Nick Saban (ex-HC Alabama Crimson Tide)

[jlb1705]

Bama recruits have to cash their Burger King tax refunds somewhere

Isn't that what the dog tracks are for?

 

[Oh8ch]

Is this the first time a coach has renegotiated a contract while the other team missed only field goals?

 

[kujirakira]

I thought it was Saban's team that was missing field goals?

 

[cincibuck]

When Nick confessed to the WSJ this past summer that the Alabama job had "special pressure," this is what he was talking about. 60-6 over five seasons with three national titles is somehow inconceivably not good enough for a lot of Alabama fans. Bottom line, no matter what Saban does, he'll never be Bear Bryant. It's a culture not unlike the Paterno-worship in Happy Valley.

Hypothetically, if Saban stayed and won three of the next five 'ships that'd give him 6 in 12 total seasons at Bama, exactly as many titles as Bear Bryant won and in less than half the time. Anyone think the Bama faithful would give up their houndstooth for a Saban spring practice straw hat?

Didn't think so. The mythology has somehow become bigger than the man ever was.

Oh, but Bryant was, "the Branch Rickey of the SEC." http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1616387-how-bear-bryant-became-the-branch-rickey-of-alabama

"When the Trojans came to Legion Field in Birmingham in 1970, they brought a backfield that featured three African-American players.

Getty Images/Getty Images
Right from the start, it was clear that the all-white Tide were no match for the integrated Trojans, as USC smashed Alabama 42-21 behind a 135-yard two-touchdown performance from black running back Sam Cunningham. This game stands out as the moment that led to the full integration of the Alabama football team and, thus, the SEC.

Somehow I remember Dr. Charles Gault in my philosophy of education class talking about this very phenomenon in 1967. This is also about the time that the other Southern sports icon, "The Baron, Adolph Rupp" got schooled by the miners of Texas Western in the 1966 NCAA finals.

 

[cincibuck]

Alabama could match what Texas offers, but that's not necessarily what is the driving force here.

Going to Texas and returning that program to NC caliber contention might be more attractive (and the money would be nice no doubt) than going through a rebuild in Alabama. Hell look at how that fanbase reacted to the loss to Auburn. That's a pressure cooker that will explode one day.

Not disagreeing with you, but what's to rebuild? He's lost exactly two games in the last two years, both to conference schools and one on the road. He's got, on paper at least, the best recruiting classes of the last 5 years. His best RB will be a junior. He'll have talent in Austin, but it won't be anywhere near the level that it is where he's at.

 

[kujirakira]

Not so sure the B12 and Texas would let him do whatever he wants, such as oversigning, either. To say nothing of what goes on behind closed doors; because if they're that dishonest in plain daylight I refuse to believe for a second that they aren't cooking the books where nobody is looking.

 

[Mike80]

Not disagreeing with you, but what's to rebuild? He's lost exactly two games in the last two years, both to conference schools and one on the road. He's got, on paper at least, the best recruiting classes of the last 5 years. His best RB will be a junior. He'll have talent in Austin, but it won't be anywhere near the level that it is where he's at.

He's graduating his senior QB for one. That matters, especially when the only backup to throw passes this year is a junior who threw exactly 29 of them this year and 39 total for his career. That kind of distribution of passing means this team was built to win this year and next year would have to take care of itself from the QB position.

They are also graduating a few key players from their defense. When they lost Sunseri, they were definitely not the same in the defensive backfield. They lose Perry, might lose Sunseri (I think he was going to declare before his injury, he still might anyway), and they lose at least one WR from an underwhelming group.

McCarron made this team go, much like Ken Dorsey kept the team in Cryami going. Are they still more talented than everyone else? Sure. But that doesn't necessarily equate to wins all the time. 3 titles in 4 years for Bama was a pretty unprecedented run in the post-schollie limit NCAA, but look at all of the "great" runs recently, they all take a step back (Boise, U$C, Oklahoma, Texas) after the QB graduates and this is happening this year. Even Ohio State had this 3 times in the past 10 years, with Krenzel, Troy Smith and TP and likely will again when Braxton finally leaves at least for a season.

Also, that coaching staff will be raided this year and that will directly affect player development.

