Florida or scUM

[coastalbuck]

Ok, here's the way I see it. I think Herbie hit the nail on the head with his analysis. Key point is that there are two ways to look at this, and I don't know which one I subscribe to, I believe I need to think on it some. Vision no. 1 is that the BCS championship game is for the two teams with the best records that make the best match up. In this instance thats tOSU and Florida hands down, I mean scUM's record matches up with Florida's ok but they lost to us, therefore downgrading a possible rematch, and boosting Florida's stake. Vision no. 2 is that the game is for the two best teams with the best records in the country right now. That is Herbies point and a valid one, even if some of you don't like it. Therein lies the decision.

 

[BuckeyeBK]

My feeling is a rematch just degrades what happened on Nov. 18. Congrats Coach Tressel, now go play them again, oh, and if you lose, they get the National Title.

I know the "neutral field" argument will be made, but that's how scheduling goes...

And I know that some may not believe me, but if OSU had lost, I would still be against a rematch... one team had its shot, they knew what was on the line.

 

[OSUBasketballJunkie]

Dispatch

NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP GAME
Will it be Michigan or Florida vs. Buckeyes?

Sunday, December 03, 2006

Tim May
THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH




There hasn?t been a question for a while about who?s No. 1 this college football season. Everybody knows it?s Ohio State.
But who?s No. 2? Who is Ohio State going to play in the national championship game Jan. 8?
Well, brace yourself. The answer ? a first-ever rematch with Michigan (11-1) or a first-ever matchup with Florida (12-1) ? will be determined by the poll voters and the computer algorithms today and revealed tonight.
We know for sure OSU?s opponent won?t be Southern California. The No. 2 Trojans were upset by cross-town rival UCLA in what was a wild final 12 hours yesterday of a chaotic regular season.
No. 3 Michigan, which fell 42-39 at Ohio State on Nov. 18 but thinks it still has the credentials for the title game, then watched along with Ohio State as Florida outscored Arkansas 38-28 in a frenetic Southeastern Conference championship game.
Now it?s up to Bowl Championship Series formula to decide who will meet Ohio State in Glendale, Ariz. In that formula, the USA Today poll of the coaches counts one-third, the Harris Interactive poll of media, former players and administrators counts one-third, and the average of the six computer rankings (with the high and the low dropped) counts one-third.
Last week, the computers liked Michigan more than Florida, with the Wolverines having an overall average of third while the Gators were fourth. The two polls also liked Michigan more. The Wolverines were No. 3 in both and the Gators were fourth.
But how much will the exit of Southern California change all of that? How much of the poll support USC enjoyed now will swing to Michigan or to Florida? And how much boost will Florida get in the computer ratings after beating Arkansas, which was 10-2 going into last night?
While the computers are cold-blooded, numberscrunching machines, the human polls are more reactionary and subjective.
In other words, do the poll voters want to see Ohio State and Michigan, which have played 103 times in the regular season, play for the first time in a bowl, and for the first time back-to-back? Do they think they can re-create what was billed as "the game of the century" 51 days later?
Or do they think Michigan has had its shot at No. 1? Do they think Florida, after winning the tough SEC and despite a 27-17 loss at Auburn in midseason, deserves the chance? Do they think a first meeting between OSU and Florida would be more compelling?
If they demand a rematch between two teams who just played in the regular season, well, it has happened before, but with an asterisk.
In 1996, No. 1 Florida and No. 2 Florida State met in the regular-season finale. Florida State won 24-21 to grab No. 1 headed into the bowls.
But that was two years before the formation of the BCS. The Big Ten, Pacific 10 and Rose Bowl were not part of the alliance at that time.
So when No. 4 Ohio State, which had fallen out of the race for the championship with a 13-9 loss to Michigan, was pitted against No. 2 Arizona State, the Pac-10 champ, in the Rose Bowl, the alliance did the best thing it could. It put Florida, which had fallen only to No. 3 in the polls, against No. 1 FSU in the Sugar Bowl for a rematch.
The Gators devoured the Seminoles 52-20. And after OSU beat Arizona State, Florida was awarded its first and only national championship.
[email protected]

 

[Oh8ch]

Many folks keep saying that it is tough to go with Florida because clearly Michigan is the 2nd best team. I would submit that Michigan is arguably 2nd best, but not demonstrably 2nd best. Both they and Florida have a single loss to a very good team on the road. Florida, on the other hand, has played the toughest schedule in all of CFB. How can you not reward that if the decision is remotely close?

If you go with Michigan you are saying that the one-loss second best team from one conference should go ahead of the one-loss conference champion from arguably the best conference in the nation. If you are going to say that you better be able to demonstrate Michigan's superiority - not just argue it.

The computers are going to name Florida number 2 today. I hope the humans think long and hard before trumping that.

We don't know how well Florida would play OSU. But one thing we can demonstrate is that OSU has beaten Michigan. There is no argument about that.

 

[OSUBasketballJunkie]

I think it comes down to this:

Will the voters simply say they do not want to see a rematch and give Florida a shot who has had one of the most difficult schedules in the nation.

Personally I feel like Florida should get the chance, they won the SEC.

 

[buckeyegrad]

Ok, here's the way I see it. I think Herbie hit the nail on the head with his analysis. Key point is that there are two ways to look at this, and I don't know which one I subscribe to, I believe I need to think on it some. Vision no. 1 is that the BCS championship game is for the two teams with the best records that make the best match up. In this instance thats tOSU and Florida hands down, I mean scUM's record matches up with Florida's ok but they lost to us, therefore downgrading a possible rematch, and boosting Florida's stake. Vision no. 2 is that the game is for the two best teams with the best records in the country right now. That is Herbies point and a valid one, even if some of you don't like it. Therein lies the decision.

