Tenn +16.5 at LSU (ov/un 42.5) 3:30 ET CBS

[Gatorubet]

 

[Gatorubet]

 

[Saw31]

 

[BB73]

Once the offense substitutes players, isn't it the job of the official to stand over the ball until the defense has a legitimate chance to substitute players? To me, that was the big injustice. LSU should not have been allowed to snap the ball that quickly after making substitutions.

I was wondering about this until I saw the replay. Tennessee had 4 guys run onto the field and only 2 guys left. Having enough time to get off the field wasn't really their issue.

Regarding the helmet removal - it was after the clock was at zero, but UT wasn't down with possession until after he tossed it - but it may have been after the whistle. But Tennessee also had players and coaches already well over the sideline. I had no problem with the refs ignoring all of that when the clock was at zero and everybody thought the game was over - even though the refs had flagged the 13 men during the play.

Calling all of those penalties would have resulted in an untimed down from the 2-yard line instead of the 1-yard line (offsetting vs. half-the-distance). LSU may have called a different play from the 2, so we don't know what would have happened.

But what a lucky moron Les is. Without subbing, he had time for two pass plays - they were almost lined up at 17 seconds, and could have easily snapped it before 10. There's no way he should have been subbing then - it only allowed time for the third down play.

 

[Bleed S & G]

Maybe Miles is Mind Blind...?

Needs to breathe through his eyelids

 

[Gatorubet]

I was wondering about this until I saw the replay. Tennessee had 4 guys run onto the field and only 2 guys left. Having enough time to get off the field wasn't really their issue.

Regarding the helmet removal - it was after the clock was at zero, but UT wasn't down with possession until after he tossed it - but it may have been after the whistle. But Tennessee also had players and coaches already well over the sideline. I had no problem with the refs ignoring all of that when the clock was at zero and everybody thought the game was over - even though the refs had flagged the 13 men during the play.

Calling all of those penalties would have resulted in an untimed down from the 2-yard line instead of the 1-yard line (offsetting vs. half-the-distance). LSU may have called a different play from the 2, so we don't know what would have happened.

But what a lucky moron Les is. Without subbing, he had time for two pass plays - they were almost lined up at 17 seconds, and could have easily snapped it before 10. There's no way he should have been subbing then - it only allowed time for the third down play.

Bill, I'm not sure, but I think that with offsetting penalties the game is over and no repeat down, as opposed to defensive penalty on last play with no time remaining. So a call on both sides may have resulted in a Vol win.

Not sure, but I think I remember that offsetting penalties with no time remaining is "ball game over".

 

[Nutriaitch]

Bill, I'm not sure, but I think that with offsetting penalties the game is over and no repeat down, as opposed to defensive penalty on last play with no time remaining. So a call on both sides may have resulted in a Vol win.

Not sure, but I think I remember that offsetting penalties with no time remaining is "ball game over".

in the NFL, offsetting results in an untimed down.
not sure what the college rule is though

 

[BB73]

Bill, I'm not sure, but I think that with offsetting penalties the game is over and no repeat down, as opposed to defensive penalty on last play with no time remaining. So a call on both sides may have resulted in a Vol win.

Not sure, but I think I remember that offsetting penalties with no time remaining is "ball game over".

Well, the rulebook seems to support what I posted.

NCAA.football.rules.pdf.page.70

Extension of Periods

Article 3.A. A period shall be extended for an untimed down (other than a try) if during a down in which time expires one or more of the following occurs:

1. A penalty is accepted for a live-ball foul not treated as a dead-ball foul. (Exception: Rule 10-2-5-a). The period is not extended if the statement of the penalty includes loss of down (A.R. 3-2-3-IX).

2. There are offsetting fouls.

3. An official sounds his whistle inadvertently or otherwise incorrectly signals the ball dead.

b. Additional untimed downs (other than a try) will be played until a down is free of the circumstances in statements 1, 2, and 3 above.

Note: Rule 10-2-5-a relates to a change of possession, and isn't involved here.

But if at least one of the 3 items occurs on the last play of a period, an untimed down is given, and repeated until none of the 3 occurs on an untimed play.

 

[Gatorubet]

Well, the rulebook seems to support what I posted.