In the end, I think the downward trend is starting. They'll still go 10-2 or 11-1, the SEC isn't that great and everyone else is losing a lot around them except for maybe Auburn. It'll be fun to see

 

[NFBuck]

Looking at things on paper, I could see a 2010-type dip for bammer next year. So, a 10-3 season looks like a real possibility. However, the $EC looks like it could stay down across the board. UF is still gonna be a mess coached by Will Muschamp. UGA has to replace a 4-year starter at QB and has defensive issues. SoCar will be replacing their QB and loses Clowney, who despite his underwhelming season still made offenses have to gameplan around him. Aggy is losing Johhny Paycheck, probably their best WR, and was underwhelming this year any way with a disaster of a defense. LSU loses their QB and possibly their best RB and WRs to the NFL. It looks like Auburn and Moosoora might be the best teams in that conference next year.

 

[Buckeye513]

$7-7.5M according to Tuscaloosa News. Belichick money. More than the last three Super Bowl winners.

 

[Mike80]

Not so sure the B12 and Texas would let him do whatever he wants, such as oversigning, either. To say nothing of what goes on behind closed doors; because if they're that dishonest in plain daylight I refuse to believe for a second that they aren't cooking the books where nobody is looking.

He wouldn't have too. Look at how that fanbase was trolled by Saban and Chip Davis to make them believe their "savior" was coming. It would have eventually fallen apart, but the boosters would have been all over that situation. Desperation makes for a very volatile situation, one that could blow up in their faces. When he went to Bama, that program was still trying to recover from the Fulmer sanctions and he was leaving the NFL after basically failing.

I see Bama much in the same way I see scUM and Ntre Ame although maybe not quite as extreme - their local areas don't produce enough talent at the level to sustain their program at this level so they need to recruit nationally. Saban is an expert at that as he did it at LSU as well.

The region he's in is overall stronger than what scUM and Ntre Ame have to deal with, but Texas is another story entirely. You get the recruits you want in Texas, but look at the rosters between Texas and Bama. Sure the state of Alabama is well represented, but how many of those guys are true contributors? Look at all the Georgia, Florida, Texas, Ohio guys on there as well. Bama has to recruit nationally. Texas is like Ohio, Georgia and Florida and doesn't always have too if the players are available in state.

 

[kujirakira]

However, at the end of the day -- whether you're recruiting locally or nationally -- recruiting is a crap shoot.
Oversigning, year-to-year scholarships, faking medical scholarships, etc. are a massive advantage. You can drop the kids that don't meet expectations and replace them every year.

 

[Mike80]

However, at the end of the day -- whether you're recruiting locally or nationally -- recruiting is a crap shoot.
Oversigning, year-to-year scholarships, faking medical scholarships, etc. are a massive advantage. You can drop the kids that don't meet expectations and replace them every year.

It's about coaching at the end of the day. Always has been, always will be. you can sign 25 over the limit every year, but if the coaches suck, none of those players will develop properly. You don't usually win with 1st year players who have no experience either.

follow the money.

 

[kujirakira]

I never said they would contribute as Freshmen. Obviously you can't just recruit -- but to say it's "all coaching" is as asinine as saying it's "all recruiting"
Kicking 10 kids off the scholarship books every year is a huge advantage.
One that he will be afforded in the SEC -- the ACC is probably the only other conference that would let him get away with it. He knows that.

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

He wouldn't have too. Look at how that fanbase was trolled by Saban and Chip Davis to make them believe their "savior" was coming. It would have eventually fallen apart, but the boosters would have been all over that situation. Desperation makes for a very volatile situation, one that could blow up in their faces. When he went to Bama, that program was still trying to recover from the Fulmer sanctions and he was leaving the NFL after basically failing.

Oh the shag sees it entirely different. He had his bags packed for the bestest job in the entire wide, wide world of sports, and it was only derailed by Mack staying. He was coming. Just ask any of them. You don't think anything as dramatic as being on fire would tamper their arrogance.

 

[Mike80]

Oh the shag sees it entirely different. He had his bags packed for the bestest job in the entire wide, wide world of sports, and it was only derailed by Mack staying. He was coming. Just ask any of them. You don't think anything as dramatic as being on fire would tamper their arrogance.

I thought (hoped) the shag had more balance than Orangebloods did. Oh well...