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Ex-Wolverine BS (all merged - including the tearful goodbyes)

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Buckeyes

This is kind of interesting... After living in Toledo for a year and visiting Columbus a few times, I still had never really, for 100% sure, seen an actual Buckeye tree and known it. I saw some trees that looked like what I thought a Buckeye tree should look like, but I couldn't see the leaves very well (they were up on branches) and the nuts had a prickly coating on them. I figured it was just some other kind of tree.

My girlfriend and I took a roadie to Phoenix last weekend, and I saw that they have a suburb named Buckeye, so I figured that it was just founded by some OSU grad (kind of like how Miami, FL and Daytona Beach were founded/named by guys from Miami and Dayton, OH). Well, oddly enough, I saw a bunch of trees with that whitish bark on them, but I didn't think they were Buckeye trees because I had read that they only grow in central Ohio.

Well, last night we were walking into Barnes and Noble at the Coronado Mall here in Albuquerque, and I saw a branch with familiar looking leaves on it. Looked sort of like a pot leaf. I looked around and saw that there was a big tree with whitish bark on it, and the branches had little nuts on them. I jumped up and managed to grab a couple of them and took them with us.

While my girlfriend shopped for clothes, I cleaned all the pickers off the nuts, and sure enough, they were brown with a whitish eye on them.

I identified my first Buckeye Tree! In Albuquerque, NM of all places.

Now, I realize that there was in fact a Buckeye tree right outside my apartment all of last year. I am an idiot.
 
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Ah, the conversion process is a long and difficult path Ex. Keep the Buckeye for good luck and you will find that there are Buckeyes (people ... and sometimes trees) all over the world, not just in Ohio or New Mexico. Hope you get to a game or three at the 'shoe' this year.
 
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Feelin' it!

For those of you who remember me and how I came to be a member of this board, you will recall that it's been a tough journey for me. Understandably so.

Well, I think I am beginning to get it. I just found a ton of OSU football links, and I have been cramming my head with OSU stuff all night. I have an OSU dynasty going in NCAA 2005, where my goal is to see if I can fill someone's helmet with buckeyes.

I have the OSU marching band's version of "Hang On Sloopy" looping in my head over and over again. And suddenly, I am actually LOOKING FORWARD to the two weeks I will be spending at UM with my girlfriend this fall, while I wait for OSU's school year to start...I will be wearing a lot of red!
 
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"No more training do you require....Already know you, that which you need."


Now, you must just confront Darth Wolverine, and your journey to becoming a Jed-eye will be complete.
 
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Any lawyers here?

I have a very quick legal question... Two, actually...

I bought an item a month ago, a LoveSac. It's basically a giant beanbag that costs $400. They are filled with foam and shrunk down from 8ft in diameter to about twice the size of a computer monitor and it fits in a duffel bag. When you get it home, you fluff it up and it's 8ft in diameter. There's a lifetime warranty on the foam inside, and a 1 year warranty on the cover.

When I bought it, they told me that I would be able to shrink it back down by vacuuming the air out. They never told me that there were two bags of material that were put in one giant cover. They never informed me about the return policy or the restocking fee, and there were no signs in the store indicating this policy. The restocking fee was mentioned on the receipt, but I didn't get the receipt until AFTER I made the purchase and they had my money.

Well, when they brought it out to the car, I saw that it was in two duffel bags, so it's two pieces that go in one giant cover. When we got it home and fluffed it up, we realized that the bag had no vacuum seal on it, so we couldn't vacuum the air out. Come to find out, they don't have vacuum seal-able bags, the girl just lied to us. Basically, the thing was so big that it takes up our entire van, which is a big deal when you consider that we're supposed to move home in a week, and we have an entire apartment full of stuff, plus the lovesac, that we're supposed to take home.

The two inserts is a big deal, because instead of being a giant beanbag, it's two beanbags in a giant bag. When Janelle and I would sit on it, she would be 6 inches higher than I was, when we're supposed to be level. That's because of the two inserts...if it were just one, we'd be level. Their website says "insert," not inserts.

In the store, the sacs are very comfortable, when you sit down, the pieces of foam are very small and it feels almost like gel. When you get up, they spring back to where they were, and you only have to fluff them once a day. Our lovesac was very very lumpy, when I would sit in it, I would be just a couple inches from the ground. You had to fluff it every hour or so, and the consistency was like a feather pillow instead of the gel bag in the store. Very very uncomfortable.

Well, last night, the zipper broke on the cover. Broke off. We decided to take the thing back to the store, since the entire thing was defective and we had been lied to.

