State get mauled by Texas or Bama ...or Oklahoma? if they get to the BCS championship game?

Would you want JoPa to win it for the Big-10, or hope they get thumped because they are State Penn?

My guess is that it will be Texas vs Penn State for the BCS Championship. I can't see Alabama winning out; however, Texas could. If both Texas and Alabama lose a game, it will be Penn State vs USC. Texas has already beat Oklahoma, so the Sooners probably won't even get to the Big12 Championship game; that should be Texas vs Missouri.

I'd like to see JoPa win one for the conference. :)

 

[DaytonBuck]

Finally, when it takes a running back of the caliber of Beanie, Pittman or MoC to have ANY kind of running attack there's something seriously wrong with the line and the line coaching. When Beanie went down there was no running game to speak of. When MoC couldn't play UC was the equal of the National Champs. And how quickly we forget the time in between Mo and the Pittman/Beanie era when the bucks couldn't run a lick. That's the responsibility of the O-line.

I think now that there is a talent issue on the offense line. There seems in my opinion to issue with scheming with the offensive line. If you go back to the 2003 season we had Sims, Stepanovich, Olivea and Mangold that have all started in the NFL at one point or another. With 3 guys starting on that line that were good enough to start in the NFL the Bucks should have been able to control the line of scrimmage and have a good, not great, attack with Hall and Ross.

The play at USC where Todd got drilled and fumbeled sticks out to me. When the play happened and Boone blocked down and left TB wide open to get drilled by Matthews. Then in the post game I heard he was supposed to dump down to a safety valve. I can buy that TB made the wrong decison but by would you leave your QB open to a potential blitz on the blind side with no protection? It wasn't a 3 step drop if I remeber correctly or a quick passing play. That seems like a cardinal sin of pass protection to leave the QB open on the blind side.

 

[BuckeyeFan 52]

Sounded more like constructive criticism to me. Very much within the rules. And, it's rather agreeable too.

Not to get off subject, but I have to agree with MaxBuck here. Just a couple of weeks ago I posted that I felt that the current offensive line was no good, including the coaching of it. If I rememebr correctly, Bucky Katt (if not you then I apologize) called me out that I was "bashing" and I received a warning from BigDaddyBucks. Nothing I said was any worse than what LJB said in his original post.

Now, I have no problem with what LJB said, but this whole "bashing" thing is very grey, and it needs to be clearly defined so members are not being punished for things they don't believe are incorrect to say. All I'm asking for is fairness.

Please pardon my interruption, i saw that and I had to get it off of my chest.

 

[Fungo Squiggly]

Me? That can't be right. I would never do such a thing.

The bottom line is, the fact that our offensive efficiency is downright pathetic is due to absolutely horrific offensive line play and absolutely horrific offensive coaching. Yes, this offensive line has some injuries, and that's a big problem. But the starting lineup of Boone--Rehring--Cordle--Person--Browning just does not get it done. Boone is a very average 6'8" left tackle and Rehring and Person are 2 of the worst guards I've ever seen in scarlet and grey. I've never seen an Ohio State offensive line go 3-and-out and just walk over to the bench as if that's completely acceptable. And the worse part of it, the coaches let it happen. No intensity, no sense of urgency, and no sense of responsibility by anyone. It makes me sick. It's unacceptable. It's just not Ohio State football.

Pryor has been thrown into the fire with very little support up front. Brewster at center and Cordle at left guard is the correct first step, even though it took injuries to make that happen. The next correct step is for Boone, Rehring, and Person to hurry up and graduate and leave the program. I hate to say that, but the team will be improved when that happens.

Purdue has the worst defense in the Big Ten, that's how bad our offense was last week. Pryor is our quarterback. The decison was made. Bringing Todd Boeckman back simply undermines this offense.

Yes a win is a win, but that only counts in the NFL. In the BCS system, it's very much a beauty contest as well. Ohio State should beat Purdue 35-10. When they win 16-3 with no offensive TD's, the BCS says that's bad. I'm shocked we didn't move back in the polls. I don't agree with it, but that's just the way it is.

I recommend that rhetoric such as this be toned back a bit. :)

Above is what you posted and my response was in regard to the bolded portion. My comments were in regards to words such as "horrific" "pathetic" and "worst", not over the general sentiment being expressed. There is a notable difference in tone and wording between your post above and LJB's post below.

1) If last night had been my first experience with American football, then I'd never watch another game again. That was quite simply the lamest, ugliest excuse for a football game that I've ever seen, and both teams were equally at fault. The one and only big play in the entire game resulted from a boneheaded move on the simpliest play in football - the quarterback sneak (but more on that later). It wasn't a defensive slugfest ... it was offensive ineptitude at the highest level.

2) Terrelle Pryor is a true freshman, and we certainly expect him to make freshman mistakes. But his fumble on the aforementioned quarterback sneak was not a freshman mistake ... it was a stupid play. Pryor has played enough football to know that his job is to take the snap, follow his center, fall forward, gain eighteen inches, and go back to the huddle to call the next play. You can't become a hero on a quarterback sneak, Terrelle ... but you certainly can become a goat.

3) Before the year started, I thought that Pryor would win a game all by himself, and he did that at Wisconsin. And now he has the distinction of losing a game all by himself. It's generally pretty difficult to identify a single play throughout the course of a game that was the definitive turning point, but his fumble was that play. At that time, Ohio State was up 6-3, with 11:03 left in the game, with third down and inches to go. The Buckeyes had just run five straight times for a combined 22 yards, and had crossed into Penn State territory. The Nittanty Lions' defense looked like it was finally wearing down, and a successful quarterback sneak would have given the Buckeyes further momentum and a fresh set of downs ... and capping the drive with a touchdown would have essentially ended the game. But after the fumble, Penn State got the ball in great field position and eventually scored the game-winning touchdown against a rather dis-spiritied Ohio State defense. Although they had a final chance (see below), the Buckeyes never really recovered from that unfortunate play.

