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2009 TSUN arguments, shenanigans (not football)

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Jaxbuck;1498640; said:
It all goes back to paying the price for hiring a scheme coach. They lack the flexibility to do anything else. JT has gone from Steve Bellasari to Krenzel to Zwick to Troy Smith to Boeckman to Pryor. Good coaches can run a normal offense and tailor it to the talent they have on hand. They don't have to run gimmick offenses that over specializes and is completely ineffective without a particular type of player. In short, good coaches can come in and be competitive from day 1 with whatever they have on hand.



Even without Mallet he inherited a team with a chance at a decent running game and a solid defense. A good coach who is more than a 1 trick pony could have played a solid conservative defense first style and gotten 6-7 wins but RR, like all scheme coaches, doesn't focus on defense. They want to show the world their genius and only concentrate on offense, more specifically their particular style of offense.

Dick Rod is just another branch from the Mouse Davis/June Jones/Joe Tiller coaching tree. The only difference is a big time school's AD panicked in the midst of a bungled coaching search and has given RR a bigger stage to be exposed on.
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Don't forget John Jenkins at Houston!! Remember how he was going to revolutionize offensive football? Where is he again?

If RR doesn't work out UM will be reeling for the next 10 years.
 
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ysubuck;1498651; said:
Another offensive commit in Austin White. May be a good pick up.

Who is going to play defense on this team?

How many 2010 scholarships does UM have? How is the defense going to look in two years?

I know, I know. Big Will and Marvin Robinson and Vlad.

Be honest UM fans. Thinking about the way this defense is headed has to have you [censored]ting your pants.
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White is also a pretty good safety prospect. White should be listed by Rivals and Scout as an athlete, because a lot of people who have seen think that his best potential is either at safety or receiver.
 
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blueinfla;1498622; said:
Right, so RR was supposed to run a pro-set because he didnt' have a dual-threat QB??? Every article I've read talks about the step forward in year two, both for QBs and for the rest of the offense. If they had done that, the offense would be further behind this year.

The evidence that I saw of adapting his offense to his QBs was that when Sheridan was trying to QB the team, he would roll him out because he threw better on the run (Minnesota), and this allowed the receivers more time to get open. Threet - well, what system fits a QB that isn't very accurate with his arm, and isn't all that mobile? There were games when Threet was actually able to hit his open receivers, believe it or not. (Utah, PSU) In these games, RR was able to use Threet's arm more.

I guess my question is, what is he supposed to adapt his offense to if the QB play is as poor as it was in '08 for UM?
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No one said he has to run a pro-set, but you would have thought he would have at least tried something that had the potential to work with the options he had at hand. You guys are relying heavily on this "step forward in year two" but you are putting all of your hopes into a true freshman. Exactly how big of a step do you guys think you will make with a kid whose arms are as big as my 8 year old sons?!?!?! If RR was such a great coach why didnt he start out with the basics of his system and then continually build upon that? He doesnt know any other system that is why. It was either sink or swim with his offense, and last year you guys definitely werent floating. I understand growing pains and such, but it doesnt really seem like he was even able to understand that he was fitting a square peg in a round hole. He seemed aware that he didnt have the pieces to run his system, he forced it anyway though.

You give examples of games in which he was able to "adapt his offense" but you only listed a total of 3! So basically 3 games out of the entire season he tried to adapt, and there was very little change at that. That should say something right there. Heck last year just seemed like a cluster fuck for him. His Offense was terrible, and his defense was just as bad. LLLoyd didnt leave the cupboard bare, he left a team that could have easily won 6 or 7 games under a good coach. My question is you guys are supposed to magically improve so much offensively in the second year; but arent you guys still basically relying on alot of Carr's recruits which you guys claim left the cupboard bare? There are a couple of true freshman that could make an impact but I dont see that adding up to a much better year than last year.
 
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mh20;1498660; said:
White is also a pretty good safety prospect. White should be listed by Rivals and Scout as an athlete, because a lot of people who have seen think that his best potential is either at safety or receiver.
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Secondary isnt necessarily your weakness on defense though. Where are all these LB/DL recruits that are sorely needed?
 
