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- Thread starter NJ-Buckeye
- Start date
*sigh*
This might get fairly long I apologize ahead of time and warn those who don't want to read a page of words. These are all obviously my opinion so have yours or don't doesn't matter.
Bottom line is Ryan Day is not the guy. That, in a nutshell, is my conclusion. Now, let me tell you why.
This is as much about what is coming as what has happened. What has happened is hellish and been screamed and pounded into the air nonstop from the time he stepped on campus. He took over for a guy who NEVER lost to ttun including against the same head coach. We should stop comparing him to that guy because he is not even similar to that guy in any facet.
What has happened is the program has become an NFL breeding ground for future stars. No doubt this is the most ridiculous run of talent tOSU has ever put into the league. We have had the greatest Ohio State QB of all time in the past 4 years and a few other first rounders. Probably the greatest WR but that might be more debatable as well as slew of first rounders that are so good they are taking over the league. We've also had numerous first round OL, DL, DBs go and on and on... They have 1 B1G Championship in a Covid year and a Rose Bowl win. They lost any playoff game they had in that timeframe and couldn't beat ttun which is more egregious. The team was called out for being "soft" in media outlets which were numerous, not just Lou Holtz. The "we are tough" tirade looked like a bunch of bullshit from half the people who saw it and great for team morale by the other half. It proved nothing. The softness wasn't about guys being tough physically and being able to play the game, the softness was the teams' mental approach to the game. Lately that has also been noted and addressed by former players and numerous other folks on this site and others. The leadership on the field improved this year but what about the leadership on the sidelines and from the booth? Brian Hartline has saved this programs bacon for the past 5+ years with his recruiting and player development. I can't look at the staff and say that about anyone else except maybe coach alford but his group can't stay healthy. Day has made changes to the staff but it was like pulling teeth to get that done. I think the Knowles hire was a good one but the personnel management needs to improve greatly. You can't have and exhausted group on the field when the game is on the line late. Play enough players during the year that everyone gets a chance to be on the field when it counts so that this shit doesn't happen!
Day runs the Offense. His play calling is for the most part pitiful and more serious, distracting. If you are worried about calling the right plays you aren't paying close enough attention to what your staff is doing in those situations. You can dictate your strategy on the head set while managing your staff without calling the exact plays. "I want to push the run this series, quarter, half, etc." You better damned well be paying attention to units that keep putting the team in negative situations, i.e. Parker Flemings awful Special Teams!! You can also talk to your players more without calling plays and get their feedback without wasting freaking timeouts. You also need to be putting young guys in the game and play the same playbook so that when your All American's move on you don't have unprepared, inexperienced players trying to win a B1G Championship and beat ttun at the end of the year. There is no development of underclassmen happening outside of practice on this football team right now except when they are forced into the fire due to injury. A ton of credit have to go to coaches Eliano and Walton for having guys ready to step in and ball out like they did for the season. RB's were all ready but for some reason we sat Hayden on the bench all season. Guess what, guys who play at Ohio State aren't going to stay for 4 years if you are doing your job so quit redshirting skill players!! QB? Not so much. WR? Hell who knows outside of Tate. OL? Dont be ridiculous. TE? Looks like guys have their areas of strength and weakness, so use them accordingly. Would have liked to see Thurman maybe try to get out and block on those never ending fucking WR screens being called and see if that monstrosity could get it done. If you are going to keep calling stupid ass plays at least maybe change the personnel so that we can actually see if it's the players or the ignorant play calls/designs. The biggest bright spots have been in the community for this team which are exemplary and not getting into any trouble, which is no small thing.
No B1G Champioship. No win against TTUN. No National Championship. Close doesn't count at Ohio State. Reminds you of someone else for sure.
