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drycreek
Rookie
Look I'm not arguing with you either Scum but you did say he hasn't beaten his rival and that is very wrong.
Most Longhorns won't admit it but our archrival is infact A&M. We've played them more times than OU and they are even in our damned fight song which OU is not but for some reason Longhorns are too obsessed with OU right now to understand this.
Now back to my point. Mack OWNS A&M, who is our rival. Also, yes he has beaten OU, our other rival, twice. Once against John Blake 34-3 I believe, and once against Stoops 38-28 I believe.
And I think he has proven he can win big games. Two wins in Lincoln, NE and a Rose Bowl are pretty darn big.
Trust me I'm no Mack Brown lover, but you should give props where they are due.
Now about the award. F'n stupid. Even if you were going to give the award it would not go to Brown before Leach or McCarney.
All I'm saying is give credit where it's due.
While Brown is no where near deserving of this award he is still a good coach and has done a good many things. It is beyond me how the Longhorn faithful have forgotten the days before Mack. 1997 makes me shudder.
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High Lonesome
Hook 'Em
drycreek speaks the truth, the "problems" we have had with mac are inconsiquential(sp?) compared to the early 90's. as for ou and atm well i really dont know which is the larger rivalry, true atm is longer, but ou seems to have more on the line. As of now though ou is with out a doubt tops in the minds of most longhorns.
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I have gained a lot or respect for Mack Brown during this offseason, not really due to the Rose Bowl tho. The fred rouse situation was admirable, and he seems like a good coach. I think Stoops is a pretty good coach too (gotta love those Ohioans) and is a tough challenge for Brown to face every year.drycreek said:
He did beat OU earlier, and to us they seem like the more important rival as they are the biggest challenge. But I will agree that he has done well against their biggest rival. OU is the dumb team who suddenly has changed rivals now that you guys are more profitable. Your matchup has been heated for decades, its their amnesia about Nebraska being their big rival that makes us outsiders scrunch up our noses.
What matters to the nation is: can Texas beat the rival that is good, OU? And so far, in recent memory, the answer is no. He should be praised as a coach, but not as the top coach until that trend changes.
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drycreek said:
First, the only two times Brown has beaten OU was in 1998 (OU was 5-6) and in 1999 (OU was 7-5, Stoops' first season). He has since lost five straight, including two of Texas' most humiliating losses in their long history (63-14 in 2000 and 65-13 in 2003).
As for the two wins in Lincoln (1998 and 2002), Nebraska was 9-4 and 7-7, respectively, those two years, so it wasn't as if they beat the Nebraska of the mid-90s. The 1998 Cornhuskers were a good team, but not the 2002 edition.
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High Lonesome
Hook 'Em
mac can and will be a great coach if he does one thing... realize that he is not a great coach.
more than anything he needs to surround himself with X and O's guys. Mac has what it takes to be a top teir college coach in the mold of pat carroll and bowden, he is charismatic and can recruit. His problem lies with his coordinators. The team took a huge leap forward last year after the departure of DC carl reeves, now for OC greg davis. This one is much more difficult however since mac and greg are attached at the hip. If mac would ever hire a top tier OC then Texas would be the next great dynasty, untill that time.. we will be a top ten program that cannont seemingly get over that championship hill.
p.s. I hope they prove me wrong this year!
more than anything he needs to surround himself with X and O's guys. Mac has what it takes to be a top teir college coach in the mold of pat carroll and bowden, he is charismatic and can recruit. His problem lies with his coordinators. The team took a huge leap forward last year after the departure of DC carl reeves, now for OC greg davis. This one is much more difficult however since mac and greg are attached at the hip. If mac would ever hire a top tier OC then Texas would be the next great dynasty, untill that time.. we will be a top ten program that cannont seemingly get over that championship hill.
p.s. I hope they prove me wrong this year!
