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Multiple shootings at Va Tech

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Buckeyedynasty;818253; said:
Problem is why does everyone think it is okay for the average american to take the law into their own hands?
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That isn't the point at all. Training is involved; in my case, by two experienced police officers, one for how to handle a gun and one for the CC course. However, a concealed carry permit is NOT permission to play law enforcement.

It simply means that if someone comes at you with intent to maim or kill, you do not have to simply wish it weren't so, or that the police were near enough to fight on your behalf. You do not have to simply hand over control of the situation to the the bad guys, knowing that your mourning family can be comforted by the fact that at least you, the dearly departed, didn't own one of those evil firearms. After all, if your killer lives through it, your family will be able to face him in court and have closure, right?

I suppose the argument is that if nobody has guns, then the risk doesn't exist. Not so. For one, gun control primarily takes firearms out of the hands of law-abiding citizens (and if I have access to guns not from stores, anybody does). There's also the issue that not all people are alike unarmed. There are very few men with whom I would win a battle. So when people started to get shot and beaten around my apartment, were trying to break into my apartment through my skylight, and multiple shootings took place within a block or two of work, I had to think about whether or not I had the right to survive a conflict... the answer was yes. Thus, the gun, and the training. I do think more training is always a good thing.

I'd never argue that someone who doesn't want a gun should get one; in fact, I'd rather see only someone tremendously serious about it carry one. Simply knowing someone around them is likely to be carrying will be a deterrent to most criminals. Might not stop a crazy person from trying, but could very well stop him or her from getting too far.
 
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Someone shoots at me or those around me, they get it back. It's that simple. This is the real world. Guns are out there. You can wish someone had one to save your ass, or you could have one. I get so sick of this idealistic idea that you can turn the clock back. You can't. Do I wish no one had the ability to do this kind of shit, sure I do. That's not real though. I didn't invent the gun. I didn't even get the chance to "vote for the gun". I did get the "them cocksuckers just shot at me" though, yes I did. You want to die because you had nothing else to do, fine, I will mourn for you. But I will not be mourned because of that kind of situation, period, end of story. I will win or die trying....Don't like it? Too fucking bad. Deal with it...
 
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Saw31;818293; said:
Someone shoots at me or those around me, they get it back. It's that simple. This is the real world. Guns are out there. You can wish someone had one to save your ass, or you could have one. I get so sick of this idealistic idea that you can turn the clock back. You can't. Do I wish no one had the ability to do this kind of shit, sure I do. That's not real though. I didn't invent the gun. I didn't even get the chance to "vote for the gun". I did get the "them cocksuckers just shot at me" though, yes I did. You want to die because you had nothing else to do, fine, I will mourn for you. But I will not be mourned because of that kind of situation, period, end of story. I will win or die trying....Don't like it? Too fucking bad. Deal with it...
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You okay buddy? Your posts tonight seem to have a hell of a lot of anger in them. :)
 
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Deety;818264; said:
That isn't the point at all. Training is involved; in my case, by two experienced police officers, one for how to handle a gun and one for the CC course. However, a concealed carry permit is NOT permission to play law enforcement.

It simply means that if someone comes at you with intent to maim or kill, you do not have to simply wish it weren't so, or that the police were near enough to fight on your behalf.
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Great points Deety. It is good to hear that all that training is involved with your situation. I was simply stating my situation as a low level law enforcement individual nothing more nothing less. It seemed to me by reading through some of the posts that a few people were thinking that if they had or because they have a gun that they have the right or ability to become involved in a situation such as the VT shooting. I was just saying if anyone is under that impression that I did not agree with them. Maybe I am wrong wouldn't be the first time. :wink2:
 
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Saw31;818298; said:
You're right. I've already editted some anger out of the other ones. However, this topic, I just can't help but be angry...And I'm sure that's something all of us feel with this bullshit situation...
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Agreed 100%. I am not a gun person never have been and probably never will be and you might be into guns. Like I've said different strokes for different folks. No matter what we believe on the issue it doesn't change the fact that some dumbass shot up a bunch of innocent people and nothing we say will change what has happend. The thing I like most about BP is that we can usually discuss the issue even if we don't all agree and as long as we talk about stuff like this we can learn from each other.

Also glad to hear you are ok. I just wondered if you were having a bad day or what because you seemed to be venting a bit in your last few posts. Hope all is well with the Saw man. :biggrin:
 
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Buckeyedynasty;818301; said:
Agreed 100%. I am not a gun person never have been and probably never will be and you might be into guns. Like I've said different strokes for different folks. No matter what we believe on the issue it doesn't change the fact that some dumbass shot up a bunch of innocent people and nothing we say will change what has happend. The thing I like most about BP is that we can usually discuss the issue even if we don't all agree and as long as we talk about stuff like this we can learn from each other.

