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Indians Tidbits (2009 season)

NFBuck;1542709; said:
At this point I've totally written him off as a one year wonder. He's Joe Charboneau on the mound.

carmona is a headcase, period. it's obvious that carl willis isn't getting through to him. but given the large amount of indian pitchers that are unable to throw strikes on a consistent basis, it's starting to become quite the trend.

it shouldn't matter as he and Wedge are not long for this organization.
 
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buckeyemania11;1543256; said:
well at least this year they arent making some bullshit second half rally

another loss today

84 losses

hopefully this mess gets Wedge canned

sending laffey back out for that final inning was beyond stupid. i honestly believe cleveland's pitching improves next year by simply getting someone that has any sort of idea of how to manage the pitching staff.
 
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NFBuck;1542466; said:
1. They now have one of the deepest farm systems in baseball.

2. One of the reason's for that is the pitching. Some of them may be a couple years off, but saying they "have no pitching for the future" is just false.

Personally, I feel better about the direction they're taking than I have in a long time. Gonna be a couple lean years, but they'll be better for it in the long run. Sadly, it's the only way teams outside of NY, BOS, CHI, STL or LA can compete.
I don't mean to be argumentative because I think our passion for the Indians is on a par. That being said having one of the deepest farm teams in the majors means absolutely nothing to me because I have seen too many guys, who were Joe DiMaggio in the minor leagues but were busts once they hit the majors. You just mentioned Super Joe and there have been others.

I guess your definition and my definition of future has quite a bit more patience in it. I would not mind waiting until 2011 for the team to be competitive but do you really see that in 2 years because I can't see the guys from Lake County, Kingston, and Akron being ready to take as deep as World Series contenders in 2011.

I guess to sum it up. Life is too short and I guess I would like to see one last title run before short catches up on me:)
 
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LitlBuck;1544372; said:
I don't mean to be argumentative because I think our passion for the Indians is on a par. That being said having one of the deepest farm teams in the majors means absolutely nothing to me because I have seen too many guys, who were Joe DiMaggio in the minor leagues but were busts once they hit the majors. You just mentioned Super Joe and there have been others.

I guess your definition and my definition of future has quite a bit more patience in it. I would not mind waiting until 2011 for the team to be competitive but do you really see that in 2 years because I can't see the guys from Lake County, Kingston, and Akron being ready to take as deep as World Series contenders in 2011.

I guess to sum it up. Life is too short and I guess I would like to see one last title run before short catches up on me:)

I can understand the frustration, but this is the only way an organization like the Indians can hope to keep up with the Yankees and Red Sox of the world. They have to rely on younger players that are developed from within and acquired in trades for stars that they won't be able to resign. It's how they built the core for their runs in the 90's and it's how they became competitive again the past few years. Unfortunately, it's difficult to sustain that success when you just don't have the money to compete with the major market teams on the FA market.

They could have kept Victor and Cliff for another year on the very slim hope they could make a run next year, but then you risk their value dropping. On top of that, with all the holes on this team now, I don't see Victor and Cliff being anywhere near enough to make this team a legitimate competitor. Even if they were to sneak into the playoffs next year (highly unlikely), they don't have the horses to get far and then you lose Victor and Cliff anyway and lose out on all the youth they acquired this summer, setting back any rebuild even further.

It's a vicious circle, but as a fan of a small market ballclub, it's all we have.
 
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They could have kept Victor and Cliff for another year on the very slim hope they could make a run next year, but then you risk their value dropping.
the more I see Carrasco pitch the more [censored]ed I am about the Cliff Lee trade, I know hes young but he looks absolutely terrible

Marson is nothing more than a filler with Carlos Santana waiting in the shadows and Donald is nothing more than a utility IF at best

Knapp better turn out to be a good pitche
 
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and great news on Knapp already........

Prospect Knapp scheduled for surgery | MLB.com: News

MINNEAPOLIS -- Less than two months after the Indians made him a key acquisition in the trade that sent reigning Cy Young Award winner Cliff Lee to the Phillies, Jason Knapp is headed to the surgeon's table.

Knapp, a hard-throwing, 19-year-old right-hander, will have arthroscopic surgery on his right shoulder Tuesday, head athletic trainer Lonnie Soloff announced Monday. The procedure will be performed by Dr. David Altchek in New York City.

The Indians knew they were receiving damaged goods, to some degree, when they acquired Knapp as part of the six-player trade in which they parted with Lee and outfielder Ben Francisco and also received right-hander Carlos Carrasco, catcher Lou Marson and infielder Jason Donald. But the fact that Knapp has loose bodies in his shoulder and needs surgery was information the club was not privy to on July 29.

Yet Knapp is expected to make a full recovery from the surgery in time to have a normal Spring Training, Soloff said. The Indians still like Knapp, so they will not, according to general manager Mark Shapiro, be filing a grievance against the Phillies.

Still, Monday's news made it clear the Indians didn't know the full extent of what they were getting into when they acquired Knapp.

"In the case of trades, you request all the information that's available," Soloff said. "The information we reviewed, and the conversations from doctor to doctor and medical staff to medical staff, did not reveal any pathology that would warrant surgical intervention."

But Soloff made it clear that he did not believe the Phillies hid anything from the Tribe. They simply had never subjected Knapp, who was on the DL at Class A Lakewood with right biceps tendinitis at the time of the trade, to an MRI. So the Phillies had no MRI for the Tribe to review, and the Indians were not in a position to request one.

"I don't think Philly was disingenuous at all," Soloff said. "Having said that, this was clearly a pre-existing condition."

Knapp was in the midst of a return-to-throw program when he changed organizations. He recovered enough to make four starts for his new team at Lake County, posting a 5.40 ERA. But toward the end of the season, he complained of lingering soreness and was shut down.

The Indians' medical staff examined Knapp and determined surgery was necessary. Altchek provided a second opinion and concurred with that diagnosis.

Should Knapp recover as planned, the Indians view him as a power arm with high upside. His fastball has been clocked at 98 mph, and he struck out 123 batters in 97 innings this season.

But in a high-profile trade that didn't sit well with the fan base, the Indians haven't gotten much in the way of immediate returns. Knapp is bound for surgery, Carrasco has a 9.64 ERA in three starts, and Donald landed on the DL at Triple-A Columbus with a lower back injury that prevented him from being ready for a September promotion.

good going shapiro

trade a cy young pitcher for utility players and questionable pitching prospects
 
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NFBuck;1544582; said:
Man, this offense has gone completely to sleep these past couple weeks...15 games remaining in the Wedge era after tonight. :groove:

I think a v-bet is in store here

id be willing to bet that mongo is still the Indians manager to start the 2010 season

the upper management is just that stupid
 
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