Vision #2 (Herbie's) is idiotic. There is no way to determine who the best two teams in the country are right now because there is no comparison between Florida and Michigan. It is merely opinion that Michigan is better than Florida, but as Oh8ch said, it can't be demonstrated.

Vision #2 places power within the hands of the media because subjective opinion gets to reign--no wonder Herbie likes it. Vision #1 places power within the hands of the teams who went out and won their conferences.

 

[buckeyeboy]

I've never heard so many ifs, wouldas, couldas, and shouldas out of a winning team. If Datish hadn't fumbled those snaps. If the refs hadn't called pass interference. Well, if Shawn Crable hadn't lost his head, and if Steve Breaston hadn't slipped on the lousy turf, and if a lot of things. The game was 42-39, not 42-0, 42-32, or 46-42 Michigan, so all we have to go on is what happened, not what would have happened if.

Of course you're going to hear that stuff here. After all, this is a Buckeye fan site. That being said, if you listen to the national media, I've heard many people say if Crable hadn't hit Smith, the game would've been different. I've heard almost no one (with the one exception of Pat Forde in an article on espn.com) say that the game wasn't as close as the score indicated. If anything, the "unbiased" media is trying to make the game sound closer than it was, not the other way around.

 

[buckeyeboy]

But if we're going to knock Michigan for a poor win against Ball State, how bout Florida getting past South Carolina by the skin of their teeth?

South Carolina is not nearly as bad as a team as you think. To equate them with Ball State is ridiculous. Try actually watching some college football before you make such a claim.

 

[OSUBKIZ]

If OSU is going to play another Big 11 team it should be Wiskey instead of Mich. The Badgers have a better claim to a game with OSU than scUM but that will never happen. Would be interesting though. :osu:

 

[coastalbuck]

Vision #2 (Herbie's) is idiotic. There is no way to determine who the best two teams in the country are right now because there is no comparison between Florida and Michigan. It is merely opinion that Michigan is better than Florida, but as Oh8ch said, it can't be demonstrated.

I disagree, Herbie's opinion is that scUM is the second best team in the nation! He's allowed to have that opinion and I, for one, share it. Again, if you, as a voter think the game is for the two best teams in college football, and you believe scUM is one of those two, you have to vote them no. 2. If you think that the game is for a shot at a national championship, scUM has had theirs and Florida hasn't so you must vote Florida.

If OSU is going to play another Big 11 team it should be Wiskey instead of Mich. The Badgers have a better claim to a game with OSU than scUM but that will never happen. Would be interesting though.

You are kidding, right?

 

[tsteele316]

the simple way to look at it is as such. both teams have claim to the #2 spot. there really is no tangible way to distinguish one from another outside of SOS. So, what is the outside mitigating factor that puts one team over another? As much and Herbie hates to hear it, it is the fact that osu has already beaten michigan.

my prediction is that the harris poll will favor UF. Folks seem to be saying that the computers will favor UF as well. The coaches poll will favor TTUN, but by a slim margin.

 

[buckeyechatter]

Michigan is the 2nd best team in the country. Should they be in the title game? No. They had their opportunity for a shot at the national title. If tOSU had lost to michigan, I would swallow my pride and take my invite to the rose bowl, which is a heck of a year in itself. How many times has michigan ruined our chances at a nat'l title shot? Bring on the Gators.

...oh and Urban Meyer's bitching of the BCS system will probably land him in the title game IMO....the sweaky wheel gets the grease...

 

[bucknut74]

The BCS isn't about finding out who's #2..it's about who's the best , and that's why we should play the gators.

 

[buckeyegrad]

I disagree, Herbie's opinion is that scUM is the second best team in the nation! He's allowed to have that opinion and I, for one, share it. Again, if you, as a voter think the game is for the two best teams in college football, and you believe scUM is one of those two, you have to vote them no. 2. If you think that the game is for a shot at a national championship, scUM has had theirs and Florida hasn't so you must vote Florida.

The problem I see with this reasoning is the fact that everything is based upon the opinion of talking-media-heads (and we all remember how smart they are based on last year's hype before the USC-Texas game). As I and several other posters have mentioned, those opinions--even if informed and educated--really have no way of demonstrating Michigan is actually the second best team in the nation (maybe they are, maybe they are not).

The voters have the opportunity to correct the primary flaw of the BCS system (i.e. allowing non-conference champions to play in the national title game) and they should do so, especially when Florida with one loss has as much right to the #2 spot as Michigan with their one loss.

 

[CookyPuss]

There are several ways to look at how to seperate these two teams.

1. Conference champ - Edge Florida
2. SOS - Edge Florida
3. Non-conference Schedule - Edge scUM
4. "Tough Victories" - Edge Florida
5. "Style Points" - Edge scUM
6. Rematch - Push (Depends on which side you fall on)
7. Eyeball Test (subjective belief that one team looks more like #2) - Edge appears to go to scUM
8. Hottest Cheerleaders - Edge Florida


This is what I really hate about the current system. The pollesters will all be making their decisions based on different criteria. Is the voting for who is perceived as #2 or who you want to see play in the NC? Those could be different votes. What a stupid way to decide this.