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Is this the future of college football?

Jaxbuck;1918770; said:
Personally I'm more worried about the future of the concept of accountability than sports.
I understand this outlook. And it's a valid concern.

I'm also concerned about the fact that people put moral judgments on things as ridiculous as whether one avoids trans fats in their foods. Moral judgment should be reserved for the really important stuff IMO - and NCAA compliance is not, again IMO, really important stuff. Whether it's Auburn or Ohio State; I just can't see generating moral outrage over whether Boom Herron gets cut a 20% price break when he buys his 2005 Corolla from Jack Maxton.

I understand the NCAA compliance people see things differently, and I guess I'd be really bad at being an NCAA compliance person.
 
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This thread is awesome. Never before on any message board I have read some many differing opinions that I see good points being made. This is what makes Buckeyeplanet the BEST, this hasn't turned into "I'm right your wrong, I'm smart your f'n stupid".

Now I will have to agree 100% with a little in each post, so far. The only major thing that I have to point out is this, the jackasses at espn are not the one's doing the journalistic work. Almost all of the major stories lately have been broken by yahoo, SI, NY Times, or FoxSports. The 4 letter just gets it and runs with it so much that it seems like they are actually doing work or they just confirm what the others have reported.

Now I will not and never will excuse the pinheads for what and how they report stuff I have just choosen to turn their crap off. It is extremely difficult to live without them, damn them for creating my addiction to sports, but I have been mostly successful so far and as long as the BigTen and NFL Networks exists I should be OK until the fall.

If I had the billions that it would require to open a network I would right now because I have a feeling that there are many other fan bases that feel the same way we do. I just can't wait to hear all the moaning that is going to come when they fall out of love with the SEC, god I hate that league, and start going after them. Oh wait aren't they doing that with Auburn? Oh that's all done with since Cecil stayed away from the NC game :shake:
 
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Jaxbuck;1918770; said:
This.

Lets get down off the cross and use the wood for something more productive. It wasn't "gotcha" journalism that fucked Jim Tressel, it was Jim Tressel that fucked Jim Tressel.

If using the Freedom of Information Act to pour through 1000's of e-mails and texts to nail a big-time school isn't gotcha journalism, then I don't know what is.
 
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Thump;1918867; said:
If using the Freedom of Information Act to pour through 1000's of e-mails and texts to nail a big-time school isn't gotcha journalism, then I don't know what is.

Wasn't someone looking into conference expansion when these emails were found?

It's still JT's fault. Can't blame someone else for uncovering it.
 
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Its good training for them for when they get in the real world and have to watch billions of dollars change hands between the large companies they work for without getting much of it.



There is no analogy for NCAA basketball and football in terms of the enormous sums of money generated on the backs of people who do not share equitably in the wealth.

The rules were put in place to create a level playing field in the same sense that vaguely comparable rules are needed in recreational softball leagues. But the explosion of dollars the past two decades has changed that.

What does a kid not being able to sell his own autograph have to do with a level playing field? Why is it that OSU can sell thousands of #2 jersey's but #2 can't sell his own personal property? What does the requirement that everyone stay in school for three years have to do with a level playing field?

There is no question that if you allowed players to start cashing in inequitably on their inequitable talents college football would change in ways we can not fully anticipate and would morph into something that would likely please neither of us. And for that reason I am happy with the status quo. And certainly the folks who profit from CFB today are quite happy to keep revenues flowing as they are.

But they are happy in the same sense that the owner of a manufacturing plant is happy to run a non-union shop. So don't suggest it benefits the players. And let's stop asking why college sports continue their current glide slope when the very underpinnings are driven by greed. Did I miss the thread where the NCAA has proposed such "field leveling" tactics as a cap on ticket prices and coaches salaries? Have any of the 14 most highly paid NCAA officials (all making over $270,000 per year) requested free tuition towards a doctorate degree in lieu of salary? Or are we still focused on making sure a car dealership that wants to give a kid a good deal on an SUV is unable to do so?

The NCAA is a non-taxed not for profit organization that does as good a job of maximizing revenues (3 BILLION dollars over the next 12 years for the PAC 10 alone) and minimizing expenses (what's that walk-on doing at the training table?) as any organization I can think of.
 
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Oh8ch;1918878; said:
There is no analogy for NCAA basketball and football in terms of the enormous sums of money generated on the backs of people who do not share equitably in the wealth.

The rules were put in place to create a level playing field in the same sense that vaguely comparable rules are needed in recreational softball leagues. But the explosion of dollars the past two decades has changed that.

What does a kid not being able to sell his own autograph have to do with a level playing field? Why is it that OSU can sell thousands of #2 jersey's but #2 can't sell his own personal property? What does the requirement that everyone stay in school for three years have to do with a level playing field?

