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2009 tOSU Offense Discussion

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NateG;1553447; said:
I agree mostly with that... my only rebuttal is that its the first quarter of the season..when do stats count... (4/12 games) and the competition doesn't necessarily get easier especially in the fourth quarter(NMSU,@State Penn, Iowa, At scUM). But there is plenty of time to get better and I believe time heals alot of these wounds.
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not that the stats don't count, just saying take the national rankings with a huge grain of salt at this time of the year due to OOC play.
 
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OSU shotgun deals blow to 'I'
Switch in formations seems to fit Herron, Pryor, offensive line
Saturday, October 3, 2009
By Ken Gordon
THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH

The first question to tight-ends coach John Peterson this week was one of those "I'm joking, but not really" questions: "So, Coach, is the I formation dead now at Ohio State?"

To which Peterson smiled and replied, "I don't think the I will ever be dead here."

Maybe not, but through three games, it looked terminally ill.

Through two weeks, the Buckeyes averaged 3.5 yards per carry and did not have a rush longer than 19 yards. After an 18-15 loss to Southern California, receiver DeVier Posey said: "We've got some holes in our offense."

Even in the third game, when OSU rushed for 247 yards against Toledo, not all was right. The Buckeyes continued to struggle in short-yardage situations out of the I formation: Tailback Daniel Herron gained no yards on two carries inside the Rockets' 5-yard line.

After that game, OSU ranked 51st nationally in rushing, at 167 yards per game. The next day, coach Jim Tressel told his staff that something had to change.

"We had played three games, and there was finally some statistical data and some realistic things that you could put your thumb on and say, 'OK, here's what we've done well,' " Tressel said. "And now, 'OK, maybe we need to do this a little more.' "
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BuckeyeXtra - OSU shotgun deals blow to 'I'
 
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The most fascinating thing, to me, is that Tressel has spent time studying stats, tendencies and what have you to the point where he basically switched the offense completely. Running primarily power out of the I is radically different from what the Buckeyes did against the Illini. It will be interesting to see the evolution of our offense the rest of the season.
 
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MaxBuck;1556528; said:
The most fascinating thing, to me, is that Tressel has spent time studying stats, tendencies and what have you to the point where he basically switched the offense completely...
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Good point.

This is the difference between Tressel and one-trick ponies like RR, in my opinion. He analyzes and plays to his strengths and the opponent's weaknesses.
 
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Still Struggling to get in the endzone. We controled the game. Yes we got in the endzone 4 times. But still the number of other times we were in Indiana's territory and came away with a FG, FG attempt, or interception. Can't blame it on the weather last night.

4-12 on Third down. Not good!

Once again, I like where the offense is going, just pointing out to be elite we gotta put the ball in the endzone. I will do a little bit of a breakdown hopefully later in the week.
 
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crazybuckfan40;1558288; said:
Still Struggling to get in the endzone. We controled the game. Yes we got in the endzone 4 times. But still the number of other times we were in Indiana's territory and came away with a FG, FG attempt, or interception. Can't blame it on the weather last night.

4-12 on Third down. Not good!

Once again, I like where the offense is going, just pointing out to be elite we gotta put the ball in the endzone. I will do a little bit of a breakdown hopefully later in the week.
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+1

I liked what I saw from Pryor in throwing at least 1 away instead of taking a sack but overall his decision making is still a work in progress(to be kind). When the unnecessary sacks and the fumbles stop the offense will take a big step forward. I like seeing a more concerted effort to get him running.
 
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crazybuckfan40;1558288; said:
Still Struggling to get in the endzone. We controled the game. Yes we got in the endzone 4 times. But still the number of other times we were in Indiana's territory and came away with a FG, FG attempt, or interception. Can't blame it on the weather last night.

4-12 on Third down. Not good!

Once again, I like where the offense is going, just pointing out to be elite we gotta put the ball in the endzone. I will do a little bit of a breakdown hopefully later in the week.
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With a few passes either not thrown, thrown a little lower or caught, that changes dramatically. In those situations, the calls were good, but the execution didn't occur, which was compounded by lack of execution in the kicking game.

A comment I made to a friend during the game was that if Pettrey is going to be that inaccurate at short range that Tress might as well just go for it on fourth down. Replace the 1/3 performance with three shots at it, and you'd probably come away with at least one TD and no difference in field position.

