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Phoenix Suns (Official Thread)

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OCBucksFan;1085899; said:
Well, that really depends on how motivated he is. If he's actually willing to play, Shaq is a fucking beast, but if he's going to be Shaq and ride out that huge salary of his, you're going to put your fist through your television.

Also, get ready for hack-a-shaq, man, I will tell you, nothing in the world pissed me off more than that shit. Like every time there was 5 minutes to go in a game and we were up by 15+ it was foul foul foul, games lasted for-fucking-ever and he made like 30% of the fucking shots.
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Hey I lived in Miami the last 4 years before Boston. He plays well in the playoffs and with something to go after. He wants another ring, so he'll play hard. He's also surrounded by guys that have been together for a while, he should adapt well to a verteran squad. Too bad he probably won't play in "our" next game, which is the first after the All-Star break.
 
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I understand Marion wasn't feeling Phoenix anymore, but this still feels like a terrible trade for Phoenix regardless of what the general media thinks.

The end results of this season will clearly determine who got the better end of this deal. Shaq is a shell of his former self, but is still an upper-tier center in the NBA. He has difficulty getting up and down the court, can't make free-throws, and doesn't finish anywhere close to the way he used to. He still provides a presence inside, but gets into foul trouble almost every game because of his lack of mobility.

I just think, straight up, Shawn Marion is a better player. He's younger, and very versatile. Shaq is old, expensive, and out of shape. Can Shaq still ball? Absolutely, but how long will it take him to get into actual playing shape? Riley was critical at the beginning of the year, and as usual Shaq got injured on and off throughout the year. Even if he is mentally motivated, it is still going to take some time to get physically prepared for play-off basketball.

I for one, think Miami made a fantastic deal.
 
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billmac91 said:
I understand Marion wasn't feeling Phoenix anymore, but this still feels like a terrible trade for Phoenix regardless of what the general media thinks.

The end results of this season will clearly determine who got the better end of this deal. Shaq is a shell of his former self, but is still an upper-tier center in the NBA. He has difficulty getting up and down the court, can't make free-throws, and doesn't finish anywhere close to the way he used to. He still provides a presence inside, but gets into foul trouble almost every game because of his lack of mobility.

I just think, straight up, Shawn Marion is a better player. He's younger, and very versatile. Shaq is old, expensive, and out of shape. Can Shaq still ball? Absolutely, but how long will it take him to get into actual playing shape? Riley was critical at the beginning of the year, and as usual Shaq got injured on and off throughout the year. Even if he is mentally motivated, it is still going to take some time to get physically prepared for play-off basketball.

I for one, think Miami made a fantastic deal.
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Isn't Marion's contract something like 17.3 mil and it only has 1 year left? Miami is going to have to re-sign him after this season (which is a wasted season already). I don't follow much NBA and I know Shaq has his ups and downs, but Shaq is usually at his best in the early stages of entering a new scene. I like the trade a lot more for PHX. Miami heat are officially in disarray, imo.
 
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Short term this is either neutral (since Miami is playing for respectability at this point) or a slight advantage to the Suns especially if Shaq can give them anything.....

Long term this deal has to favor the Heat. Shaq's max deal is off of the books now and Marion can walk after the year. Miami is pretty much assured of having the 2nd most ping pong balls in the thing for the NBA lottery, so they might get a very good pick. Then they can get a young big guy to build around Wade with and go from there.
 
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DaytonBuck;1085952; said:
I think the move is more to clear cap space for the Heat since they can unload Shaq and let Marion walk after the season.
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I disagree....they have the remainder of the season to see how Wade/Marion work together. Riley has already said he thinks this could be the beginning stages of Jordan/Pippen. Obviously, a major over-statement, but Wade will be much more effective with a guy who can run, rather than a guy who can only walk fast.
 
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billmac91;1085958; said:
I disagree....they have the remainder of the season to see how Wade/Marion work together. Riley has already said he thinks this could be the beginning stages of Jordan/Pippen. Obviously, a major over-statement, but Wade will be much more effective with a guy who can run, rather than a guy who can only walk fast.
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:lol: @ Riley making a Jordan/Pippen comparison
 
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Don't quite get all the optimism about Shaq. It's a real big IF when it comes to him making a major contribution to the Suns. They guy is hurt often, too often. He has taken such a beating over his career, he just can not stay healthy for any long stretch, especially if you are expecting him to be playing 30+ minutes a game. He won't hold up. I am a huge Shaq fan, I just don't think he can be a full time contributer any more. Not to mention losing a player of Marion's skill. In my opinion, great deal for the Heat.
 
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Big Papa;1086001; said:
Don't quite get all the optimism about Shaq. It's a real big IF when it comes to him making a major contribution to the Suns. They guy is hurt often, too often. He has taken such a beating over his career, he just can not stay healthy for any long stretch, especially if you are expecting him to be playing 30+ minutes a game. He won't hold up. I am a huge Shaq fan, I just don't think he can be a full time contributer any more. Not to mention losing a player of Marion's skill. In my opinion, great deal for the Heat.
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Shaq is finished and I don't see how meshes with the run and gun game of Phoenix. The only logic I can see to this is maybe the Suns think they need a big man for the playoffs.
 
