• Follow us on Twitter @buckeyeplanet and @bp_recruiting, like us on Facebook! Enjoy a post or article, recommend it to others! BP is only as strong as its community, and we only promote by word of mouth, so share away!
  • Consider registering! Fewer and higher quality ads, no emails you don't want, access to all the forums, download game torrents, private messages, polls, Sportsbook, etc. Even if you just want to lurk, there are a lot of good reasons to register!

2009 TSUN arguments, shenanigans (not football)

Jump to latest Follow Reply
Sort by date Sort by votes
Dryden;1568369; said:
It's one of four things:

a) Michigan fans know deep down inside that their new head coach is a classless douche bag void of a single shred of integrity, so a vote of confidence from Carr would assuage those doubts.

b) They've lived for 20 years with the shadow of Bo over the program, who remained a visible figure in the football program and a yes-man for Moeller and Carr, so they just don't know any different, which is a shame for Carr if he's going to have to live his retirement against everything Bo did -- it wasn't enough to actually live in his shadow just coaching there.

c) They are genuinely angry with Carr for 1-6 against Tressel, much like most OSU fans are/were with Cooper, and this anger has lead to a delusional belief that Carr is deliberately trying to wreck the U-M program from within. E.g., The rumor of Carr encouraging Boren to leave for OSU.

d) All of the above.
Click to expand...

D. What do I win?
 
Upvote 0
Some natives are getting restless..

olverine 915
Recruit


Total Posts : 2
Reward points : 14
Joined: 10/24/2009
Status: offline

Message Options
An Honest Assessment of Rich Rodriguez - 1 hrs. ago ( #1 )
This is my first post here, but I have been reading the postings on this site regularly for over a year. I have to address the unqualified support for Rich Rod and the idea that Rich Rod simply "needs more time." Let me be clear -- I supported the Rich Rod hire and thought that Lloyd Carr's program had become stale. However, any change is not necessarily a good change.

In my opinion, the Rodriguez era has been a complete disaster for our program. Before everyone jumps all over me, here are the simple facts of the matter:

1) In the 1 1/2 years of the Rodriguez era, Michigan has lost 4 games by 20+ points: Penn State (2008 and 2009), Illinois (2008), Ohio State (2008). In the 38 years from 1969 through 2007, Michigan lost 7 games by 20+ points: Oregon (2007), Iowa (2002), Tennessee (2002 Citrus Bowl), Washington (1992 Rose Bowl), Florida State (1991), Iowa (1984), Missouri (1969). Two observations here: First, Rich Rod has lost almost as many games by 20+ points in a year and half as Schembechler, Moeller and Carr did combined in 38 seasons. Second, most of the 20+ point losses between 1969 and 2007 were to truly excellent teams. For example, Florida State 1991 was a juggernaut. Washington won the national championship the year they housed us in the Rose Bowl. Iowa in 2002 went to a BCS Bowl and was the co-Big Ten Champion. By contrast, Rodriguez has been blown out by Illinois and a mediocre Penn State team at home.

2) In 2008, Michigan gave up 347 points -- the worst defensive performance in Michigan history by 82 points over the second worst year (2002, when we gave up 265 points).

3) In 2008, Michigan scored 243 points -- the worst offensive performance since 1984.

4) Rodriguez's 3-9 campaign in 2008 was the worst record in Michigan history and represented the most losses in a season in Michigan history.

5) Michigan in 2008-09 lost to Michigan State in back-to-back years for the first time since 1966-67.

6) Michigan in 2008 missed a bowl for the first time since 1974 and suffered a losing season for the first time since 1967.

7) Under Rodriguez, Michigan is 3-9 in the Big Ten. This represents the worst performance over 12 games of conference play since 1962-63, which Michigan went 3-8-1 between the start of Big 10 play in 1962 and the Illinois game in 1963.

8) Michigan's 42-7 loss to Ohio State in 2008 is the worst loss suffered by Michigan since the 50-14 loss to Ohio State in 1968.

9) Michigan is under official NCAA investigation for the first time in the history of the program.

Those are the facts. They are not disputable. The 1 1/2 year tenure of Rich Rodriguez has seen nothing but the setting of negative records and the breaking of streaks that were a great part of the Michigan tradition. It positively blows my mind that Rodriguez has lost 4 games by 20+ points when we lost only 7 by that much in 38 years prior. Thus, its not just that we lose. We are failing to be competitive at a historic rate.