What is coming is a whole new animal. The staff has rolled with the NIL punches about as well as they could be I'd say. I don't personally believe in buying any players up front but by all means get them as much money as possible once they lose their black stripes and become a real part of the team in Columbus. That may not be how other schools are doing it, but, this isn't other schools. The Portal is absolute chaos and I can guarantee that coaches are using as a Free Agent draft, especially down south. This area is going to have to get better right now if we are going to keep competing for National Championships. Until the rules change, it just is what it is. The biggest change coming up is a 12-team Playoff. 12 teams is embarrassing. A chimpanzee and 3 trained seals could coach the Buckeyes to a 12-team playoff. The talent alone is going to win 10 games even with shit strategies and special teams. And, this is the reason why the "who are you going to get to replace him" argument is no longer a defense for failing. It doesn't really matter who you get as long as Brian Hartline is here and the rest of your staff aren't complete freaking morons. Recruit the talent here and unleash it. There are only really 2 games a year in Columbus right now; Penn State and TUN. If you lose the other conference games right now you should be immediately fired because they aren't very good. Fick and Rhule may change some of that and the West Coasters might bring some better teams in so that's still to be determined. 10-2 and sometimes, 9-3 are going to make the college football playoff in the future. Our worst coach percentage-wise in the last 50 years, Coach Bruce, won 9 games by getting out of bed but he beat ttun 5 times while only losing it 4 times. Ryan Day is one loss away from that total, IN A ROW!
Next season is going to see a completely overhauled Defensive personnel from the best Defense we've had in a long time, though they still underachieved. The best combo of WR's in the country is gone as well as the best back on the roster, so actually being better than this year is doubtful. Unless they completely collapse, the team will make the playoff. Will they beat ttun? Who knows with this current staff but it doesn't look good from the current perspective. The Game will never be the same again with one big conference and the date of the game likely changing in the future. The importance of it will be diminished, no matter how much we still want to kill those fuckers. Now, it's literally possible to play this game 3 times in one season though it would take some exact scenarios. 3 times!! Could your heart take 3 losses to ttun in one season? I know for a fact that mine would not.
He's not the guy. He's proven it. He's shown his weaknesses and one of them is adjusting to make up for his weaknesses. That isn't going to change. He is a good coordinator but a bad motivator and developer. He is also a bad manager from what he's shown so far. Will Ohio State get someone of equal ability if they fire him and get another coach? That can't be known but, at this point, is that what you really want?
I do not. Hoping this will be the last I respond on the subject.
This might get fairly long I apologize ahead of time and warn those who don't want to read a page of words. These are all obviously my opinion so have yours or don't doesn't matter.
Bottom line is Ryan Day is not the guy. That, in a nutshell, is my conclusion. Now, let me tell you why.
This is as much about what is coming as what has happened. What has happened is hellish and been screamed and pounded into the air nonstop from the time he stepped on campus. He took over for a guy who NEVER lost to ttun including against the same head coach. We should stop comparing him to that guy because he is not even similar to that guy in any facet.
What has happened is the program has become an NFL breeding ground for future stars. No doubt this is the most ridiculous run of talent tOSU has ever put into the league. We have had the greatest Ohio State QB of all time in the past 4 years and a few other first rounders. Probably the greatest WR but that might be more debatable as well as slew of first rounders that are so good they are taking over the league. We've also had numerous first round OL, DL, DBs go and on and on... They have 1 B1G Championship in a Covid year and a Rose Bowl win. They lost any playoff game they had in that timeframe and couldn't beat ttun which is more egregious. The team was called out for being "soft" in media outlets which were numerous, not just Lou Holtz. The "we are tough" tirade looked like a bunch of bullshit from half the people who saw it and great for team morale by the other half. It proved nothing. The softness wasn't about guys being tough physically and being able to play the game, the softness was the teams' mental approach to the game. Lately that has also been noted and addressed by former players and numerous other folks on this site and others. The leadership on the field improved this year but what about the leadership on the sidelines and from the booth? Brian Hartline has saved this programs bacon for the past 5+ years with his recruiting and player development. I can't look at the staff and say that about anyone else except maybe coach alford but his group can't stay healthy. Day has made changes to the staff but it was like pulling teeth to get that done. I think the Knowles hire was a good one but the personnel management needs to improve greatly. You can't have and exhausted group on the field when the game is on the line late. Play enough players during the year that everyone gets a chance to be on the field when it counts so that this shit doesn't happen!