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DaytonBuck;1086009; said:
Shaq is finished and I don't see how meshes with the run and gun game of Phoenix. The only logic I can see to this is maybe the Suns think they need a big man for the playoffs.
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They definately think they need a big man for the playoffs. Only problem is, they have to adjust their style every time he is in the game. You can't play typical Suns style ball for more than 3 possesions without having to sub him out.

Yes, he will help defensively and give them an inside presence, but how many minutes do they plan on giving him?? Does he start, and do they go more half court?? If they let him start and don't change offensive philosophy, does he become a MAJOR liability defensively?? With as many offensive possesions Phoenix gives up b/c of their style, how will Shaq stay out of foul trouble?? He can't stay out of foul trouble playing 30 minutes a game for Miami, a slow tempo team.

It will be interesting to see how this works.
 
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Dispatch

NBA roundup: Suns get bigger, slower with O'Neal
Trade for 7-1 center sends Marion, Banks to Heat
Thursday, February 7, 2008 3:23 AM



ASSOCIATED PRESS

The Phoenix Suns acquired Shaquille O'Neal in a stunning, blockbuster deal that sends four-time All-Star Shawn Marion and Marcus Banks to the Miami Heat.
The improbable pairing of the speedy Suns and the slow but once-mighty O'Neal became official when he cleared a physical exam yesterday.
The trade, a dramatic move by first-year Phoenix general manager Steve Kerr, signals an unexpected change in philosophy for the Suns, adding a 7-foot-1, 325-pound center who has been plagued by injuries in recent years and turns 36 in March. O'Neal has been out because of a hip injury and underwent an exam on Tuesday in Miami. He flew to Phoenix yesterday for the physical.
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It's kind of amusing reading some of the previous posts here. And with all due respect... how much NBA do you guys watch?

Myth 1: Shaq can't physically run with the Suns, he'll have to be subbed out "every 3 plays"?
Hmmm, in 2 games this year against the Suns Shaq went:
25/10/3 and 18/11/1 averaging 33 mins.

So, obviously he was standing hunched over holding his knees the whole game.:shake:

Myth 2: He can't play in their "run and gun" offense:

The Suns style isn't quite a "run and gun" like Golden State's. They take a Euro approach. They like to take shots within 7 seconds. Kurt Thomas and his knees were fine in this offense. We have plenty of primary shooters. I think Shaq can make it down court with in 7 seconds. He's in there mostly for his defense, rebounding and space eating, not offense. I can see him getting a lot of trailer points, put backs and dunks.

Myth 3: Shaq is out of old, slow, out of shape and hurt

O'Neal is said to be in good shape for his age (35) with his weight at 312 pounds (down from his listed 325) and his body fat at 12 percent. His hip injury is said to be so bad...that he'll probably play next week.


Myth 4: Losing Marion is huge

Shawn Marion is a solid player. He puts up stats quietly. He's an ok 3 point shooter... but, only really a third/fourth option. He caused friction with this team by demanding a trade earlier, and doesn't get along with the center piece in Amare. The Suns will not give him the money he wants, and he'd be ghost anyway after this season. Grant Hill has played better than anyone thought...and he will be our 3. Hell, we almost dealt Marion for Kirelenko, that would have been useless.


In summary, this is a team that needs to win now...not 2 years from now. Shaq still has enough fuel in his tank, as much as Grant Hill or Steve Nash. He won't be depended on to be the star, he's there for a purpose. He doesn't have to play any more than 25 mins a game, because Diaw will rotate in plenty. The old Suns style was great, but didn't get them to the finals. This is purely to match up against the Bynums, Diops, Duncans, Mings etc etc etc. He is there to rebound and defend, and not let guys like Al Jefferson abuse our interior D.This will open up Stat who is not a center, he plays well 6-10 away from the basket. In close games in the playoffs he will have to be double teamed...opening up Stat and Hill big time. Sure they will adjust their play slightly, but not that much. It's a win win deal for everyone.
 
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I'm watching Shaq's presser right now and I'm very impressed. First thing he said is that he will act as Amare's big brother and he will help him become the leagues top power forward. Also, he commented that every fast break starts with a spark and he will be able to get the rebound and outlet to Steve and let them do their thing. He is also of the opinion that he will give our shooters some extra room to work. I agree. One other interesting comment was that in our society we like to assume that just becuase we've never seen anyone do something we think that means they can't. He says he can run. I'm not so sure about that, but he will make this team better.

As far as Marion is concerned, I appreciate what he's done in PHX but he has missed some key shots in the playoffs throughout the years and that's always bothered me. That's something that your top shooter can't do. What the Suns have always missed in the playoffs is someone to play down low in the half court game in the playoffs (this goes back to the early 90's). He is that missing piece IMO.
 
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billmac91;1086010; said:
They definately think they need a big man for the playoffs. Only problem is, they have to adjust their style every time he is in the game. You can't play typical Suns style ball for more than 3 possesions without having to sub him out.
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When you play the Spurs and Dallas and Utah they have a tendency of dictating the pace of the game. The Suns won't have to change a thing, but when they get into this type of game they will better equipped to win.
 
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