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S Vonn Bell (All B1G, All-American, National Champion, Carolina Panthers)

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By all accounts, Bell was not ready (in contrast to now, at least comparatively). No arguments have been brought up to refute that, merely that it would be more excusable if he's getting torched out there. Of course, Bollman did that with Braxton and not only did he not benefit from the experience but he got notably worse. The guy regressed at throwing a spiral for crying out loud.


The secondary having little room to get worse is not a compelling argument to start him. It's a reason to wonder but also threatens the development of his future at the position. He's also not stepping into a competent back 7 and being asked to do his role. Many parts of that pass coverage have been struggling and will put him in even more negative situations.
 
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jwinslow said:
By all accounts, Bell was not ready (in contrast to now, at least comparatively). No arguments have been brought up to refute that, merely that it would be more excusable if he's getting torched out there. Of course, Bollman did that with Braxton and not only did he not benefit from the experience but he got notably worse. The guy regressed at throwing a spiral for crying out loud.


The secondary having little room to get worse is not a compelling argument to start him. It's a reason to wonder but also threatens the development of his future at the position. He's also not stepping into a competent back 7 and being asked to do his role. Many parts of that pass coverage have been struggling and will put him in even more negative situations.
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So, we need to refrain from putting better players on the field because not having them play in the most agreeable circumstances may hinder their development...
 
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MililaniBuckeye said:
So, we need to refrain from putting better players on the field because not having them play in the most agreeable circumstances may hinder their development...
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No, we need to stop assuming the coaches are idiots and/or liars when they say a player was not ready.

We need to stop assuming that players are magically better simply because the player on the field is not good.

We need to stop assuming that defensive coaches are choosing the worst option of the two, especially Co dcs who have very warm seats.

I get why we want to assume those things as fans. That doesn't make them convincing or logical arguments.


Maybe, just maybe Vonn Bell was not better during the season. It's not like he tore it up in the limited pt he received.

Reports have been gushing about Corey Smith in the bowl prep. Why is no one calling out Zach Smith for not playing him in season? Because we aren't motivated to look for any possible alternative at wide out no matter how weak the foundation is for it.
 
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Jwins, I get what you are saying, and have considered it. It is a sound and reasonable argument. However, as I noted, in 2011, Fickell had the final say as to who would QB the Bucks, and for several games, his judgment was Joe Bauserman over Braxton Miller - the same JB who is famous for throwing the ball 8 rows into the stands in Lincoln, NE to girls wearing ears of corn on their heads. I think there is a senior bias among coaches, and that bias leads them to stick with experience over talent for longer than they should on some occasions.

Look, I don't expect Vonn Bell to intercept 4 passes, have 10 PBU's, and 7 sacks. I do expect that he will do no worse, maybe a little better, than what we have seen - which would require that he be within 5 yards of an eligible receiver. :biggrin:
 
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Look, I don't expect Vonn Bell to intercept 4 passes, have 10 PBU's, and 7 sacks. I do expect that he will do no worse, maybe a little better, than what we have seen - which would require that he be within 5 yards of an eligible receiver. :biggrin:
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To be clear, the core of my argument has been answering "why wasn't he playing earlier?"

Now that he has 15 bowl practices under his belt he's good for at least 2 interceptions :biggrin:
 
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I get it Josh. Under-promise and Over-deliver. It's a good strategy. Seriously, I agree with your points but I don't know that I "trust" the coaches completely. They are fallible. Heck Urb said he wanted to play him more and Withers admitted he probably should have played him more minutes along the way. Withers is also no longer with us. Infer from that what you will. Personally I don't see the risk we would have had playing him along the way and your comparison to how it impacted Brax is apples to oranges IMO. A good QB can single handedly impact the game far more. When it's a mobile QB with elite legs like Brax and the player is stepping into the offensive fiasco that was Brax's freshman year is an extreme example to say the least. Yes, in that scenario it can cause a QB to regress. Saying that is a compelling example of why it was good that Vonn didn't play is a HUGE stretch to me. You can't always afford to wait on a player to develop during practice time. Especially considering the dumpster fire that our secondary was this year. If the coaches don't have the ability to coach them along during this period it's at least partly a knock on the coaching ability and again I only point to the fact that the safeties coach is no longer with us as a compelling point. Especially considering Withers track record. I appreciate his time here but I simply don't see his resume and current coaching switch being a ringing endorsement of his ability to coach the secondary.
 
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OSUK said:
Pitt Brown was a 4-5 star guy - so obviously, I do understand the precarious nature of recruiting rankings. Those stars indicate whether people think you have the ability to do it. At some point, you get on the field and you can do it or you can't. What I am saying is that I don't know what Bell can or can't do. I have a better idea of that with Pitt.
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To be fair, Pitt was in the mix since 2010 or so... he blew his ACL and hasn't been the same since. =/
 
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NastyNatiBuck said:
I thought Barnett was the one who blew out his knee, unless they both did.
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Yes, both had season ending knee injuries.
Pitt had a season ending injury to his knee very early in his career, which probably derailed him from the start.
But Bell, was still even more talented than him coming out of HS. Can't wait to see Bell step up in the orange bowl under the bright lights.
Bell and Powell as the starting S next year sounds great to me.
 
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