Day runs the Offense. His play calling is for the most part pitiful and more serious, distracting. If you are worried about calling the right plays you aren't paying close enough attention to what your staff is doing in those situations. You can dictate your strategy on the head set while managing your staff without calling the exact plays. "I want to push the run this series, quarter, half, etc." You better damned well be paying attention to units that keep putting the team in negative situations, i.e. Parker Flemings awful Special Teams!! You can also talk to your players more without calling plays and get their feedback without wasting freaking timeouts. You also need to be putting young guys in the game and play the same playbook so that when your All American's move on you don't have unprepared, inexperienced players trying to win a B1G Championship and beat ttun at the end of the year. There is no development of underclassmen happening outside of practice on this football team right now except when they are forced into the fire due to injury. A ton of credit have to go to coaches Eliano and Walton for having guys ready to step in and ball out like they did for the season. RB's were all ready but for some reason we sat Hayden on the bench all season. Guess what, guys who play at Ohio State aren't going to stay for 4 years if you are doing your job so quit redshirting skill players!! QB? Not so much. WR? Hell who knows outside of Tate. OL? Dont be ridiculous. TE? Looks like guys have their areas of strength and weakness, so use them accordingly. Would have liked to see Thurman maybe try to get out and block on those never ending fucking WR screens being called and see if that monstrosity could get it done. If you are going to keep calling stupid ass plays at least maybe change the personnel so that we can actually see if it's the players or the ignorant play calls/designs. The biggest bright spots have been in the community for this team which are exemplary and not getting into any trouble, which is no small thing.
No B1G Champioship. No win against TTUN. No National Championship. Close doesn't count at Ohio State. Reminds you of someone else for sure.
What is coming is a whole new animal. The staff has rolled with the NIL punches about as well as they could be I'd say. I don't personally believe in buying any players up front but by all means get them as much money as possible once they lose their black stripes and become a real part of the team in Columbus. That may not be how other schools are doing it, but, this isn't other schools. The Portal is absolute chaos and I can guarantee that coaches are using as a Free Agent draft, especially down south. This area is going to have to get better right now if we are going to keep competing for National Championships. Until the rules change, it just is what it is. The biggest change coming up is a 12-team Playoff. 12 teams is embarrassing. A chimpanzee and 3 trained seals could coach the Buckeyes to a 12-team playoff. The talent alone is going to win 10 games even with shit strategies and special teams. And, this is the reason why the "who are you going to get to replace him" argument is no longer a defense for failing. It doesn't really matter who you get as long as Brian Hartline is here and the rest of your staff aren't complete freaking morons. Recruit the talent here and unleash it. There are only really 2 games a year in Columbus right now; Penn State and TUN. If you lose the other conference games right now you should be immediately fired because they aren't very good. Fick and Rhule may change some of that and the West Coasters might bring some better teams in so that's still to be determined. 10-2 and sometimes, 9-3 are going to make the college football playoff in the future. Our worst coach percentage-wise in the last 50 years, Coach Bruce, won 9 games by getting out of bed but he beat ttun 5 times while only losing it 4 times. Ryan Day is one loss away from that total, IN A ROW!
Next season is going to see a completely overhauled Defensive personnel from the best Defense we've had in a long time, though they still underachieved. The best combo of WR's in the country is gone as well as the best back on the roster, so actually being better than this year is doubtful. Unless they completely collapse, the team will make the playoff. Will they beat ttun? Who knows with this current staff but it doesn't look good from the current perspective. The Game will never be the same again with one big conference and the date of the game likely changing in the future. The importance of it will be diminished, no matter how much we still want to kill those fuckers. Now, it's literally possible to play this game 3 times in one season though it would take some exact scenarios. 3 times!! Could your heart take 3 losses to ttun in one season? I know for a fact that mine would not.
He's not the guy. He's proven it. He's shown his weaknesses and one of them is adjusting to make up for his weaknesses. That isn't going to change. He is a good coordinator but a bad motivator and developer. He is also a bad manager from what he's shown so far. Will Ohio State get someone of equal ability if they fire him and get another coach? That can't be known but, at this point, is that what you really want?
I do not. Hoping this will be the last I respond on the subject.
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Oldest real principle I know doesn't even rely on technology or anything modern and it's still true.
"Longer muscles are stronger muscles." - Joe Weider
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AuTX Buckeye
Founder & Pres of the Flemming/Holtmann Fan Club
Yahoo Pickem Champ
Former Game Champion
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I’m too fn lazy and busy to see if this has already been posted; but it sums up my feelings about Day well. Too scared, and it carries down. Holy Buckeye came from our most offensively conservative coach of the modern era. Ari’s point about the UGA and Weasel FGs netting nothing (same as if we had trusted our playmakers and failed) is an important one.