Also glad to hear you are ok. I just wondered if you were having a bad day or what because you seemed to be venting a bit in your last few posts. Hope all is well with the Saw man. :biggrin:
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I'm fine. Should've went straight to the drunk thread and skipped all the poli stuff until tomorrow. This thread pisses me off. Not because of the posters, it's like you said.............WTF!!................Don't you feel that..................how do you explain it................"Ahhhhhh, if someone just could've blasted this dickhead asshole douchebag cocksucker piece of shit cumdumpster sonofabitch right in the fucking face, some people would still be here".....But what the fuck do I know anyway....
 
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Saw31;818302; said:
I'm fine. Should've went straight to the drunk thread and skipped all the poli stuff until tomorrow. This thread pisses me off. Not because of the posters, it's like you said.............WTF!!................Don't you feel that..................how do you explain it................"Ahhhhhh, if someone just could've blasted this dickhead asshole douchebag cocksucker piece of shit cumdumpster sonofabitch right in the fucking face, some people would still be here".....But what the fuck do I know anyway....
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WOW. I feel you are holding back a bit tonight you really gotta try to let it out. :lol: I know what you mean though it is a very frustrating incident to talk about and try to come to terms with it. Imagine if you were directly linked to it or were there that day....hard to imagine that is for sure.
 
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Buckeyedynasty;818303; said:
WOW. I feel you are holding back a bit tonight you really gotta try to let it out. :lol: I know what you mean though it is a very frustrating incident to talk about and try to come to terms with it. Imagine if you were directly linked to it or were there that day....hard to imagine that is for sure.
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Well, as I alluded to in a post above, I've been in a situation where I was running for my life because the only person who had a gun was one of these cocksucking pieces of shit douchebags. Not a massacre, I'm not trying to say that, but I was in a situation where someone would have survived if I had the means to "change the outcome". Oh yeah, it changes you. There's no doubt. And until you've heard the bullets bouncing off the ground in front of you, I really don't think anyone understands the anger and pissed offedness and hatred and fucking fuck fuck this will give you...Never again for me. Never...
 
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Saw31;818307; said:
Well, as I alluded to in a post above, I've been in a situation where I was running for my life because the only person who had a gun was one of these cocksucking pieces of shit douchebags. Not a massacre, I'm not trying to say that, but I was in a situation where someone would have survived if I had the means to "change the outcome". Oh yeah, it changes you. There's no doubt. And until you've heard the bullets bouncing off the ground in front of you, I really don't think anyone understands the anger and pissed offedness and hatred and fucking fuck fuck this will give you...Never again for me. Never...
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Fair enough. Glad you made it out okay. :)
 
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Buckeyedynasty;818309; said:
Fair enough. Glad you made it out okay. :)
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I suppose "making it out ok" is debatable tonight eh? I deleted some of the other posts to keep the peace. It was the right thing to do me thinks...:lol:

EDIT: And I wish I could've been timed in the "40" on that day...Fuck Ted Ginn, he would've been eating my dust....:biggrin:
 
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It's very simple to me. I won't be a "victim" if I can help it. I have a gun. I carry a gun. I will use it only to protect my life and property and the life of another person. I don't go around looking for someone to shoot. I hope I never have to use it.
On the other hand I no longer have an "it won't happen to me' hang up. Any of you who want to preach the idea of a gunless world can be the victims, or the family of victims. You can be among those who wail and moan because of the loss of live and deride society for not having a law enforcement person readily at hand to "protect". Just think of all the people associated with the VT incident who I bet now wish that there had been one person around who had the means and compulsion to end that incident earlier at the savings of many lives.
There will not be protection against criminals or the mentally unbalanced. We have to protect ourselves.
I sure as hell intend to protect myself and not be a victim. Good luck to the rest of you.
 
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Ohio did a good bit of research before the concealed carry law was brought in. What they found was that crime actually went down in other states b/c the criminals now know that law abiding citizens are armed and will not become a victim to the criminals. The criminals don't follow the laws anyway, so they will have guns anyway. But now they have to wonder if guy sitting at the stop light has one too...and maybe think twice before trying to rob him.

Most of the cops I work with are very pro concealed carry. It's the old saying..."Guns don't kill people. People kill people."
 
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