4) The fumble was definitely Terrelle Pryor's "Joe Pisarcik Moment", but he did have a chance to redeem himself at the end of the game. Down 13 to 6 with 1:07 left, the Buckeyes began their final drive of the game at their own 20-yard line after a touchback. Pryor completed a couple of passes to Ray Small to move the ball into Penn State territory, and then he tried to play the hero once again. After a fierce pass rush from Aaron Maybin (more on that later), Pryor rolled out to the right, set himself, somehow found Brian Hartline engulfed in a sea of white jerseys, and with plenty of time to throw launched a bomb into triple coverage that was promptly picked off. On that play, the four Penn State pass rushers were all caught inside, three pass defenders were following Hartline to the endzone, and the short zone on that side of the field had been vacated. Pryor was already near the right sideline, so all he had to do was take off running, gain ten or fifteen yards for the first down, go out of bounds to stop the clock, and then run the next play. But instead, Terrelle thought with his ego and not with his reason, and he went for the highlight reel play instead of the sure thing. Now of course, we can write that off as a "freshman mistake", but we also have to wonder if Pryor is one of those players who will always try to win the game all by himself ... and if that is the case, does he have the talent to do so? If the answer to the latter question is "yes", then we may have the next Vince Young in Columbus ... but if the answer is "no", then we might just have a problem on our hands....

5) Two big games, nine total points. That ain't gettin' it done, folks. It all starts up front, and after a few solid (but certainly not spectacular) games in a row, the Buckeyes' offensive line reverted to their true form ... getting blown up on running plays and blown by on passing plays. Blame the coaching all you want, but the talent ... and the depth ... just isn't there.

6) And another thing about the offensive line ... have the Buckeyes had a truly athletic offensive lineman since Orlando Pace? Maybe LeCharles Bentley and Nick Mangold, but that's about it. Brewster, Shugarts, and Adams seem to be a huge step up in terms of athleticism ... and Justin Boren is a proven commodity ... so let's hope that the offensive line gets a huge upgrade next season.

7) While the offense was anemic last night, the defense wasn't anything special. Yeah, they held the allegedly high-powered Nittany Lion offense to 13 points and 281 total yards (both season lows), but we all watched the game last night, and none of us was impressed with that Penn State team. The defense made no big plays (no turnovers, one sack), did nothing to change the momentum of the game, couldn't hold Penn State to a field goal after the Pryor fumble, and couldn't force the Lions to punt on their final drive. In general, the Buckeyes' defense got "out-hit" by the Lion's offense ... the Penn State offensive line won most of the battles in the trenches, and the Penn State ball carriers were consistently able to fight through tackles for extra yardage. Oh, it wasn't a bad game by the Buckeye defense by any means, but when they were called on to win the game in spite of the Buckeye offense, they just couldn't do it ... and that is what separates a truly great defense (2002) from a merely good defense (2008).

8) Penn State was called for exactly one penalty last night (it was declined by Ohio State). If those had been two SEC teams, then we'd all be saying that the officials (with orders from the league office) were trying to help the undefeated team stay undefeated so that they could get to the big money national championship game. But those were Big Ten officials last night, so we can just blame it on plain old incompetence.

9) I don't care what anyone says, games like last night's hurt worse than the blow-out losses. Yeah, we can try to rationalize those games away with a bunch of "what ifs", but in reality we know that our team got beat from start to finish by the likes of Florida, LSU, and USC. Last night, however, we really should have won the game, and but for perhaps the single most ill-advised, momentum-killing play in the history of Buckeye football, we probably would have won the game. And that just plain sucks....

10) Was it just me, or did the whole team seem flat for most of the game? For a homecoming night game against the #3 team in the country, it sure seemed like the visitors were way more pumped up than the home squad.

11) I am convinced that several players on this team "mailed in" the season from day one. Fortunately, they'll all be gone next year. No names, please, but I am not referring to Jenkins, Laurinaitis, or Boeckman....

12) This is Ohio State. There are no moral victories, no good losses, no learning experiences. The Buckeyes are supposed to win 80-90% of their games, and last night's contest was one that should have gone in the "win" column. No excuses.

13) After the USC game, I said that the Buckeyes' season was officially "over", and that Tressel should start Terrelle Pryor for the remainder of the year so that he could gain valuable experience for the 2009 season. It worked. Now I'm saying that the Big Ten season is officially "over", and that Tressel should open up the offensive play book so that Pryor can gain valuable experience for the 2009 season. Please listen....

 

[buckeyesin07]

I think now that there is a talent issue on the offense line. There seems in my opinion to issue with scheming with the offensive line. If you go back to the 2003 season we had Sims, Stepanovich, Olivea and Mangold that have all started in the NFL at one point or another. With 3 guys starting on that line that were good enough to start in the NFL the Bucks should have been able to control the line of scrimmage and have a good, not great, attack with Hall and Ross.

+1. Every year OSU has o-linemen drafted in the NFL draft. So it seems like the talent is there. Yet OSU has struggled to run the ball and pass protect at times in the past five years except for when a 5* like Beanie (or Pittman) is in the backfield (and even then, we struggle sometimes, like this year against PSU and Purdue). I'm not really sure what the problem is with the o-line, but it's been lingering for awhile now.