One "upside" of Pettrey's problems is that we may not see as much "playing for the FG" on third and long in or near the red zone. If three isn't a lock, you'd better make sure that you're doing all you can to get six.

I'll be interested to see your breakdown, because it did look to me like the play calls were pretty good, though the results were obviously lacking.
 
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First Drive
IU 29 - 3rd-9 Pryor incomplete pass - FG

Second Drive
8 play TD drive
IU 36 - 3rd-10 Pryor Pass to Posey for 15 yds.

Third Drive
IU 37 - 3rd-7 Pryor run for 2 yds - Bailed out on 4th down on penalty by IU.
IU 18 - 3rd-8 Pryor Incomplete pass - Missed FG

Fourth Drive
3 play TD drive

Fifth Drive

IU 49 3rd - 3 - Pryor 18yd run
IU 14 - 3rd-8 Pryor 2 yd run
Missed FG

Sixth Drive

4 play TD Drive

seventh drive

IU 36 - 3rd -3 - Pryor Incomplete pass
punt

Eigth Drive

3rd - 20 - Pryor run for 8 yds
Punt

Ninth Drive

IU 44 - 3rd - 4 - Pryor Incomplete pass
Punt

Tenth Drive

Drive started IU 44 - 20 penalty yards all run plays TD.

Eleventh Drive

IU 4 - 2nd - 4 Pryor sacked and fumble ball back to the 25
IU 25 - 3rd - 25 Pryor INT

twelth Drive

Bauserman Fumble


Now lets look at the amazing stat and where we continue to struggle and what I am saying is holding us back from us being an elite team. We had 13 drives. I won't count the one where we took a knee at tend of the first half, or the one where Bauserman fumbled.

So 11 meaningful drives.

We were in IU territory on 10 of those drives...10/11 = 91%

We scored 4 TD's...Kicked 1 FG...Missed 2 FG's...Punted 2 times...Int 1 time.

We obviously weren't having trouble moving the ball. We were averaging 5.1 yds/play. We killed ourselves on 3rd down again, only converting 25% of the time.

Obvoiusly when we play a good team we will not have the ball in their territory 91% of our drives. We have to capatilize on them. And the more times we score TD's the more points we would score.

This is going off play by plays, and I don't have the game recorded, so I am not seeing the play sequence or the plays were we didn't convert.

But just looking at the numbers we are not getting the job done. Now I am not saying this, because I want us to score on all 10 of those possessions TD's, and put 70 pts on the board, but I just don't feel we are crisp at all. We have moved the ball with ease the last two games, played the whole game on the opponents side of the field, and only have 63 pts to show for it.

I am seeing improvements in Pryor, the playcalling, the spreading of the ball around, but we had the same problem when we were in the I, not being able to score TDs when we get to the otherside of the field. We saw it against USC, when we couldn't punch it in, we are seeing it against Illinois and Indiana.

Now don't get me wrong we are scoring some TD's. But if teams like IU and Illinois are stopping us 60% of the time from TD's when we are on their side of the field, then teams with better defense are going to stop us at a higher clip than that. We are getting there whether it be because our defense is getting us great field position or we are moving the ball 30-40 from in our end, but when we get there, we gotta finish.
 
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I have it recorded but haven't done my normal replay yet. But the main thing I am seeing is the length of our 3rd downs. Of the drives that we didn't score TD's, We were at 3rd and long on 5/7 of those drives. Everyone looks at 3rd down because it's where the conversion is finalized, but the issue is what leads to a 3rd and long. The other 2 were a 3rd & 4 and 3rd & 3, still not the easiest to convert with a learning offense. When I re-watch the game, I'll look into why we ended with 3rd and unmanageable. That will determine the issues you look to avoid. If I recall, 2 of those 5 were bad throws by Pryor that caused non conversion.

The thing that is great though is that I do not believe that OSU's offense needs to be ELITE. They need to be fairly efficient. Red zone offense, on the other hand, always could be better.
 
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I went back thru and did my best per BTN's broadcast. They missed some plays and made it hard to see everything that happened. I only will document drives that correspond with the discussion, missed opportunities.


