Big Ten and other Conference Expansion

[jwinslow]

The pac10 makes sense for overall sports, particularly the spring sports. Everyone but Oregon St finished in the top 25 in the directors cup last year.

What the big ten offers is superior cash, football, prestige and marketing.

As long as Texas is strongly pursued and says no, I'm ok with nd, miss, neb, pitt and cuse. Rutgers has no business in the premiere conference in America. Struggling conferences might choose to mortgage their future on a huge risk like Rutgers, but the big ten needs to strike first to stay ahead. They will intrigue new York with nd, cuse and the headliners in the big ten. They risk too much chance of failure with too little chance of cashing in with the weak hope that is Rutgers.

 

[BuckTwenty]

As long as Texas is strongly pursued and says no, I'm ok with nd, miss, neb, pitt and cuse. Rutgers has no business in the premiere conference in America. Struggling conferences might choose to mortgage their future on a huge risk like Rutgers, but the big ten needs to strike first to stay ahead. They will intrigue new York with nd, cuse and the headliners in the big ten. They risk too much chance of failure with too little chance of cashing in with the weak hope that is Rutgers.

Amen.

 

[CHU]

Rutgers has no business in the premiere conference in America. Struggling conferences might choose to mortgage their future on a huge risk like Rutgers, but the big ten needs to strike first to stay ahead. They will intrigue new York with nd, cuse and the headliners in the big ten. They risk too much chance of failure with too little chance of cashing in with the weak hope that is Rutgers.

What are you talking about, Rutgers finishes every year in the 90's in the Director's Cup. Real powerhouse of an athletic department :)

If someone was born in Florida, it doesn't mean that they're automatically fast (liken to Rutgers being close to New York and the NY market).

All I personally think about with Rutgers is organized crime, cement boots, Jim Delaney and a "offer he can't refuse" (then I hear the Sopranos theme in my head).

And as Rich Rodriguez has shown, that Big East to Big Ten transition is seamless.

 

[Gatorubet]

If someone was born in Florida, it doesn't mean that they're automatically fast (liken to Rutgers being close to New York and the NY market).

link?

 

[mross34]

All I personally think about with Rutgers is organized crime, cement boots, Jim Delaney and a "offer he can't refuse" (then I hear the Sopranos theme in my head).

Just a heads up. Jim Delaney was born and raised in South Orange, NJ, about 30-40 minutes from New Brunswick.

 

[Mike80]

What are you talking about, Rutgers finishes every year in the 90's in the Director's Cup. Real powerhouse of an athletic department :)

If someone was born in Florida, it doesn't mean that they're automatically fast (liken to Rutgers being close to New York and the NY market).

All I personally think about with Rutgers is organized crime, cement boots, Jim Delaney and a "offer he can't refuse" (then I hear the Sopranos theme in my head).

And as Rich Rodriguez has shown, that Big East to Big Ten transition is seamless.

link?

It took you 45 minutes to respond - that's enough proof.

 

[Gatorubet]

What are you talking about, Rutgers finishes every year in the 90's in the Director's Cup. Real powerhouse of an athletic department :)

If someone was born in Florida, it doesn't mean that they're automatically fast (liken to Rutgers being close to New York and the NY market).

All I personally think about with Rutgers is organized crime, cement boots, Jim Delaney and a "offer he can't refuse" (then I hear the Sopranos theme in my head).

And as Rich Rodriguez has shown, that Big East to Big Ten transition is seamless.

link?

It took you 45 minutes to respond - that's enough proof.

I wasn't born in Florida.

 

[lvbuckeye]

i think they should add 9 teams, have 2 divisions, and call it the Big Tens.

 

[CentralMOBuck]

I'd like to see Mizzou added to the Big Ten. Mainly so I can watch the Bucks more often.

 

[MissouriFan]

For those that think The Big Ten would need to add Notre Dame or Texas for expansion to be successful I have to disagree.

If the Big Ten added the following schools Maryland, Missouri, Nebraska, Syracuse, and Rutgers it would have the following metro areas with a population of 1,000,000+.