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borna'horn
Sophmore
Mack's problem in big games was summarized by offenseive coordinator Greg Davis after the OU shutout last year. He said they deliberately ran what some of us Horn fans derisively call the "prevent" offense, where they play conservatively trying to keep the game close and then try to "win the game" in the 4th quarter. Apparently, the thinking is that the less harm you inflict early on your opponent, the less harm he will inflict upon you. Then you still have an equal chance of winning late in the game. You can argue that this approach actually worked in the Rose Bowl, but usually it has not worked. (in fact, even the Michigan game was closer than it should have been in the first place)
The problem with this approach is it makes your team deliberately underachieve in big games, and it gives the other team more confidence as the game goes on. It is like a bully who goes into a shell against a fighter of equal size because he is afraid of getting hit back. Contrast this with the way USC came out of the gate against OU.
Texas has got to overcome its fear of equally-talented opponents, or this will be yet another 10-2 year. Texas has the talent to win all its games, but that has been the case for four years now.
The problem with this approach is it makes your team deliberately underachieve in big games, and it gives the other team more confidence as the game goes on. It is like a bully who goes into a shell against a fighter of equal size because he is afraid of getting hit back. Contrast this with the way USC came out of the gate against OU.
Texas has got to overcome its fear of equally-talented opponents, or this will be yet another 10-2 year. Texas has the talent to win all its games, but that has been the case for four years now.
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drycreek
Rookie
Ding, Ding, Ding!!!
F'n Greg Davis. If I could literaly kick his ass all the way out of town I would. You guys have got it right. Obviously Mack has the charisma to make Texas a major force but his supporting cast has always sucked donkey dick. Why? Because Mack is so loyal, loyal to a fault.
He has said time and again he will not be getting rid of GD. They have been friends forever and he won't fire his buddy. He knows GD is the problem too. Why else did he start taking over some of the playcalling last year?
What I don't understand is GD. If you are such a good friend why don't you do what you know you should and step the f down. Don't make your friend Mack fire you. Be a man and realize you SUCK and step down.
As for Mack himself, I think he is a really good coach and perhaps even a good X's and O's guy but that is not his problem. Mack's problem is a lack of hardnosed leadership.
Mack is too afraid of hurting his players feelings and being their friends so much so that it leads to a Texas Country Club feel around practice and somewhere deep down he never really gains that critical respect from his players that says, "no matter what coach we are behind you and we will do whatever you say, because we've learned that it's your ship and if we'll just run the riggings like you tell us to, you'll get us through this storm and take us to port."
That is why Mack Brown will never be a truly great coach, even without GD's bitch ass.
Mililani, I understand your point about OU's teams and even 02 NU. But the 98 NU team WAS that team of the mid 90's. If you will recall they won it all the year before in 97 by donkey stopping Tennessee in the Orange. That team was damn good and Texas had no bidness winning that game but they did.
I understand this point and I totally agree. You are correct sir.
F'n Greg Davis. If I could literaly kick his ass all the way out of town I would. You guys have got it right. Obviously Mack has the charisma to make Texas a major force but his supporting cast has always sucked donkey dick. Why? Because Mack is so loyal, loyal to a fault.
He has said time and again he will not be getting rid of GD. They have been friends forever and he won't fire his buddy. He knows GD is the problem too. Why else did he start taking over some of the playcalling last year?
What I don't understand is GD. If you are such a good friend why don't you do what you know you should and step the f down. Don't make your friend Mack fire you. Be a man and realize you SUCK and step down.
As for Mack himself, I think he is a really good coach and perhaps even a good X's and O's guy but that is not his problem. Mack's problem is a lack of hardnosed leadership.
Mack is too afraid of hurting his players feelings and being their friends so much so that it leads to a Texas Country Club feel around practice and somewhere deep down he never really gains that critical respect from his players that says, "no matter what coach we are behind you and we will do whatever you say, because we've learned that it's your ship and if we'll just run the riggings like you tell us to, you'll get us through this storm and take us to port."