1st drive- 1st-Brewster missed block
2nd- Brewster moved to double too early
3rd- dropped pass
= FG

3rd drive- 1st- BTN missed play(short run I believe)
2nd- Pryor overthrow on wide open WR(flag or out)
3rd- QB draw 2 yard gain
4th- PEN IU (1st down)

1st-False Start(-5)
1st- coverage sack(-4)
2nd- Pass to Small(+11)
3rd- (8 instead of 3) Pryor missed fade route out of bounds
4th- Missed FG

5th drive- 1st- 5 yard gain off missed snap
2nd- busted play(-3)(I think was set up incorrect for read option, MLB blitzed and was untouched)
3rd- QB draw, good open field tackle on Pryor
4th-missed FG

7th drive- 1st- Saine danced in hole then spun for 1 yard gain
2nd- Pryor to Posey slant(+ 5-6)
3rd- Pryor audibled to slant again threw way too fast and in the dirt
4th- punt

8th drive- 1st-Posey dropped pass
2nd-Overload blitz(-10) sack
3rd-20 to go-WR's covered Pryor run (+8)
4th-punt

9th drive- 1st- 2 yrd stretch play
2nd- 4 yard read
3rd- Blitz Pryor threw high(drag)
4th- Punt

11th drive- 1st- Pryor bad throw jams Thomas(read should have been to deep corner of end zone)
2nd- Overload Blitz 2-3 guys hit Pryor..fumbles J.B. who got beat is first to ball
3rd & 25(goal)- Pryor throws late to open reciever... gives safety time to cover ground and intercept pass


The main thing I recognize on offense after re-watching the game is that when a team can get pressure at all on Pryor... his throws are off. He hasn't sured up the art of the flag and fade routes yet. He is reading the defensive coverages correctly most of the time (reflected in calling slant audibles correctly) but his decision making just needs to speed up. The game hasn't fully slowed down for him yet. Also the line does great against a normal 3-5 man front, but when 6-7 come or they overload a side, the line has trouble making a decision. I did see them pick it up once or twice though on passing plays but a back helped and Pryor stepped up in the pocket to throw. Most the issues are young player mistakes that take time to heal. Game speed will come and allowing Pryor to run after 1-2 reads (which it seems they have switched to, instead of under center 3 reads and throw away) will allow him time to make a read then make a play. OSU has the talent at WR to follow him and find an opening. The numbers may look bad, but young mistakes were the main culprit on Saturday(and they still put up 31 offensive points).


They may not be elite, but by the end of the year the potential is there to be elite. If Pryor calms down with pressure, the offense will be sick.
 
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NateG;1558463; said:
I have it recorded but haven't done my normal replay yet. But the main thing I am seeing is the length of our 3rd downs. Of the drives that we didn't score TD's, We were at 3rd and long on 5/7 of those drives. Everyone looks at 3rd down because it's where the conversion is finalized, but the issue is what leads to a 3rd and long. The other 2 were a 3rd & 4 and 3rd & 3, still not the easiest to convert with a learning offense. When I re-watch the game, I'll look into why we ended with 3rd and unmanageable. That will determine the issues you look to avoid. If I recall, 2 of those 5 were bad throws by Pryor that caused non conversion.

The thing that is great though is that I do not believe that OSU's offense needs to be ELITE. They need to be fairly efficient. Red zone offense, on the other hand, always could be better.
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Good writeup...I agree with you that some of the 3rd downs were long, but still doesn't explain to me why we are not consistent. We still lack a rhythm on offense. We can go 10, 5, 7, 10, 5, 6, then -4, 2, 0.

Obviously we will have bad plays were we don't get positive yards, but a team like Indiana should not be able to stop us as easily as they did at times.

And to your point that we don't need to have an elite offense...Well I disagree with that for this reason:

We are moving up in the rankings, because teams are losing ahead of us, not because voters think we are a better team. With our defense, and field position they give us, the time they give us with the ball on offense, we should be able to score easier.

Heard Jim Lachey make a point on Radio tonight that the number of points we are leaving on the field. I kinda think about it in terms of baseball or basketball terms. Guy on 3rd with less than 2 outs. or free throws.

It all looks great if you are only giving up 1-2 runs and you are winning 4-1, 5-3. But you face a good team you are gonna need those extra runs or they will score and beat you.

How about free throws...The Memphis teams always come to mind. They win all those games, because they are a good team, but to be elite they can't shoot at 60% from the line.
 
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