METRO - POPULATION (% INCREASE SINCE 2000)
1. New York - 19,069,796 (+4.08%)
3. Chicago - 9,580,567 (+5.30%)
5. Philadelphia - 5,968,252 (+4.94%)
8. Washington D.C. - 5,476,241 (+14.18%)
11. Detroit - 4,403,437 (−1.10%)
16. Minneapolis - 3,269,814 (+10.14%)
18. St. Louis - 2,828,990 (+4.83%)
20. Baltimore - 2,690,886 (+5.40%)
22. Pittsburgh - 2,354,957 (−3.13%)
24. Cincinnati - 2,171,896 (+8.07%)
26. Cleveland - 2,091,286 (−2.65%)
29. Kansas City - 2,067,585 (12.61%)
32. Columbus - 1,801,848 (+11.73%)
34. Indianapolis - 1,743,658 (+14.33%)
39. Milwaukee - 1,559,667 (+3.93%)
50. Buffalo - 1,123,804 (−3.96%)
51. Rochester - 1,035,566 (−0.22%)

Here is the current Big Ten without those additions.

METRO - POPULATION (% INCREASE SINCE 2000)
3. Chicago - 9,580,567 (+5.30%)
5. Philadelphia - 5,968,252 (+4.94%)
11. Detroit - 4,403,437 (−1.10%)
16. Minneapolis - 3,269,814 (+10.14%)
22. Pittsburgh - 2,354,957 (−3.13%)
24. Cincinnati - 2,171,896 (+8.07%)
26. Cleveland - 2,091,286 (−2.65%)
32. Columbus - 1,801,848 (+11.73%)
34. Indianapolis - 1,743,658 (+14.33%)
39. Milwaukee - 1,559,667 (+3.93%)

Adding the schools listed above would add 7 metro areas with over a million people and all five are AAU members.

Syracuse and Rutgers together would bring
1. New York - 19,069,796 (+4.08%)
50. Buffalo - 1,123,804 (−3.96%)
51. Rochester - 1,035,566 (−0.22%)

And also a strong hoops program with Syracuse basketball.

Maryland would bring
8. Washington D.C. - 5,476,241 (+14.18%)
20. Baltimore - 2,690,886 (+5.40%)

And another great hoops program.

Missouri would bring
18. St. Louis - 2,828,990 (+4.83%)
29. Kansas City - 2,067,585 (12.61%)

And solid sports programs in both football and basketball.

Nebraska would bring
59. Omaha - !B9863475767683 849,517 (+10.75%)

A passionate fan base and a market that in a few years might be another 1,000,000+ market.

Plus of course Nebraska football.


If the Big Ten added those schools I really think expansion could be profitable for all and far from a failure.



Divisions could be split like this.

Maryland, Penn State, Syracuse, and Rutgers

Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State, and Indiana

Minnesota, Northwestern, Purdue, and Wisconsin

Illinois, Iowa, Missouri, and Nebraska.


To show you how this would work for Ohio State here is what the first 4 years of football would look like. Not the order obviously but the teams listed.

Ohio State's Conference Schedule in 2012 would look something like this.
@Maryland
Syracuse
Michigan
@Michigan State
Indiana
@Minnesota
Purdue
@Illinois
Missouri

Ohio State's Conference Schedule in 2013 would look something like this.
Maryland
@Syracuse
@Michigan
Michigan State
@Indiana
Minnesota
@Purdue
Illinois
@Missouri

Ohio State's Conference Schedule in 2014 would look something like this.
@Penn State
Rutgers
Michigan
@Michigan State
Indiana
@Northwestern
Wisconsin
@Iowa
Nebraska

Ohio State's Conference Schedule in 2015 would look something like this.
Penn State
@Rutgers
@Michigan
Michigan State
@Indiana
Northwestern
@Wisconsin
Iowa
@Nebraska

In four years you would get to play every team both home and away.


Here is how this would work for you all in hoops.

