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Cleveland Browns (2008 Season)

I know :crazy:Romeo is a 3-4 guy but when Robaire Smith comes back next year it would be asinine for the Browns not to go to a 4-3 with Shaun Rogers and S. Smith at the DT's and Williams and Robaire Smith at defensive end. Going that route I think would help our LB situation along with our entire defense.
 
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LitlBuck;1318244; said:
I know :crazy:Romeo is a 3-4 guy but when Robaire Smith comes back next year it would be asinine for the Browns not to go to a 4-3 with Shaun Rogers and S. Smith at the DT's and Williams and Robaire Smith at defensive end. Going that route I think would help our LB situation along with our entire defense.

that would do nothing but make things worse. you have 4 guys that all should be playing DT, none of which could rush the qb from the DE spot.

as for the cb discussion, it doesn't matter who you put back there when the qb has 8 seconds to throw the ball. it's funny that cb was never an issue during the Cinci, NYG, Jax and Washington games.

wimbley's lack of development from his rookie year until now is just as much onf the coaching staff as it is on the GM.
 
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tsteele316;1318248; said:
that would do nothing but make things worse. you have 4 guys that all should be playing DT, none of which could rush the qb from the DE spot.

as for the cb discussion, it doesn't matter who you put back there when the qb has 8 seconds to throw the ball. it's funny that cb was never an issue during the Cinci, NYG, Jax and Washington games.

wimbley's lack of development from his rookie year until now is just as much onf the coaching staff as it is on the GM.
Corey Williams "natural" position is DE in a 4-3 not a 3-4. There is a big difference.

Toast McDonald:! didn't have to defend his WR for 8 seconds for the guy to go 90+ yards on him.

That was a brilliant move by Savage to pass up Ngata for Wembley. Very good talent evaluation:(
 
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LitlBuck;1318244; said:
I know :crazy:Romeo is a 3-4 guy but when Robaire Smith comes back next year it would be asinine for the Browns not to go to a 4-3 with Shaun Rogers and S. Smith at the DT's and Williams and Robaire Smith at defensive end. Going that route I think would help our LB situation along with our entire defense.

Except that Wimbley and Alex Hall can't play in a 4-3 except for rush DE.
 
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LitlBuck;1318266; said:
Corey Williams "natural" position is DE in a 4-3 not a 3-4. There is a big difference.
LitlBuck;1318266; said:
Toast McDonald:! didn't have to defend his WR for 8 seconds for the guy to go 90+ yards on him.

That was a brilliant move by Savage to pass up Ngata for Wembley. Very good talent evaluation:(

Sorry little buck but his natural position is DT in a 4-3 which is what he played with green bay. Its hard for Wimbley to get sacks when he doesn't have his hand on the ground and the browns only rush 3 guys.
 
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LitlBuck;1318266; said:
Corey Williams "natural" position is DE in a 4-3 not a 3-4. There is a big difference.

Toast McDonald:! didn't have to defend his WR for 8 seconds for the guy to go 90+ yards on him.

That was a brilliant move by Savage to pass up Ngata for Wembley. Very good talent evaluation:(

as someone already mentioned, williams played DT at Green Bay. whiff there.

as for mcdonald, sean jones blew the safety coverage on that play. mcdonald signaled to him before the snap that he had deep coverage, and instead jones stood 6 yards from the LOS all by himself.

savage's post draft day quote was that with lecharles bentley, he didn't mind passing on ngata that much because romeo crennel told him he needed a pass rusher first and foremost.

wimbley had 11 sacks as a rookie. that doesn't happen by chance, especially when cleveland got rolled most of the year and teams ran the ball a lot. the fact that he hasn't improved one bit is just as much on the coaching staff.
 
