Cleveland Browns (2011 season)

[tsteele316]

I hate to say it, but at this point I'm somewhat missing Mangini and Ryan.

At least with one we had a commitment to the run game, especially in the redzone. We wouldn't get cute on 3rd/4th and short. Just straight up power football.

I'd like to be known as a running team. Ball control. Clock control. With good defense. Pittsburgh was this way. Baltimore is that way.



The only plus I've seen so far with this front office is that they do seem to have a decent eye for talent in the draft.

i don't miss rob ryan in the least. look at dallas's defensive stats thus far this season.

 

[Buckeneye]

#1 against the run.

14th in pass defense.


Held Brady and the Pats to 20 points. Sounds quite solid to me.

Edit: Haven't lost a game by more then 4 points this season.

Of course the defensive collpase (offensive too) against the Lions doesn't help.

 

[tsteele316]

#1 against the run.

14th in pass defense.


Held Brady and the Pats to 20 points. Sounds quite solid to me.

Edit: Haven't lost a game by more then 4 points this season.

Of course the defensive collpase (offensive too) against the Lions doesn't help.

too bad their in the bottom half of the league in points surrendered at over 24 per game. and that's a defensive unit that is far more talented than cleveland's.

 

[BuckNut65]

A couple of observations:

2. Colt McCoy can't throw out of the pocket. It is really an amazing lack of skill for someone who started for 4 years at Texas and has shown some real elusiveness at the quarterback position. But could you ever really envision Colt picking apart a defense standing comfortably in the pocket? He has one of the best LTs in football, and yet the coaching staff knows that the best option is to roll him out on a bootleg for a 4-yard crossing pattern. And it seems that his accuracy has taken a hit as well. He's overthrowing receivers on any route over 10 yards. The only time he's effective is against the prevent defense. Last year, he had potential. This year, we're seeing his ceiling. He's a slightly better version of Brady Quinn. I hate to say it so quickly in his career, but its time to move on.

I know the thing no one wants to hear is patience but that's what we need. I would like for him to at least have the opportunity to spend a year in this system before it's all hands abandon ship. That's the problem we have every single year with this organization...no continuity. Having the lockout didn't help either.

One of the biggest issues with the offense this year is that it is rudderless. There seems to be no rhyme or reason at times to what we are doing. I don't understand it. The west coast offense is a precision offense and requires that receivers get off of the line of scrimmage. You aren't seeing that consistently. In addition, last year we were pounding the ball which set up the play-action to the TE's which is where Colt was extremely successful last year. This year the run game is non-existent and the pressure is all on Colt to make plays. Without a consistent running attack or offensive approach for that matter the offense is constantly in bad situations with 3rd and long which does not bode well for any team in the NFL.

Some of the issues that I am starting to see with Colt is that his footwork has been poor which I think is a result of the pounding he has been taking. Even though he hasn't been sacked that many times he is at the top of the list for QB hits. The right side of the line was a disaster at the beginning of the year while Pashos was out and I think you are starting to see the cumulative toll of what has transpired....especially when it comes to his inaccuracy.

I was extremely disappointed with what I saw after the bye week but let's face it, the tools aren't here yet. We need more skill players and more depth.

 

[Buckeneye]

too bad their in the bottom half of the league in points surrendered at over 24 per game. and that's a defensive unit that is far more talented than cleveland's.

Up front yes. Although the linebackers are nothing to write home about (save for Ware) In the back end I don't think the combination of Jenkins, Newman, Elam & Sensabaugh is much more impressive then our secondary.

They do have a spot more of depth though.


I see the Rams released Sims Walker. Not sure about what type of price he would command. I know he's had some dropsies this year. He did have two pretty productive seasons with the Jags. I wonder if that would be someone the Brownies might look at as a fringe 2nd and 3rd WR.

That said. Thoughts on Greg Little so far? I like his strength off the ball. He doesn't seem to get caught up in press coverage too much and uses his arms decent enough to keep DB's hands off him. I don't remember any drops. Aside from coming up half yard shy on the TD, I was pleasantly surprised so far. I'm not expecting a miracle breakout from the kid, but so far he might be something to look forward too.

 

[colobuck79]

I know the thing no one wants to hear is patience but that's what we need.

 

[tsteele316]

Up front yes. Although the linebackers are nothing to write home about (save for Ware) In the back end I don't think the combination of Jenkins, Newman, Elam & Sensabaugh is much more impressive then our secondary.

They do have a spot more of depth though.


I see the Rams released Sims Walker. Not sure about what type of price he would command. I know he's had some dropsies this year. He did have two pretty productive seasons with the Jags. I wonder if that would be someone the Brownies might look at as a fringe 2nd and 3rd WR.

That said. Thoughts on Greg Little so far? I like his strength off the ball. He doesn't seem to get caught up in press coverage too much and uses his arms decent enough to keep DB's hands off him. I don't remember any drops. Aside from coming up half yard shy on the TD, I was pleasantly surprised so far. I'm not expecting a miracle breakout from the kid, but so far he might be something to look forward too.

sean lee and brady james are both better than scott fujita and chris gocong. hell, anthony spencer is better than those two as well. the secondary I would split. haden and ward over newman/jenkins and elam.

while it's tough to compare a 4-3 team to a 3-4, I would without hesitation take at least 6 of dallas's starters over cleveland's.