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osubartender23;1498666; said:
Secondary isnt necessarily your weakness on defense though. Where are all these LB/DL recruits that are sorely needed?
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DL:
Jordan Paskorz
Ken Wilkins

LB:
Antonio Kinard
Marvin Robinson


It's still very early in the recruiting process, it's still July. I would expect that there will be a few de-commits, a few new commits, and that Michigan will pick-up a couple of DT's along the way, because they need 2.
 
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The bare cupboard argument does have some merit. It's true that under a more "traditional" coach, the argument would not fly as the pieces were indeed in place for a decent 2008 (something on the order of 8-4, I'm guessing), but it's also true that Carr did not recruit the sort of guys necessary for RRs scheme(s) so.. the cupboard is indeed bare vis a vis those sorts of players. Of course, that's not Carr's fault, since he wasn't planning on running that sort of O in the first instance. So... "Merit" is probably the wrong word, as it's a specious argument to make in light of the facts, but.. it is true that the talent for that type of O isn't there yet.

That said, I seem to recall much chest puffing about how the very presence of the Read Option would have teams like Ohio State running for cover and how "Michigan gets way better talent than WVU" as a suggestion that Michigan would step right in to a wholly different offense and succeed right out of the gate.
 
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NFBuck;1498652; said:
If he used Threet in a more conventional offense, I have no doubt he would have been at least moderately effective...at the very least better than last year. With a two back set, maybe McGuffie doesn't get folded in half so much...and I know Minor could do pretty well in that set. The biggest thing is that with a more conventional, ball control offense, the defense has time to actually catch their breath and maybe, just maybe, isn't as awful.
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Please. This is the biggest line of b.s. I have ever seen on this board.

It would not have mattered what offense that Rich used Threet in. Threet was incapable of completing simple routine passes. The kid struggled with his accuracy terribly in an offense that required him to make for the most part very simple throws.

Rich was screwed with one QB that didn't have a D-II arm let alone a BCS level arm (Sheridan) and another that couldn't hit the broad side of a barn most of the time (Threet).
 
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mh20;1498670; said:
Please. This is the biggest line of b.s. I have ever seen on this board.

It would not have mattered what offense that Rich used Threet in. Threet was incapable of completing simple routine passes. The kid struggled with his accuracy terribly in an offense that required him to make for the most part very simple throws.

Rich was screwed with one QB that didn't have a D-II arm let alone a BCS level arm (Sheridan) and another that couldn't hit the broad side of a barn most of the time (Threet).
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Too bad Justin Feagan was worse, eh?
 
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mh20;1498668; said:
DL:
Jordan Paskorz
Ken Wilkins

LB:
Antonio Kinard
Marvin Robinson


It's still very early in the recruiting process, it's still July. I would expect that there will be a few de-commits, a few new commits, and that Michigan will pick-up a couple of DT's along the way, because they need 2.
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You guys are banking on these de-commits though, so what if they dont de-commit?
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks;1498672; said:
Too bad Justin Feagan was worse, eh?
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Feagin only played in 3 games, he never even attempted a pass, and he only ran the ball a handful of times, so to be honest with you, who really knows if he was worse?

I can't imagine anybody being more inaccurate than Steven Threet or anybody less equipped with the necessary talent/physical tools than Nick Sheridan.
 
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mh20;1498670; said:
Please. This is the biggest line of b.s. I have ever seen on this board.

It would not have mattered what offense that Rich used Threet in. Threet was incapable of completing simple routine passes. The kid struggled with his accuracy terribly in an offense that required him to make for the most part very simple throws.

Rich was screwed with one QB that didn't have a D-II arm let alone a BCS level arm (Sheridan) and another that couldn't hit the broad side of a barn most of the time (Threet).
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Oh, I assure you, there are bigger lines of bullshit...many of your posts qualify.

Could Threet's accuracy have struggled because he was forced into an offensive scheme where he didn't fit? Hmmm, his scouting report lists accuracy/consistency as a strength:
Scout.com: Steven Threet Profile

Nope, couldn't be, because that would make your boy Richie look bad. I never said he would be a world beater, but are you honestly saying that he wouldn't have been better in a more conventional offense? It didn't help his cause that having an OL ill-suited or ill-prepared to run Richie's offense often left him little to no time to make a throw. (p.s. Fuck you for making me defend a former scUMmer).

And Richie was "screwed"? How so genius? He took the job knowing full well that he didn't have a QB that could effectively run his offense. Lets hear you blame Carr for leaving the cupboard bare...I know you want to.
 
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