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tsteele316;1318328; said:
as someone already mentioned, williams played DT at Green Bay. whiff there.

as for mcdonald, sean jones blew the safety coverage on that play. mcdonald signaled to him before the snap that he had deep coverage, and instead jones stood 6 yards from the LOS all by himself.

savage's post draft day quote was that with lecharles bentley, he didn't mind passing on ngata that much because romeo crennel told him he needed a pass rusher first and foremost.

wimbley had 11 sacks as a rookie. that doesn't happen by chance, especially when cleveland got rolled most of the year and teams ran the ball a lot. the fact that he hasn't improved one bit is just as much on the coaching staff.
Okay. I will admit that I was wrong about what position Williams played at Green Bay but it really doesn't matter because you do not take a 4-3 DT and try to make him a 3-4 DE. I mean Williams even said before the beginning of the season that he was having a hard time adjusting.

Regarding blaming Jones for McDonald getting beat on that long TD I saw McDonald signaling Jones (I think) but that is still no excuse for a CB to get beat on a 90+ yard pass play. He should have just given the WR more cushion.

When it comes to the draft, Romeo does not tell Savage squat. Savage makes all of the personnel decisions and does most of the scouting. I will admit that Wembley had a very good rookie season but where was he last year and where is he this year. All I am saying is that there are not many of Savage's draft choices contributing to the Browns this season or last.

On another topic, I wonder how many passing yards the Texas Tech offense would put on the Browns.
 
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Bucks21;1318315; said:


Sorry little buck but his natural position is DT in a 4-3 which is what he played with green bay. Its hard for Wimbley to get sacks when he doesn't have his hand on the ground and the browns only rush 3 guys.

As mentioned in my response above I will admit that I was wrong about Williams' position at Green Bay but it really doesn't make any difference. It was the same thing with Sean Smith last year. The reason that he came to Cleveland was because he wanted to play NT which they were not playing him in Cincinnati and look what happened.

Regarding your statement about Wembley I guess my question would be why did they draft him if they were not going to use him as a pass rusher. I thought that was the reason he was drafted and that is how he performed his rookie season. Haven't seen much of him the past season and a half. #1 draft choices really need to be contributors and we haven't seen a whole lot of that art of Cleveland this year or their defense last year.
 
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Analysis: Much work awaits to re-assess and rebuild a deflated Browns franchise
by Tony Grossi
Saturday November 08, 2008, 9:25 PM
The past two games have seen the Browns play worse defense than at any time since their expansion rebirth.

That's not easy to do without players named John Thierry, Darius Holland, Rahim Abdullah, Marquez Pope and Corey Fuller manning starting positions.

But those expansion immortals never rushed the passer so passively, tackled so poorly and covered so badly as the current Browns in the past two games.

The Browns were tied with Baltimore, 13-13, and led Denver, 20-10, at halftime of the past two games, both at home.

In the second half, they let the Ravens pile up 221 yards and 17 points (not counting an interception return). The Broncos rang up 288 yards and 24 points.

In those two halves of play, Baltimore rookie quarterback Joe Flacco -- who's no John Unitas -- and Denver's Jay Cutler -- no John Elway -- combined for 18-of-31 passing for 449 yards and four touchdowns. Their combined passer rating was 142.1.

Cutler threw for 202 yards and three touchdowns in the fourth quarter alone.

It wasn't a good five days for rookie defensive coordinator Mel Tucker, who was turned inside out by two of the NFL's finest offensive play-callers, Cam Cameron of Baltimore and Mike Shanahan of Denver.
Tucker, of course, didn't drop interceptions, lose coverage or whiff on tackles. But these epic breakdowns occurred on his watch and have thrown the remainder of the season into rebuilding mode.

GM Phil Savage said in the 2008 off-season that he expected the Browns to contend for the Super Bowl over the next three seasons. That hope suggested the bulk of his work in building the team was over and just some fine-tuning remained. Far from it.

The collapse of the defense shrieks for a major overhaul. And the change in quarterbacks after a half-season of offensive doldrums means there are changes brewing on that side of the ball, too.
How do the Browns get their train back on track?