When we got there, they offered us a refund, but told us that there was a 25% restocking fee. The manager admitted that both the insert and the cover were defective.

Is this legal? Can they charge a restocking fee on a defective item?

Also, Janelle paid for it, and she is leaving for a wedding tomorrow, so she wanted the money then. They gave us the option of leaving it in the store while we took the issue up with customer service, because the manager refused to budge on the policy (he even got mouthy, then screamed at Janelle and I, to the point where she broke out in tears...). Janelle decided to take the refund, minus the 25% restocking fee, and we are going to call the corporate office tomorrow.

What I want to know about that is did we screw ourselves out of the possibility of getting the rest of the refund, the restocking fee, if these people did indeed violate the law and we would otherwise be entitled to a refund?

I already looked at the Uniform Commercial Code, and it seems that they are guilty of false advertising and fraud, but I am obviously not a lawyer.

Thanks for any advice you can give!
 
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Is this legal? Can they charge a restocking fee on a defective item?
Click to expand...

I'm not a lawyer either... but generally restocking fees are for items that you don't 'want.' (Like if you mail order car parts, but you ordered the wrong part, and want to send it back... )

Why would they bother to restock a defective item?

I don't know if you screwed yourself or not.. as far as giving the rest of the cash back... but if the Manager that you talked to agreed that there was something unsatisfactory with either their product or how they represented it... you sould mention this to the HQ. I imagine that they'll try to do something to make it right... if not, then be sure to tell everyone you know.
 
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They even spelled it s-a-c. :tongue2: But seriously, what's with the manager getting all mouthy at you and your wife for trying to return a piece of crap? Ex-Wolve, a piece of advise, if a retail store manager gets so lippy with your wife as to her cry, you have every justification to let loose with some verbal abuse. And make it loud enough so that other customers hear your complaint - something to the effect of, "You mean I have to pay you a hundred dollars to put this piece of crap back in inventory so someone else can get ripped off? How can you still sell this fucking thing with a straight face when you know its defective? Do you even care about customer satisfaction, or do you enjoy ripping us off? Do you even have a shred of ethics, or are you like every other salesman I've ever met?" You get the picture. His whole purpose is to generate sales, and a lippy, unsatisfied customer in the store never helps the bottom line. Don't do them a favor by being quiet when you get ripped off like that.
 
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Ex-Wolve - I have to say this, I am not your attorney. What follows is not intended as advice on how to proceed. It is merely information which non-attorney's generally do not know but which can be found in various legal sources available to the public. I say this because I need to make it clear, you are not my client and I do not represent you. I do this for professional/ethical reasons. (I'm covering my ass)

First, they're not guilty of false advertising or fraud... those are pretty bold things to assert, in a legal sense. You might have tossed those words around as a bargaining chip when you took the thing back but really, it's just big talk.... they are guilty of being pricks and conducting bad business. anyway, it may be of interest to you to know that a merchant can be held to what's called the "Warranty of Merchantability" This warranty warrants that the product does what it's supposed to do. When you say,
"The two inserts is a big deal, because instead of being a giant beanbag, it's two beanbags in a giant bag. When Janelle and I would sit on it, she would be 6 inches higher than I was, when we're supposed to be level. That's because of the two inserts...if it were just one, we'd be level. Their website says "insert," not inserts."
that is some indicator that the bean bag thingy does not do what it's intended to do. This implied warranty can only be disclaimed in a particular way - use of the words "as is" for example.

It is possible that the vacuuming issue, where there appears to have been an exchange between you and the sales clerk about this particular, is sufficient to argue about the implied "Warranty of fitness for particular purpose" This warranty exists where the seller has a reason to know of a particular purpose and buyer's reliance on seller to choose suitable goods.

If your product is faulty, your issue is with the manufacturer of that product. You said it's got a 1 year warranty. Call them up and see if they'll help you out. Write em a letter or something. Tell them you believe the lining issue to constitute a defect, since there is no vacuum seal or whatever. Tell them your story, see if they'll help you. Who knows, maybe the manufacturer of this bean bag likes customer satisfaction more than the reltailer.
 
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was it purchased with cash, debit card or credit card??

if paid for in cash you may be s.o.l......

if you paid for it by credit card...mastercard and visa will act as an intermediary between you and the merchant....most times the buyer wins these disputes...if the merchant does not comply with the mc/visa ruling they can lose their ability to accept cards....

i always suggest that people buying anything over $100... put it on their credit card for this reason....
 