That is why Mack Brown will never be a truly great coach, even without GD's bitch ass.
Mililani, I understand your point about OU's teams and even 02 NU. But the 98 NU team WAS that team of the mid 90's. If you will recall they won it all the year before in 97 by donkey stopping Tennessee in the Orange. That team was damn good and Texas had no bidness winning that game but they did.
I understand this point and I totally agree. You are correct sir.
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drycreek said:
If the '98 Nebraska team was all that, then why did they lose four games that year, which is more than they had lost in their previous five seasons? That was their first team to lose four games since 1968, a span of 30 years. Now, was the '98 NU team a good team? Yes, but not great. If you guys consider that win a big win, then I guess that's what it is. It still seems that Brown almost never wins big games, and we Buckeye fans hope he continues to be the "John Cooper of Texas" on Sep 10, 2005.
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gregorylee
I'd rather be napping!!
Obviously you weren't going to have to clean the toilet after the cake and ice creamBuckeyeFROMscUM said:There hasn't been this much excitement since the day before the Olsen twins turned 18
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I am very scatterbrained at the moment, but here is the prediction I made over on HornFans:
Week 1: Texas inspires LaLafayette to give up their football program. OSU's defense forces turnovers and special teams are a disaster for Miami, with one punt block and at least one big return for Ginn. Zwick gets the job done but shows why he's #2 (if not 3). OSU wins handily, but their offense is very uncreative.
Week 2:
Texas' running game struggles against OSU, as the defense is geared to stop the run (especially with VY on the field). Your TE has an outstanding game but is the lone threat. It's hard to say who is at fault, but between a few bad routes, a couple of drops, and imperfect passing the Texas air attack leaves much to be desired. As such, OSU is able to creep up and their remarkable team speed makes it a long day for Texas. VY does break off two big plays against OSU but without the ability to stretch the defense he is often tackled within 8 yards when he gets free. I envision one TD to Thomas and 2 FG (1 missed) by halftime.
Texas would be very foolish to punt to Ginn, however kicking out of bounds is too challenging unless they are near midfield and can aim for a touchback. They try a pooch punt and Ginn breaks off a big return anyway (ala 04 MSU PR TD). Two big returns including one score leave Texas fans screaming at their coach's decision making.
Texas turns OSU into a one-dimensional team with its DL. A few draw plays and sweeps are successful, but OSU abandons inside runs for the remainder of the game. OSU's passing game is explosive but erratic. Smith makes things happen with his feet, but misses on a few throws. Gonzalez makes a big catch for a score in the first half, but OSU is limited to 1 FG on the remaining drives. Ginn has a highlight or two, but is watched by the defense on every play and contained somewhat. This does open the door for the other WRs however. Ginn does have a reverse for 15 yards and another one for 3. On a trick play he receives a direct snap at wingback and starts to run with it, only to stop and throw it for a 20 yard TD to Holmes (3rd quarter).
Texas adds a FG sometime during the 3rd.
Up 24-16, Smith is hassled by Texas' DL but manages to get a jump ball pass off to Roy Hall. They are unable to move the ball and settle for a long FG from Huston.
Texas gets the ball at their own 28 and a half dozen plays later VY tries to make too much happen and turns the ball over. Texas' D stops them cold, and they make a FG from right around where they got the ball.
Texas does manage to move the ball down the field and score against the prevent defense, but OSU managed to stop Texas short of the first down multiple times and milked that clock. VY scored with his feet.
Texas goes for the onside kick, but fail to convert it. OSU gets the ball and milks the clock down to 15 seconds. OSU chooses to punt the ball, and uses up all but 7 seconds. VY scrambles around trying to buy time, but his hail mary is intercepted by Youboty and the game is over.