Decide on who's calling the shots

Will the Savage-Romeo Crennel partnership survive a fifth season? Will both go or just Crennel?

If Savage stays, who's the next head coach? The instant front-runner would be Iowa coach Kirk Ferentz, one of Savage's best friends in the business. Why him? Savage's contract gives him control over the draft and the selection of the 53-player roster. Few experienced NFL coaches would agree to those conditions.

Hiring Ferentz -- who has resisted NFL overtures several times -- would probably mean a new offensive system, too. Considering the state of the defense, that might be biting off more than the Browns can chew in one off-season.

One alternative is to wipe the slate clean and hire Bill Cowher at $8 million a year. If owner Randy Lerner did that, he would reinstitute the coach as football czar -- something he swore off after the Butch Davis debacle.
So, for the purposes of this discussion, let's assume Savage and Crennel stay intact.

Scrap the 3-4 defense

Savage has indicated this will be seriously discussed. The discussion should go something like this: "This isn't even close to working. We're scrapping the 3-4."

So the scouting and free agent season should be conducted with the 4-3 in mind. The team is loaded with 4-3 defensive tackles. It has to find some ends, leaner and quicker than anybody on hand.

Where would Kamerion Wimbley fit in a 4-3 alignment? He was a 4-3 end at Florida State. He might be undersized for right end at the NFL level, but it might save his career, too. Or he could be tried as a 4-3 outside linebacker. At worst, Wimbley would rush the passer in sub schemes.

In the years when the Steelers were the only team playing a 3-4

defense, a 'tweener like Wimbley would fall into the second or third round. Selecting him in the first round obviously was an expensive reach, and it was compounded by the fact that Savage traded down with Baltimore and gift-wrapped stud nose tackle Haloti Ngata for the Ravens. Ouch.

Continued
 
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Bud Shaw's Sports Spin: Browns' inconsistency casting a shadow on Crennel
by Bud Shaw
Saturday November 08, 2008, 11:19 PM

Romeo's defense wasn't built in a day

The shoddy construction just makes it look that way.

The Browns have been terrible recently on the side of the ball where Romeo Crennel's expertise lies. They look ill-equipped and ineptly aligned in a 3-4 defense that is supposedly his bailiwick.

Second-half adjustments have challenged him and his coaching staff. I know what you're thinking. At least he has good clock management skills.
No?

Crennel has received his highest marks from management for providing a bedrock of stability in thought, word and deed for a young, emerging team. But here we are in his fourth year and the Browns are inconsistent starters and ineffective finishers on too many Sundays.

Here we are halfway through a season that has already leaked virtually every last drop of playoff promise, and running back Jamal Lewis feels the need to call out teammates for oversized egos and a lack of heart and effort.

So what does Crennel say, given that opening by Lewis? Not much. Not enough.
continued
 
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Lewis rips some Browns teammates
by Mary Kay Cabot
Friday November 07, 2008, 8:55 PM

A frustrated Jamal Lewis ripped some of his Browns teammates after the 34-30 loss to Denver for quitting while they were ahead in the third quarter Thursday.

"This is the NFL, you can't call it quits until the game is over," the running back said. "But it looks to me like some people called it quits before that. Denver was down, but they didn't call it quits. They kept their heads up and they finished. We didn't do that two weeks in a row -- at home."

Continued
 
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NFL Insider: Catching Cowher in a Web?
by Tony Grossi
Saturday November 08, 2008, 3:25 PM

The Internet era makes life tougher for football coaches and now there's a Web site asking Browns owner Randy Lerner to hire Bill Cowher for the 2009 season.

Cowher09.com debuted a month ago "out of frustration," said co-creator Ryan Martz, a 25-year-old mortgage loan officer in Columbus.

Martz said in the 24 hours following the Browns' 34-30 meltdown loss to Denver on Thursday night more users signed his petition than in the previous seven days combined.

Continued
 
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