Indians Tidbits (2006 season)..

[Piney]

Why is Coco getting all of this love? Sorry but I am not that enamored over him as my fellow tribe fans. And to get talent you have to trade for talent. It is almost as funny as everyone yelling at Dolan for not spending money. Yeah, let's overspend on players just so the fans are happy we "spent money". Spending money don't mean nothing if they are only good for 1 year and then the next 3-4 years of the contract we are complaining why we ever signed the guy in the first place. But back to Coco.

Coco is an average defender with a HORRIBLE arm. Boston is actually getting a worse arm in the outfield than Damon, and that is hard to do. Hitting wise I never liked Coco's approach. For a "speed" guy he doesn't act like it. He rarely walks is not an ideal 2 hole hitter.

Now what did we get. The main piece is Marte. A 3B prospect that will spend this year in AAA. He wasn't ready in Atlanta when they brought him up last year, so it showed. But he is still a top prospect. And it isn't like Atlanta gave him away. They did get Edgar Renteria, not exactly chopped liver. They made a quick decision that Chipper is moving back to 3B to stay so that will block Marte, so time to trade him to get the best value back which they did. Why does Boston trade him? Because Boston can't wait on a rookie to develop and they probable got him to trade him from day 1.

What people are forgetting is we got another guy in that trade too. Mota! All the people complaining about not bringing back Howry, well we got someone that is better and actually is a better closer candidate than Howry. So don't overlook him in this trade.

 

[exhawg]

Hopefully this trade means that young guys like Franklin Gutierrez are close to being ready for the big time. IMO Coco is expendable since he isn't best suited for a corner outfield position. The Tribe needs to upgrade all four corner positions before they can really challenge for a World Series.

 

[tsteele316]

Marte put up better #'s in AAA last year than Peralta did in his final stint in Buffalo, and he is younger. It's very likely he will be a September call up when rosters get expanded. If Boone languishes in the .150's for the first few months of the season like last year, he may be up sooner.

The ans may not like the move immediately, but it will pay dividends down the line.

However, if Crisp wasn't asking for $3 mil+ then this may not even be an issue.

 

[JCOSU86]

The ans may not like the move immediately, but it will pay dividends down the line.

We have been listening to this for 3 years now. Time to piss or get off the fucking pot. These players are producing. Trading for pie-in-the-sky-this- guy-has-great-upside bullshit should be over.

 

[osustamm]

From Rotoworld talking about Boston's Best Prospects

http://fantasybaseball.rotoworld.com/content/story.asp?sport=MLB&storyid=19141


1. Andy Marte - 3B - DOB: 10/21/83 - ETA: April 2007
.275/.372/.506, 20 HR, 74 RBI, 83/64 K/BB, 0 SB in 389 AB for Triple-A Richmond
.149/.236/.234, 0 HR, 3 RBI, 10/6 K/BB, 0 SB in 47 AB for Atlanta

Marte’s bad 47-at-bat stint for the Braves should hardly qualify as a setback, not when he was so productive in Triple-A as a 21-year-old. The only real source of concern now is the mysterious right elbow injury, which came to light after he was traded to Boston for Edgar Renteria. His agent dismissed the report of him possibly requiring Tommy John surgery as nonsense. Even if Marte did need the surgery and missed 2006 as a result, he’d still be a fabulous prospect. His defense at third base, once a weak point, continues to improve, and he’ll be a .280 hitter with 30 homers and 60-70 walks per year in his prime. Another three to six months in Triple-A should be sufficient.

Reports have Marte on his way to Cleveland for Coco Crisp. It’d be an incredibly short-sighted move for Boston.

 

[vrbryant]

Don't go, Coco.