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luckobucko said:
They even spelled it s-a-c. :tongue2: But seriously, what's with the manager getting all mouthy at you and your wife for trying to return a piece of crap? Ex-Wolve, a piece of advise, if a retail store manager gets so lippy with your wife as to her cry, you have every justification to let loose with some verbal abuse. And make it loud enough so that other customers hear your complaint - something to the effect of, "You mean I have to pay you a hundred dollars to put this piece of crap back in inventory so someone else can get ripped off? How can you still sell this fucking thing with a straight face when you know its defective? Do you even care about customer satisfaction, or do you enjoy ripping us off? Do you even have a shred of ethics, or are you like every other salesman I've ever met?" You get the picture. His whole purpose is to generate sales, and a lippy, unsatisfied customer in the store never helps the bottom line. Don't do them a favor by being quiet when you get ripped off like that.
Click to expand...
Well, I didn't mention it before because I didn't want to shed a negative light on the original post, but yes, you bet your ass I made a scene. The rent-a-cops were called in after I, and Janelle, made it known vocally that we weren't pleased. (Janelle is the sweetest girl in the world, I have been with her for two years and have never heard her raise her voice before...she's from a traditional asian family, they don't do that). It was BS, we shouted because he shouted at us, but he just wanted to be a dick.

He refused to call his manager, and then when the rent-a-cops came, he refused to give us his name so we could have it when we called the corporate office.

I don't think anyone who read the Buch Hypocrisy thread would ever think I would take some 22 year old asswipe yelling at me and making my girlfriend cry. It was all I could do to keep from hitting him.

thebkb said:
Ex-Wolve - I have to say this, I am not your attorney. What follows is not intended as advice on how to proceed. It is merely information which non-attorney's generally do not know but which can be found in various legal sources available to the public. I say this because I need to make it clear, you are not my client and I do not represent you. I do this for professional/ethical reasons. (I'm covering my ass)

First, they're not guilty of false advertising or fraud... those are pretty bold things to assert, in a legal sense. You might have tossed those words around as a bargaining chip when you took the thing back but really, it's just big talk.... they are guilty of being pricks and conducting bad business. anyway, it may be of interest to you to know that a merchant can be held to what's called the "Warranty of Merchantability" This warranty warrants that the product does what it's supposed to do. When you say,
"The two inserts is a big deal, because instead of being a giant beanbag, it's two beanbags in a giant bag. When Janelle and I would sit on it, she would be 6 inches higher than I was, when we're supposed to be level. That's because of the two inserts...if it were just one, we'd be level. Their website says "insert," not inserts."
that is some indicator that the bean bag thingy does not do what it's intended to do. This implied warranty can only be disclaimed in a particular way - use of the words "as is" for example.

It is possible that the vacuuming issue, where there appears to have been an exchange between you and the sales clerk about this particular, is sufficient to argue about the implied "Warranty of fitness for particular purpose" This warranty exists where the seller has a reason to know of a particular purpose and buyer's reliance on seller to choose suitable goods.

If your product is faulty, your issue is with the manufacturer of that product. You said it's got a 1 year warranty. Call them up and see if they'll help you out. Write em a letter or something. Tell them you believe the lining issue to constitute a defect, since there is no vacuum seal or whatever. Tell them your story, see if they'll help you. Who knows, maybe the manufacturer of this bean bag likes customer satisfaction more than the reltailer.
Click to expand...
BKB, thank you for the...well, can't call it "advice," but...

In this case, LoveSac is a store that sells LoveSacs. The company is based in Salt Lake City, and it's essentially just a factory outlet. When the manager called his boss, his boss was in Salt Lake City. He said the corporate office said that it's company policy not to give full refunds on returns. He said there's always a 25% restocking fee.

I just remembered a few more things that might not be relevant, but they are at least interesting...

When we first went in there, they were going to refuse the refund because they didn't have storage room on the floor for it.

The manager suggested that we sell it on eBay. This thing is 8ft in diameter and about 3 feet tall, not to mention weighing about 300lbs. The shipping would be insane.

Also, the manager offered to sell it in the store and give us the money... after he had already tested it himself and determined that it was defective.

Janelle, as I stated before, took the money minus the restocking fee. As we were leaving, we saw them putting the cover on the inserts. They are going to sell that sac, knowing that it's defective and used.
 
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When I went looking for a picture of the lovesac I expected to see some sort of kinky sex seat.

website2.jpg


I was not disappointed. Lovesac baby.
 
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