Anyone who says that Rodriguez is doing a good job or needs more time MUST contend with these facts. To ignore them is to stick your head in the sand. The standard excuse that I hear is that Rodriguez does not have "his" players or that Carr left the cubboard empty. Fair enough. I personally believe that Carr's last couple recruiting classes HAVE proven to be subpar. However, WALK-ONS can be coached to catch punts, to secure the football, to make accurate shotgun snaps, to line up properly at the line of scrimmage, etc. The fact that we constantly turn the ball over is an example of poor coaching. Obviously, Rodriguez can't help when Forcier makes a freshman mistake and throws nto coverage, but the fact that our running backs and receivers constantly put the ball on the ground is coaching. The fact that our punt returners have struggled to catch punts is coaching. The fact that David Moosman, after 5 games, can't consistently make a shotgun snap is coaching. If you don't think it is, you have no clue about football. We make the same mistakes over and over. That's coaching.

Rodriguez also looks completely lost on the sidelines. That screaming match between him and Bruce Tall was an example. Have you ever seen Mike Tomlin on the sidelines? Jim Tressel? Mack Brown? None of them are flipping out at their coaches or being flipped out at by their coaches. Its out of control.

Anyone who thinks this is poised to get better next year is kidding themselves. How is our defense going to be better with Graham and Warren leaving? We obviously have nobody else capable of playing when Obi Ezeh is a starting linebacker and we start a walk-on at safety. Our recruiting class is relatively poor and is woefully inadequate in terms of defensive commitments.

Finally, we are facing an NCAA investigation for the first time ever. Think the allegations are crap? Good. Me too. Thats unfortunately not the point. We used to pride ourselves on the fact that our program never even sniffed NCAA violations. Now we can't say that. Rodriguez created a situation where these allegations could be made. And thats a problem.

If you're going to respond, please do so with facts, not a diatribe about how nobody gives Rich Rod a chance. Also, don't respond by blaming other people. Here's a lesson on leadership -- the buck stops with the person in charge. Its Rodriguez's program -- problems are his responsibility. Thats what they call being a leader and being in charge.
Click to expand...
 
Upvote 0
7) Under Rodriguez, Michigan is 3-9 in the Big Ten. This represents the worst performance over 12 games of conference play since 1962-63, which Michigan went 3-8-1 between the start of Big 10 play in 1962 and the Illinois game in 1963.
Click to expand...
I hate to be a nit-picker, but 3-9 is actually worse that 3-8-1 ... so it looks like we'll have to go back a few more years to find Michigan's worst performance over 12 games of conference play.

EDIT: Looks like Michigan had a 3-9 Big Ten stretch between 10-18-1958 and 11-14-1959. To find a worse record over 12 Big Ten games, you have to go back to the 1930's, when Michigan went 2-10 between 10-09-1935 and 10-30-1937 (they actually lost ten in a row before winning the last two of the twelve games).
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
LordJeffBuck;1577956; said:
I hate to be a nit-picker, but 3-9 is actually worse that 3-8-1 ... so it looks like we'll have to go back a few more years to find Michigan's worst performance over 12 games of conference play.

EDIT: Looks like Michigan had a 3-9 Big Ten stretch between 10-18-1958 and 11-14-1959. To find a worse record over 12 Big Ten games, you have to go back to the 1930's, when Michigan went 2-10 between 10-09-1935 and 10-30-1937 (they actually lost ten in a row before winning the last two of the twelve games).
Click to expand...

Nit picker. Were there any 2-point defensive conversions back then? :tongue2:
 
Upvote 0
LordJeffBuck;1577956; said:
I hate to be a nit-picker, but 3-9 is actually worse that 3-8-1 ... so it looks like we'll have to go back a few more years to find Michigan's worst performance over 12 games of conference play.

EDIT: Looks like Michigan had a 3-9 Big Ten stretch between 10-18-1958 and 11-14-1959. To find a worse record over 12 Big Ten games, you have to go back to the 1930's, when Michigan went 2-10 between 10-09-1935 and 10-30-1937 (they actually lost ten in a row before winning the last two of the twelve games).
Click to expand...

Good post. I think a spirit of public-mindedness, like this post, is a lost art in modern life. Well done. Accuracy is important. And, rivalry or no rivalry, if we are not to help our friends from north of the border to truly realize the state of their condition, well, I ask you, who will?

0792846443.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg
 
Upvote 0
It would seem to me that the demise of Michigan defense is at the root of the issue. Ron English had been hired to restore the defense and left (was booted) with Carr, leaving the cupboard bare.

Much as I enjoy poking fun at ol' Dick Wad, he wasn't left with much to work with as in no D and no QBs when Mallett bolted. Not a very promising jump off spot.

Still he found enough to beat ND this year and for that I am eternally grateful.
 
Upvote 0
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top