Day is an elite coach. Just needs to get out of his own damn way. Maybe he can’t do that here; maybe he can. I miss the swagger and cockiness.
I’d rather lose trying than lose playing scared.
theathletic.com
Day is an elite coach. Just needs to get out of his own damn way. Maybe he can’t do that here; maybe he can. I miss the swagger and cockiness.
I’d rather lose trying than lose playing scared.
Wasserman: Ryan Day loses sight of who he is when he coaches against Michigan
Day is 56-7 and had Ohio State on the edge of winning a national title a year ago. But that doesn't matter to many Buckeyes fans.
theathletic.com
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He’s from the old school way of doing things. That way worked when he was leading players at UF in the early 2000s, but with teams relying more on athleticism, as well as players getting bigger and more explosive. Stretching should’ve been a priority YEARS ago! The article I posted was written in 2018, and Joey had seen the pluses of stretching several years before that. Crazy. But we were also blinded by how cool it was to hear about the Valentine’s Day workouts or Christmas workouts, or guys vomitting after hard workouts.
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The Clemson game OSU got some bad calls that changed that game (I was there). Targeting and ejection, scoop and score that was called a non catch. And they still had a chance to win on the final drive. Georgia game coulda went either way, and no Marv for the second half. If he makes that field goal who knows .... Not a big defender of Day but he could easily be 3-1 in the playoffs.
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OregonBuckeye
Semper Fi Buckeyes
2019 Clemson was a robbery. That game legitimately does deserve an asterisk
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Obviously he and I share the same mindset. The problem is the solution is not clear.I’m too fn lazy and busy to see if this has already been posted; but it sums up my feelings about Day well. Too scared, and it carries down. Holy Buckeye came from our most offensively conservative coach of the modern era. Ari’s point about the UGA and Weasel FGs netting nothing (same as if we had trusted our playmakers and failed) is an important one.
Day is an elite coach. Just needs to get out of his own damn way. Maybe he can’t do that here; maybe he can. I miss the swagger and cockiness.
I’d rather lose trying than lose playing scared.
Wasserman: Ryan Day loses sight of who he is when he coaches against Michigan
Day is 56-7 and had Ohio State on the edge of winning a national title a year ago. But that doesn't matter to many Buckeyes fans.
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Poe McKnoe
Head Coach
I don’t know how to unfuck Ohio State’s football team. If I did, I’d probably have the ear of the AD in Columbus and a nice new office in the middle of the WHAC. I would say an advanced scouting and sign stealing network coupled with in game adjustments, orchestrated over a number of years but that’s been done, and might cost TCUN a lot more than it was worth.
What I do know is that there isn’t a simple solution. Sometimes there is simple solution. Jim Tressel spent a lot of time checking in on his offensive staff meetings because sometimes it seemed like nobody was really doing anything on that side of the ball. Urban Meyer saw the staff that was leftover from Tressel’s resignation and said “hellllllll no” and promptly fired the Walrus and minions.
Things got better, then they changed. Urban saw his team get curb stomped by Clemson and promptly cleaned the offensive braintrust responsible for it.
Things got better, then they changed. This time, the defense lost its way under a disjointed effort between Schiano and The Grinch Who Stole Defense. New Head Coach Ryan Day cleaned house and brought in Jeff Hafley.
Things got better, then they changed. This time Hafley bolted after a year to his own HC job and Ohio State promoted a guy that was a top notch recruiter, hype man, and all around good guy…and let’s just not go there…it was an abomination. Day cleaned house on the defensive side of the ball.
So morale of the story is that sometimes you can just can a coach or most of the coaches on one side of the ball. Have a good hire and the same players that couldn’t run fit worth a damn are plugging gaps and forcing fumbles. This means it’s almost ALWAYS the coaches fault - whether it be methods, or knowledge, or drills, or that something extra. It’s not easy to get that right mix.
At some point, you have to look at the head coach because it’s his job to coach the coaches. That means identify, develop, and retain the supporting staff. If the mixing and matching continues to yield poor results, then you look at that mixer and matcher.
