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Game Thread Game Two: #1 Ohio State 24, #2 Texas 7 (9/9/06)

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BuckeyeNation27 said:
That's not a good rebuttal. Running is a portion of VYs game, while running is all of Jamaal Charles' game. While VY was only running for 14 yards, he was throwing for a lot more than he is used to. So when you take everything as a whole, VY was being a QB and producing while Charles was being a RB and not.

That being said, I don't like to take a 1 game performance and base the player off it. I don't think Charles should be mentioned in the same sentence as 'Heisman' yet, but not because of what he didn't do against us.
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I agree that's a little early to call him a Heisman candidate. Maybe next year or his senior year but not this year.

The point I was trying to make though is that you guys stepped it up against the run at the end of the first quarter and said "beat us through the air". So if VY couldn't run on you guys, no one was.

Here's a highlight clip of JC that was made before the Rose Bowl. Most of highlights are up to the Oklahoma game when he injured his ankle. He recovered in time for the Big 12 championship game. Watch any highlight clip of the Rose Bowl and you'll see he had some nice runs there too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rm3OOTGoIR4
 
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bchorn said:
After the first quarter was over, VY only ran for 14 yards for the rest of the game. So, using your logic, VY isn't a good running quarterback, correct?

The truth is JC's yards per carry was in the top 10 at the end of last season. No he didn't have a total yardage stat for the year that will turn any heads. But that's because he was sharing running back duties with three other players throughout the season (S. Young, R. Taylor, H. Melton). Throw in VY and you can see that running yardage total was shared by all.

Just look up some highlight clips of Jammal on youtube and you'll see what us Texas fans are talking about.
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Here is the problem with that logic. Your basing what someone can do on the field with the recognition they merit off the same. The Heisman really doesn't work in that way.

There is a political, a regional and media aspect to a Heisman candidacy. All three work against Charles.

Political -
Prime candidate - Quinn. All other pre-season top 10 lists show several other names - none of whom play for burnt orange. I'm not saying that is fair, but it does accurately state the truth of the matter. ND is "Everyone's Darling Program" and they get high profile coverage in prime-time. They are the "clean" program, the program with "real" student-athletes etc, they "always play the strongest schedule", they are "the last of the independent founding college football programs" etc ad nauseum (quick, bring me a sick-bag). Sum and substance, ND candidates if esconsed at number 1 have an easier ride of it than any other player, anywhere else in the country.
Regionalism - or, in this case the AP factor. By which I don't mean Associated Press, rather that nemesis of the 'Horns Oklahoma and their stud running back Adrian Peterson. Being in the Big 12 there will be a tendency to back the regional candidate, almost to the exclusion of what Charles does on the field. In truth he may face having to put up all world numbers (after 9/9 :tongue2:) precisely because anything AP now does will be given double weight following the loss of Bomar.
Regionalism also hurts with the Quinn but that is really much more about -
Media - or too much exposure for your candidate. This works both ways of course, do badly with broad exposure and your Heisman hopes can be crushed, but if ND and Quinn put up numbers anywhere close to last year you can pretty much kiss this thing goodbye before Thanksgiving.
I guess there is one other factor that comes into play - Split Votes:
Split votes happen when a team has 2 viable candidates on one team. Now, in truth that doesn't impact Charles or UT in any way shape or form as they have no-one on anyone's top 10. FWIW, Charles is listed at #18 by CFN, but #18 on the Heisman lists is like kissing your ugly sister.
Perfectly pertinent to this to-and-fro concerning Heisman candidacy, guess which team is widely cited as having 2 viable Heisman candidates? Yep, our very own Ohio State Buckeyes. Scroll to the bottom of the page in the CFN link and you will see Troy Smith at #3 and Ginn at #6. This is of course exactly the reason why neither of their candidacies may flourish to the fullest - split votes.
 
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Thanks but I hope it is clear by now that I am defending JC as a quality running back and not as a Heisman candidate for this year. Maybe next year and definitely his senior year he'll be a Heisman candidate but not this year.
 
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bchorn said:
Thanks but I hope it is clear by now that I am defending JC as a quality running back and not as a Heisman candidate for this year. Maybe next year and definitely his senior year he'll be a Heisman candidate but not this year.
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That was being made clear by you during the writing of that post - no problem for all is now clear.
 
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lvbuckeye said:
he wasn't the best player in the country. Vince Young was.
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obviously not
bush_81640.jpg


Unless it's your contention that the voters were so bedazzled by his all purpose yards :lol:
 
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BuckeyeNation27 said:
Because Bush and Young played 2 different positions, so their stats and overall performances are difficult to judge.

Hawk outshined Posluzny in both stats and the 'look test', and got screwed.
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well, YV had more total yards, more TDS, more wins, a head to head win, and didn't disappear for about 3/4 of the biggest game of the year. in fact, VY won it nearly single handedly, while reggie wasn't even on the field in the most important play of USC's season, that being the 4th down play with a minute to go.

Reggie won the Heisman bacause he had 513 ALL PURPOSE yards against fucking fresno state. the media hype machine proceeded to suck his dick for the rest of the season, without bothering to notice that VY had a 500 yard performance of his own just two weeks prior.

finally, don't play dumb and act like the Heisman is REALLY about the best player in the country. it's about the best looking player on a great team. there's a reason that Brady Quinn has an inside track on that trophy, and a reason that Marshawn Lynch needs to rush for about 2500 yards and 30 TDs to to win it. shit, if it really went to the best player in the country, or even the most valuable, then Chris Gamble should have been a lock to make the trip to the downtown athletic club in '02.

(BTW, the Butkus is a PENN STATE award. is it any wonder that they gave it to their guy?)
 
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