School 1 2 3 4 F
TEX 10 3 3 7 23
OSU 7 10 7 6 30
Scoring:
1st Quarter
09:53 Vince Young pass to David Thomas 24 yds
07:34 Troy Smith pass to Anthony Gonzalez 37 yds
02:11 David Pino makes 42 yd FG
2nd Quarter
11:22 Ted Ginn 62 yd PR TD
04:55 David Pino makes 37 yd FG
01:02 Josh Huston makes 45 yd FG
3rd Quarter
08:14 David Pino makes 35 yd FG
03:49 Ted Ginn pass to Santonio Holmes 20 yd
4th Quarter
6:15 Josh Huston 40 yd FG
4:22 Josh Huston 35 yd FG
2:08 Vince Young 18 yd TD run
Week 1: Texas inspires LaLafayette to give up their football program. OSU's defense forces turnovers and special teams are a disaster for Miami, with one punt block and at least one big return for Ginn. Zwick gets the job done but shows why he's #2 (if not 3). OSU wins handily, but their offense is very uncreative.
Week 2:
Texas' running game struggles against OSU, as the defense is geared to stop the run (especially with VY on the field). Your TE has an outstanding game but is the lone threat. It's hard to say who is at fault, but between a few bad routes, a couple of drops, and imperfect passing the Texas air attack leaves much to be desired. As such, OSU is able to creep up and their remarkable team speed makes it a long day for Texas. VY does break off two big plays against OSU but without the ability to stretch the defense he is often tackled within 8 yards when he gets free. I envision one TD to Thomas and 2 FG (1 missed) by halftime.
Texas would be very foolish to punt to Ginn, however kicking out of bounds is too challenging unless they are near midfield and can aim for a touchback. They try a pooch punt and Ginn breaks off a big return anyway (ala 04 MSU PR TD). Two big returns including one score leave Texas fans screaming at their coach's decision making.
Texas turns OSU into a one-dimensional team with its DL. A few draw plays and sweeps are successful, but OSU abandons inside runs for the remainder of the game. OSU's passing game is explosive but erratic. Smith makes things happen with his feet, but misses on a few throws. Gonzalez makes a big catch for a score in the first half, but OSU is limited to 1 FG on the remaining drives. Ginn has a highlight or two, but is watched by the defense on every play and contained somewhat. This does open the door for the other WRs however. Ginn does have a reverse for 15 yards and another one for 3. On a trick play he receives a direct snap at wingback and starts to run with it, only to stop and throw it for a 20 yard TD to Holmes (3rd quarter).
Texas adds a FG sometime during the 3rd.
Up 24-16, Smith is hassled by Texas' DL but manages to get a jump ball pass off to Roy Hall. They are unable to move the ball and settle for a long FG from Huston.
Texas gets the ball at their own 28 and a half dozen plays later VY tries to make too much happen and turns the ball over. Texas' D stops them cold, and they make a FG from right around where they got the ball.
Texas does manage to move the ball down the field and score against the prevent defense, but OSU managed to stop Texas short of the first down multiple times and milked that clock. VY scored with his feet.
Texas goes for the onside kick, but fail to convert it. OSU gets the ball and milks the clock down to 15 seconds. OSU chooses to punt the ball, and uses up all but 7 seconds. VY scrambles around trying to buy time, but his hail mary is intercepted by Youboty and the game is over.
School 1 2 3 4 F
TEX 10 3 3 7 23
OSU 7 10 7 6 30
Scoring:
1st Quarter
09:53 Vince Young pass to David Thomas 24 yds
07:34 Troy Smith pass to Anthony Gonzalez 37 yds
02:11 David Pino makes 42 yd FG
2nd Quarter
11:22 Ted Ginn 62 yd PR TD
04:55 David Pino makes 37 yd FG
01:02 Josh Huston makes 45 yd FG
3rd Quarter
08:14 David Pino makes 35 yd FG
03:49 Ted Ginn pass to Santonio Holmes 20 yd
4th Quarter
6:15 Josh Huston 40 yd FG
4:22 Josh Huston 35 yd FG
2:08 Vince Young 18 yd TD run
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