 

[BuckNut65]

Thoughts on Greg Little so far? I like his strength off the ball. He doesn't seem to get caught up in press coverage too much and uses his arms decent enough to keep DB's hands off him. I don't remember any drops. Aside from coming up half yard shy on the TD, I was pleasantly surprised so far. I'm not expecting a miracle breakout from the kid, but so far he might be something to look forward too.

I like him so far as well but what does it say about the rest of the receivers when a converted rb who sat out a year is now being groomed as your #1??

 

[OH10]

I know the thing no one wants to hear is patience but that's what we need. I would like for him to at least have the opportunity to spend a year in this system before it's all hands abandon ship. That's the problem we have every single year with this organization...no continuity. Having the lockout didn't help either.

You're not wrong. But we were starting to see some continuity last year and they blew the whole system up for a guy that is clearly in over his head (Shurmur). Its just frustrating to KNOW that 3 years from now we will probably have another new coach and another new quarterback. You can already see it.

And, despite what I said before about Colt not being the answer, I do think we're stuck with him until we do find the answer. Its not likely to happen in the upcoming draft.

I just don't see any hope with this team. From the front office to the coaching staff to the personnel on the field, there is no light at this end of this dark tunnel.

 

[Bucklion]

Thing is about the QB, the franchise could sink for a decade if that one is played wrong too. A lot of people were pissed we didn't take "The Sanchise" back in 2009...how'd that work out? We got a Pro Bowl Center and if they had half an inkling about how to draft that year, the second rounders we got would have amounted to something besides a hill of Veikune. Sanchez is awful, the Jets are winning in spite of him, and he doesn't appear to be improving...put him in Cleveland, and everyone would be screaming about a high round bust. Even if we got Luck, there's no guarantee that would help anything without revamping the rest of the team.

 

[Buckeneye]

while it's tough to compare a 4-3 team to a 3-4, I would without hesitation take at least 6 of dallas's starters over cleveland's.

I very much agree.

But we were starting to see some continuity last year and they blew the whole system up for a guy that is clearly in over his head (Shurmur).

I liked Mangini's hard ass style. I would have been much happier keeping him and possibly bringing in a new OC while giving Ryan more money to stay. Of course everyone at the time thought he'd be another head coach.
Hindsight is always 20/20, and he might be the next man in line in Dallas - but I still would have kept him. Not that I'm saying Jauron is a bad D-coord. I think he's pretty good. But it was clear Ryan was well liked by his players and I would have loved to have seen his defense with a little more talent on it.

At least with Mangini at the helm you would have seen the commitment to the teams strength (running the ball). Which wouldn't have hurt quite so much with the lock out.

I said it once before in the 2010 thread. I was worried about some things Holmgren would while having free reign. He has "his guy" in there now - so good luck getting rid of him if it comes to that.

If we do tank and get in the position to take Luck. Do it. Draft him and a WR or RT. Sit him for a year and lets make some moves in FA as well.
Don't need to ruin another young QB by getting him hit constantly like McCoy has been.

 

[IronBuckI]

too bad their in the bottom half of the league in points surrendered at over 24 per game. and that's a defensive unit that is far more talented than cleveland's.

21 of the 121 points given up by Dallas were either a pick or a blocked punt. 3 extra TDs, and who knows how many damage control FGs (at least one) in five games is a lot to overcome for any defense. 20 ppg puts Dallas' scoring defense in the top 10, and 100 points in 5 games is how many points the Dallas defense has given up.

 

[IronBuckI]

Thing is about the QB, the franchise could sink for a decade if that one is played wrong too. A lot of people were [censored]ed we didn't take "The Sanchise" back in 2009...how'd that work out? We got a Pro Bowl Center and if they had half an inkling about how to draft that year, the second rounders we got would have amounted to something besides a hill of Veikune. Sanchez is awful, the Jets are winning in spite of him, and he doesn't appear to be improving...put him in Cleveland, and everyone would be screaming about a high round bust. Even if we got Luck, there's no guarantee that would help anything without revamping the rest of the team.

The screaming over a bust will still happen, but a failed first round QB doesn't cripple a team as much anymore. $20-25 million won't do the damage that a$45 million bust will. So we have that going for us. Which is nice.

 

[Bucks21]

I like him so far as well but what does it say about the rest of the receivers when a converted rb who sat out a year is now being groomed as your #1??

Have you seen his college film? He would have been a first rounder if he did not sit out that year.

 

[tsteele316]

21 of the 121 points given up by Dallas were either a pick or a blocked punt. 3 extra TDs, and who knows how many damage control FGs (at least one) in five games is a lot to overcome for any defense. 20 ppg puts Dallas' scoring defense in the top 10, and 100 points in 5 games is how many points the Dallas defense has given up.

and cleveland's stats are skewed by 2 special teams td's and gift points from shanked punts in the opener. i'm sure dallas and cleveland aren't the only two teams in the nfl to be the victim of such atrocities.