Since we are explaining the unexplainable, I will air my biggest concern with an intangible…it seems like Ohio State coaches and players are always waiting for the perfect playcall. Without it, they often can’t overcome and keep the chains moving. Show me they want it, show me the broken tackles, show me the YAC, show me something. 1 RB vs 1 defender is supposed to be a win for the RB. Receivers are supposed to make tough, contested catches. What’s the offensive identity?
Also, it destroys my brain to think about why Ohio State’s offense doesn’t incorporate more motions and misdirections. These are 18-22 or 23 year olds that have as much time to prep as you do, which is not much. I’m not suggesting multiple trick plays per game, but it’s criminal that you’re not stressing the defenses eyes and decision making. If you’re not getting explosives on effort or playmaking, and you’re not getting explosives off misdirection and trick plays…you’re not getting explosives.
On another note, I look at this Ohio State team and I don’t see players that are that much bigger, or stronger, or faster, or more disciplined than the competition - that goes for offense and defense; I won’t even bring up special teams. There’s likely more parity in S&C and recruiting now than there was when Urban first showed up at Florida or when toughened up the Buckeyes, but the top teams still stand out on film.
People say “well Nick Saban figured it out” and I’m sure Michigan State would love to show you the National Championship trophies they’ve collected as a result.
What I do know is that there isn’t a simple solution. Sometimes there is simple solution. Jim Tressel spent a lot of time checking in on his offensive staff meetings because sometimes it seemed like nobody was really doing anything on that side of the ball. Urban Meyer saw the staff that was leftover from Tressel’s resignation and said “hellllllll no” and promptly fired the Walrus and minions.
Things got better, then they changed. Urban saw his team get curb stomped by Clemson and promptly cleaned the offensive braintrust responsible for it.
Things got better, then they changed. This time, the defense lost its way under a disjointed effort between Schiano and The Grinch Who Stole Defense. New Head Coach Ryan Day cleaned house and brought in Jeff Hafley.
Things got better, then they changed. This time Hafley bolted after a year to his own HC job and Ohio State promoted a guy that was a top notch recruiter, hype man, and all around good guy…and let’s just not go there…it was an abomination. Day cleaned house on the defensive side of the ball.
So morale of the story is that sometimes you can just can a coach or most of the coaches on one side of the ball. Have a good hire and the same players that couldn’t run fit worth a damn are plugging gaps and forcing fumbles. This means it’s almost ALWAYS the coaches fault - whether it be methods, or knowledge, or drills, or that something extra. It’s not easy to get that right mix.
At some point, you have to look at the head coach because it’s his job to coach the coaches. That means identify, develop, and retain the supporting staff. If the mixing and matching continues to yield poor results, then you look at that mixer and matcher.
Since we are explaining the unexplainable, I will air my biggest concern with an intangible…it seems like Ohio State coaches and players are always waiting for the perfect playcall. Without it, they often can’t overcome and keep the chains moving. Show me they want it, show me the broken tackles, show me the YAC, show me something. 1 RB vs 1 defender is supposed to be a win for the RB. Receivers are supposed to make tough, contested catches. What’s the offensive identity?
Also, it destroys my brain to think about why Ohio State’s offense doesn’t incorporate more motions and misdirections. These are 18-22 or 23 year olds that have as much time to prep as you do, which is not much. I’m not suggesting multiple trick plays per game, but it’s criminal that you’re not stressing the defenses eyes and decision making. If you’re not getting explosives on effort or playmaking, and you’re not getting explosives off misdirection and trick plays…you’re not getting explosives.
On another note, I look at this Ohio State team and I don’t see players that are that much bigger, or stronger, or faster, or more disciplined than the competition - that goes for offense and defense; I won’t even bring up special teams. There’s likely more parity in S&C and recruiting now than there was when Urban first showed up at Florida or when toughened up the Buckeyes, but the top teams still stand out on film.
People say “well Nick Saban figured it out” and I’m sure Michigan State would love to show you the National Championship trophies they’ve collected as a result.
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I was there too. He lost the same way he always does. His ZOMG offense sputtered and his defense couldn't get the stop it needed to. In the end they still had a chance to win but instead found a way to lose.
Only time he changed that narrative in a close game is against Freeman who is a more unprepared big game coach than Day is.
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Yep. He had a 10 man defense on the field twice against him and didn't score until the second time.......by inches.
It's like an old "Polacks vs Italians" football game joke.
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