Ohio State's Conference Schedule in 2012 would look something like this.
Maryland
@Penn State
Syracuse
@Rutgers
Michigan
@Michigan
Michigan State
@Michigan State
Indiana
@Indiana
Minnesota
@Northwestern
Purdue
@Wisconsin
Iowa
@Illinois
Missouri
@Nebraska

Ohio State's Conference Schedule in 2013 would look something like this.
@Maryland
Penn State
@Syracuse
Rutgers
Michigan
@Michigan
Michigan State
@Michigan State
Indiana
@Indiana
@Minnesota
Northwestern
@Purdue
Wisconsin
@Iowa
Illinois
@Missouri
Nebraska

You play ever team each year in hoops and in two years will have played every team home and away.

It would be a fun conference in both major sports and have a large, populated, and profitable footprint.

 

[Buckeye86]

if you are going to take a dump on the greatest rivalry in the history of sports for the sake of a championship game and earning more money, you better earn a shit ton more money and increase the prestige and footprint of the Big Ten significantly, not just a little bit

that is why expansion without Texas and/or Notre Dame is a failure

also, fuck all of the east coast schools, fuck what Penn State wants in this expansion, give me Missouri, Nebraska, Texas, Texas A&M and Notre Dame and tell Penn State to go fuck themselves

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

I don't have numbers to support this, but I wonder if adding Notre Dame would do more to lock up the NYC market than adding both Syracuse and Rutgers.

 

[zincfinger]

For those that think The Big Ten would need to add Notre Dame or Texas for expansion to be successful I have to disagree.

If the Big Ten added the following schools Maryland, Missouri, Nebraska, Syracuse, and Rutgers it would have the following metro areas with a population of 1,000,000+....

It would be a fun conference in both major sports and have a large, populated, and profitable footprint.

The BigTen is already all of those things. I'm not opposed to adding Missouri, in fact I think they're the strongest tier 2 addition (depending on whether Nebraska is considered the weakest tier 1 or the strongest tier 2). But I also think at least one premium tier 1 is needed in order for the process to be an unqualified success.

Your demographic/media market argument which seeks to bypass this simplifies things too much in my opinion, as it assumes a) that adding markets is virtually all that matters, and b) that adding a school that is located near some population center effectively locks up that population center for the BigTen coffers. In my opinion, neither of those is true. If they were, the conference would be best suited to add something like Fordham U. (locks up NYC), Cal St Long Beach (locks up southern California), Houston (locks up Texas), and Emory (locks up Atlanta). I'm aware those aren't all D-1A football schools, but you get my point. There have to be some trade-offs between the competing considerations on whom should be added, such as landing a) the best schools, b) the most geographically and historically appropriate schools, and c) the schools located near, and/or able to meaningfully penetrate, major media markets. There's really only one school that satisfies all those criteria in aces, and one other who's so strong everywhere else, their imperfect geographical/historical fit doesn't matter.

 

[buckeyesin07]

For those that think The Big Ten would need to add Notre Dame or Texas for expansion to be successful I have to disagree.

If the Big Ten added the following schools Maryland, Missouri, Nebraska, Syracuse, and Rutgers it would have the following metro areas with a population of 1,000,000+.

METRO - POPULATION (% INCREASE SINCE 2000)
1. New York - 19,069,796 (+4.08%)

You're assuming that the Big Ten adding Syracuse and/or Rutgers would necessarily result in the conference "having" the NY metro area. I'm not sure I agree. What makes you think that people in NYC care about Rutgers or Syracuse sports enough for this to be true? Maybe Syracuse for basketball only, but for the other three major sports (Syracuse football, Rutgers football, and Rutgers basketball), I think that assumption is, at best, arguable.

I simply don't think that an expansion without Texas or ND (maybe Nebraska can be added here) is worthwhile--I'd rather keep the conference at 11 teams. We already have enough second-tier programs, such as MSU, Purdue, and Northwestern. No reason to add another.

 

[Buckeye86]

We already have enough second-tier programs, such as MSU, Purdue, and Northwestern. No reason to add another.

Michigan State but not Indiana?

Also, Northwestern has won just as many Big Ten titles in the last 20 years as Penn State has. Everyone sit and chuckle at that for a minute or two.

Your point remains, adding teams just to add them without significantly improving something in the Big Ten is stupid... you just need a little work on your list of second tier teams.