Anyway, creepy man-crushes aside (yeah, I said it. So what?), I don't see why you'd get rid of a guy who is already so proficient at such a young age. Does his game have flaws? Of course it does. But you know what you're getting. .300+ average. 15, maybe 20 HRs, and 15, maybe 20 SBs. Or 30 if they let him. 70-80 RBIs, and perfectly acceptable defense in left. Do you want more power there? And a better arm? Sure. I bet we'd all like to be driving Aston Martins while getting road head from Scarlett Johansson, too. Gonna happen? No. Here's my thinking. This team was one series away from making the postseason last year. These guys did it. Not Andy fucking Marte. I'm not saying losing Coco would break the team, or tear some irreparable hole in the lineup, but why fuck with it? Why give away a 26-year-old switch hitter with 20-20 skills for a roll of the dice?

Furthermore, since when is Mota such a hot commodity? Anyone want to see his ERA since leaving LA?

 

[tsteele316]

We have been listening to this for 3 years now. Time to piss or get off the fucking pot. These players are producing. Trading for pie-in-the-sky-this- guy-has-great-upside bullshit should be over.

the bottom line is that crisp will probably never have a season that equals what he did last year. he's an average defender that throws like Lamar from Revenge of the Nerds. He's not a good base stealer and not a power hitter like the Indians need.

 

[JCOSU86]

the bottom line is that crisp will probably never have a season that equals what he did last year. he's an average defender that throws like Lamar from Revenge of the Nerds. He's not a good base stealer and not a power hitter like the Indians need.

I agree with that. What he does have is a .300 avg at the Major League level. He also brings an enthusiasm to the game.

Marte seems to be all potential.

 

[exhawg]

If Marte turns out to be 70% as good as it sounds like he can be this will be a good move for the Tribe. I like Coco, but he isn't the left fielder that the Indians need in the long run. If they can trade him for a potential superstar at one of their other need positions then go for it. Heck if Boone starts playing better they could always pull a Thome and move him over to first to make room for Marte. Boone is probably a good enough fielder to play LF as well.

 

[vrbryant]

the bottom line is that crisp will probably never have a season that equals what he did last year.

...why is that? Two seasons ago, he was .297 with 15 HRs, 71 RBI and 20 SBs. Last year he was .300 with 16 HRs, 69 RBI and 15 SBs. Last year wasn't some fluke. It was another solid year from a guy with nothing but solid years ahead of him. He's twenty-six years old.

 

[tsteele316]

...why is that? Two seasons ago, he was .297 with 15 HRs, 71 RBI and 20 SBs. Last year he was .300 with 16 HRs, 69 RBI and 15 SBs. Last year wasn't some fluke. It was another solid year from a guy with nothing but solid years ahead of him. He's twenty-six years old.

what everyone is forgetting is that this deal is likely to be 86'd if Cleveland doesnt make a deal with Philly to get Michaels. He is a better outfielder defensively and hit .304 last year, however, he wasnt an every day player. He is a much better option at the #2 spot, and has a better OBP. I would gladly trade crisp for someone of that production, at half the salary, and take Marte.

The other issue that most fail to realize because they arent looking at the big picture, is the options at 3B in the future. Boone's contract is up after this year. It's hard enough to find a quality power hitting 3B. When you look at the FA market in the next few years, it looks even worse.

Is the move a big risk/reward move? yes. but look at shapiro's track record in that area.

 

[JCOSU86]

YOu're probably right, t. I just like Coco's production and enthusiasm. Not to mention his name.

 

[tsteele316]

YOu're probably right, t. I just like Coco's production and enthusiasm. Not to mention his name.

don't get me wrong, this will not go over well with the cleveland fanbase. but most of them were ready to beat boone with cattle prods going into july of last year. they didn't like it when colon was traded, they didn't like it when manny and thome walked. the bottom line is that each of those moves helped the club in the long run. until shown other wise, i will operate under the guise that this move will as well.

of course if marte ends up like phillips or escobar, then shapiro will take some much warranted shit.

 

[billmac91]

This is going to be a move we regret....Coco will continue to improve, prob around a .310-.315 batting average next year, while we wait for marte to develop and use michaela or davanon in left field.....the thought of michaels and blake as our corner outfielders is actually worse than boone and broussard as our corner infielders....can't wait to watch michales turn into a possible everyday player who hits .260 or Davnon who might hit .255.....this sucks

 

[vrbryant]

If we want power at third, there's always Russell Branyan.