There is no question that if you allowed players to start cashing in inequitably on their inequitable talents college football would change in ways we can not fully anticipate and would morph into something that would likely please neither of us. And for that reason I am happy with the status quo. And certainly the folks who profit from CFB today are quite happy to keep revenues flowing as they are.

But they are happy in the same sense that the owner of a manufacturing plant is happy to run a non-union shop. So don't suggest it benefits the players. And let's stop asking why college sports continue their current glide slope when the very underpinnings are driven by greed. Did I miss the thread where the NCAA has proposed such "field leveling" tactics as a cap on ticket prices and coaches salaries? Have any of the 14 most highly paid NCAA officials (all making over $270,000 per year) requested free tuition towards a doctorate degree in lieu of salary? Or are we still focused on making sure a car dealership that wants to give a kid a good deal on an SUV is unable to do so?

The NCAA is a non-taxed not for profit organization that does as good a job of maximizing revenues (3 BILLION dollars over the next 12 years for the PAC 10 alone) and minimizing expenses (what's that walk-on doing at the training table?) as any organization I can think of.

It's no different than any institution that controls the means of production.

The worker(player in this case) needs them(factory/school) more than they need the worker. Ergo they have the power, the worker is lucky to make a living. He can't pick up his tools and work(play) anywhere he chooses, they can bring in the next worker (high school hot shot athlete) anytime they want from a large, deep readily accessible labor pool.

It's no different than the real world for anyone who isn't a knowledge worker. As we move into the information age and the sun sets on the industrial age you will see less and less of this as knowledge workers do indeed control the means of production, they can indeed ply their trade anywhere they choose. In the meantime, it really is no different than a factory worker getting paid an hourly wage while GM sells the car he helps build for $30K.

CEO's of major corporations make a ridiculous amount of money compared to almost anyone else in the organization. Where is the outrage over that? Do they give up personal income to set up any kind of benefit for the workers?

The NCAA is like any 501c3, it has a mission that it is supposed to achieve and it has to be run professionally in order to do that mission. Charity's learned a long time ago that you have to bring in professional management and pay them comparable wages to what they would make in the for profit world if they wanted their charitable organization to last and achieve its mission. People who are qualified to run multi billion dollar operations don't do so for free because they can go to a for-profit multi billion dollar operations and easily get paid six figure incomes.

So long story short, in my eyes, this is no different than the real world. Nurses run the hospitals but the administrators get paid the most, NCO's run the military but officers get the money. A few manual laborers and some robotics guys make the cars, the CEO of Ford is the rock star.

Welcome to the real world kids, take advantage of the free education and enjoy the rock star status for the next 4-5 years. It will go by fast.
 
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Oh8ch;1918918; said:
Seriously?

Absolutely.

Ohio State is the brand. The school's management of the brand and marketing efforts fill a 100K seat stadium with people there to watch Ohio States football team. As long as the aggregate talent level of the team meets the customers basic expectations they will show up to watch regardless of the specific names on the back of the jersey.

On the flip side of it, say a high profile guy like Pryor decides he doesn't want to let a school make money off him for free. What are his choices out of high school? Can't go the NFL right away. 100K aren't going to show up to watch him play lower level football. He's screwed, he has no control because he doesn't own anything of real value.

So who controls the means of production? The owner of the property, in this case the property is the brand. Pryor is gone tomorrow and people will still come watch OSU football. OSU football is gone tomorrow no one cares what happens to Pryor.

Just like the real world. GM shuts down a plant and the factory worker has no job, factory worker gets hit by a bus and the GM plant stays open, new worker is hired, life goes on. GM owns the means of production not Joe employee.
 
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BUCKYLE;1918793; said:
Yeah...but at least they'll get some.

What do you base this on? I have worked for companies where the owners do nothing but line their pockets and haven't gotten jack [Mark May].....I have watched owners drive Hummers and Land Rovers and buy them for their kids and then argue with me over spending a $100 on memory for a computer that makes money for them.
 
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At what point in time will there be minor league football and basketball, just like baseball and hockey?

You want to stop all of this nonsense at the college level with these two sports, then make minor leagues where the guys who are interested in earning money and don't want to go to class or care about a college education can play and make money.
 
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BUCKYLE;1918965; said:
Who works for a company without compensation?

I thought you meant share the wealth, beyond your everyday paycheck. Even then what about companies who lay people off without a care while they still make oodles of money....been there and experienced that as well...
 
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buckeyebri;1918970; said:
At what point in time will there be minor league football and basketball, just like baseball and hockey?

You want to stop all of this nonsense at the college level with these two sports, then make minor leagues where the guys who are interested in earning money and don't want to go to class or care about a college education can play and make money.
Basketball players can go to Europe like Brandon Jennings.

I don't understand why more obvious one-and-dones don't do this. Sounds like a sweeter deal than pretending to be a student for 8 months.
 
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