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NFL Discussion (Official Thread)

1. No it didn't. That was a time line indicator, not a cause and effect indicator. Since Tyreek left, Mahomes has regressed as a passer.


Why would Tyreek be relevant to this conversation if it wasnt cause and effect?

Otherwise you would have just said "Patrick Mahomes has regressed these past few years".


Less down field things, more Mickey Mouse bullshit that I despise.

Tyreek is gone and the OL has taken hits along with age. Less weapons and less time to push the ball vertically. Hence the things I pointed out...

- increased 21 personnel usage
- decreased depth of target
- more need for conversions and high percentage throws because the vertical game is gone.
- increased 1st down conversions percentage and plays per drive.

These things aren't just "blah blah blah stats" they tie directly into what you just said above.

2. I'm not saying they have talent beyond all other teams. I'm saying it's different, not all worldly. The Lions have talent all over the field in other areas, so they don't do things the way the Chiefs do. The Patriots with Tom Brady had different talent. The Raiders have 0 talent, so they can't do any of it. Just because I'm saying they have unique talent, doesn't mean I'm saying they have more talent than anybody. Specifically, they have Andy Reid and....until the last 2 years.....Kelce.

This makes no sense. You're just moving goal-posts. The Chiefs don't have unique talent, not anymore. I asked you why other teams with superior or comparable talent haven't done the same, and this word salad was your response. It's a non-answer at best.


Ok, I just have to come out with it - are you trolling me? Only thing that makes sense anymore.

Can anyone else who's reading along chime in and tell me that I'm the crazy one here? I know there's plenty of people reading.

Because it seems like your angle is to be intentionally obtuse.

You've still yet to answer the simple question - why Fields can't handle the exact same same rub concepts and RPOs that Mahomes does regularly? Why can't Fields connect on the same plays he's been given from pre-season until now?


 
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Why would Tyreek be relevant to this conversation if it wasnt cause and effect?

Otherwise you would have just said "Patrick Mahomes has regressed these past few years".
Because I didn't know how many years, so I picked a point in time that was semi recent. I didn't know I was going to have to defend my dissertation to justify my existence.
This makes no sense. You're just moving goal-posts. The Chiefs don't have unique talent, not anymore.
Maybe not to you.
No I'm not.
And yes they do. They have Andy Reid. Or whatever gremlin Andy Reid is stealing his ideas from.
Ok, I just have to come out with it - are you trolling me? Only thing that makes sense anymore.

Can anyone else who's reading along chime in and tell me that I'm the crazy one here? I know there's plenty of people reading.

Because it seems like your angle is to be intentionally obtuse.
Ignoring you being a dick, again.
You've still yet to answer the simple question - why Fields can't handle the exact same same rub concepts and RPOs that Mahomes does regularly? Why can't Fields connect on the same plays he's been given from pre-season until now?
I don't believe he's allowed to just snap and throw. Only he and the coaches in the room would know that. I watched him excel at Ohio State, so to my dipshit trolling obtuse Dunning Kruger point of view, the problem with NFL Fields is the speed of the game. Me being an absolute fucking moron that isn't worthy of sharing the same website as you thinks that he's taking too long to process, and waiting to see that people are open before throwing the ball. So my dumb fucking worthless piece of shit ass thought maybe if you completely remove the need to make reads, he'd process a little big quicker and be able to pass for more than 45 yards in a game. Maybe if he was allowed to make throws like this or this or this or this he'd crack the 50 yard mark. But I'm just a dumb asshole that is annoyed when Mahomes gets credit for being Dan Marino when an 80 yard bomb actually travels 5 yards in the air and the blocking and WR do the actual work.

OK maybe I lied. I didn't ignore it. Dickhead.
 
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This is a jet tap, which the Jets have used. It's just an extension of the running game. The Chiefs don't have a great RB situation, so they have to supplement their offense.



This is a pre-snap sight adjust and read of the overhang defender against the Lions two high shells. It requires a read pre AND post snap to verify the depth and width of the LB. This is punishing poor alignment by the defense and allowing your QB and WR to work off script. That's it. This probably isn't even an offensive install. This is an understanding by two veteran NFL players ... JuJu says to himself "Holy shit, I'm uncovered" Mahomes goes "Holy shit, he's uncovered" and they've earned the freedom to play off script by their coach.




This is just a misdirection to a shield screen with influence blocks from the OL. I've watched the jets run this a few times this year. I've watched a dozen teams run this and a version of this year.


or this he'd crack the 50 yard mark.

This is a pre/post snap read of the strongside Hook LB on Y stick. Also requires eyes and decision making pre and post snap. Once again punishes sloppy alignments and giving far too much cushion to a 6'5 250lb TE with 3 yards of space. Still a read.







Sometimes football CAN be that easy for certain things. But do you know what it takes to get to this point? To have the mastery of the playbook, the trust of your coaches, along with the chemistry of your pass catchers pre & post snap to get to what you're seeing? This isn't playing ball with your old man in the backyard and just calling routes, my guy.



More importantly, this isn't the bulk of the Chiefs offense, not even close. It's a small handful of cheap throws to create manufactured offense against bad defensive alignments.

One of the many reasons why the Jets can't get away with it as often as KC is because you can line up in simple structures and Fields will struggle to execute. He doesn't punish the basic, so defense don't find themselves having to deal with more complex motions and tempos because he can barely handle what is the NFL equivalent of elementary QB'ing.

For every throw you've posted here, I can post 2-3 more of high level QB play from Mahomes to counter your point within the same game alone.



And your point still boils down to this.

- You believe, that with these throws linked, Justin Fields can produce 80% of Mahomes.
- 80% would amount to 3,907 yards per season to hit that Mahomes 80% average
- Justin's highest season is 2562 yards passing
- Justin would need an additional 1,345 yards in a season just to reach that 80% production of P.M.
- An increase in yards of 52.5% passing yards per year.
- If Justin were to increase his BEST season total yardage of 2562 yards by 52.5%, he would still fall short of Patricks Worst
season at 3928 yards


That last part is incredibly important to keep in perspective. If you increased Justin Fields BEST passing year by 52.5% (rounded) he still would not surpass the total yards passing of Mahomes in Patricks worst year. Seems pretty nuts, huh?

You're welcome to post all the clips you like, but there hasn't, is not currently, and likely won't ever exist, ANY NFL offense that can take someone like Fields and turn him in to 80% of what Patrick Mahomes supplies given similar or same surrounding talent with any sort of consistency. The last part is also key. The dude is just that good and has played in an offensive system that went from Legion of Boom to Legion of Nope in a few seasons. Yet he still gets it done and finds ways to win despite the offensive (de) evolution.



There is no argument you can make, with any shred of proof, to justify your lack of belief or denouncing of Mahomes. And yes, Andy Reid is one hell of a coach. Feel free to link any and all plays away to your hearts content. The amount of them over a season still would not equate to the amount that a QB like Fields would need to be "80%" (your number) of Patrick.



But I'm just a dumb asshole that is annoyed when Mahomes gets credit for being Dan Marino when an 80 yard bomb actually travels 5 yards in the air and the blocking and WR do the actual work.

OK maybe I lied. I didn't ignore it. Dickhead.

Two things can be true and aren't mutually exclusive when it comes down to it.

- The slobbing over Patrick Mahomes is excessive and annoying and I agree entirely. He isn't god's gift to football.
- He is supremely talented, a top 5 QB by any measure, mostly top 3, and your assessment calling him anything else but that is wrong.
 
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