NCAA.football.rules.pdf.page.70



Note: Rule 10-2-5-a relates to a change of possession, and isn't involved here.

But if at least one of the 3 items occurs on the last play of a period, an untimed down is given, and repeated until none of the 3 occurs on an untimed play.

Yep. You are right. As long as the foul is not a dead ball foul (or a live ball foul treated as a dead ball foul) they offset. The 14 guys on the field is a live ball foul. Had the Vol foul been a personal foul after the fumble was recovered by the Vols (instead of the too many men foul) - and LSU had also committed a live ball foul during the play, it would be game over, no offset, no replay.

 

[buckeyesin07]

Wrong.

The play was over when he took his helmet off.

Watch the replay.

Wrong--the play didn't end until the ball was recovered and the player was down. When #53 for LSU took his helmet off, #56 for Tennessee had picked up the ball but he had not yet fallen down. If you pause the video at just the right moment (at 0:40), you'll see this. At exactly 40 seconds into the video, #53 for LSU is standing at the 15 and a half yard line with his helmet completely removed while, at the same moment, #56 for Tennessee is bending over picking up the ball at the 18 yard line, without having yet taken a knee.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HOwp1w_Aoc"]YouTube - Tennessee at LSU - Final 30 Seconds - Crazy Ending[/ame]

 

[cincibuck]

for the 1st time in my adult life, i have nothing to say about our game.

worst win i have ever seen in any sport on any level.

You didn't watch the hail Mary play against Kentucky a couple of years back? That was a force five cluster fuck too.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c1ANN6EVyU&feature=related"]YouTube - The Bluegrass Miracle[/ame]

 

[Gatorubet]

http://espn.go.com/blog/sec/post/_/id/14974/spurrier-you-can-win-and-still-be-a-dummy

"I read something interesting in the paper the other day about the Ryder Cup golf matches. One writer said, "Whoever wins the Ryder Cup, that captain will be considered somewhere between John Wooden and Vince Lombardi.'' And he said, "The loser will be considered like an SEC football coach after a loss. He'll be the dummy. And that's just the way it is. And we all know that. As coaches, we all know that."

But in vintage Spurrier fashion, he didn't stop there.

"Of course, sometimes you can win and still be a dummy," Spurrier cracked. "We've learned that recently, too."

Now, he didn't mention any names, but the smirk on his face was priceless.

I miss TOBC.

 

[Nutriaitch]

You didn't watch the hail Mary play against Kentucky a couple of years back? That was a force five cluster fuck too.

YouTube - The Bluegrass Miracle

an expected one though.
as soon as KY kicked that FG, you knew LSU was going to run a play, then chuck up the hail mary.

hail marys never work, so it was a shocking ending, but at least you could predict exactly what would happen.

this? not so much.
pissing away your last time out AFTER a delay of game penalty?
taking out the QB who put you in position to win?
running the option that has sucked for 2.5 yrs now?
no "clock it" play?
mass subs with clock ticking?
QB never calling for the snap?
center taking it upon himself to snap it so we at least get a play off?

game over, we lose.

oh wait never mind, we was just fucking with ya.
Dooley just out-dumbed Miles.
game ain't over, try again.

now we win.

Whiskey
Tango
Foxtrot?


as bad as Les is at clock management, i STILL can't believe what i just saw.
as bad as Dooley is at counting (he ran a couple plays with only 10 guys against UAB last week, i STILL can't believe what just happened.


The Death Valley Do-Over will live in infamy.

 

[Nutriaitch]

Dooley just out-dumbed Miles.

ok, I realize this ain't Les' first rodeo with bungling the clock.
but why ain't this getting m,ore air time?

ever heard the saying "never argue with an idiot. he'll bring you down to his level and beat you with experience"

that's what we just saw. didn't think it could happen, but it did.

on second thought, maybe that was part of Miles' plan.

somehow (other than the Ole Piss game last year), he wins these fucking games. no clue how or even why, but he does.

the most frustrating, baffling, entertaining, and down right nuttiest head coach i've ever seen in my life.
and some how he's won 78% of his games here.

my head hurts just thinking about it.

 

[808 Buck]

my head hurts just thinking about it.

So does Miles'.