Marion Jones Admits to Taking Steroids

[shetuck]

Do you honestly think that lyle alzado had no existing problems prior to steroid use.Alzado died of brain lymphoma..Anyone want to make a connection between the two since doctors couldn't? Has anyone ever heard of someone saying "this is what is killing me even though there is no proof that it did and it actually be believed other then this case? Alzado wasn't a doctor. It was his assumption that the steroids caused the cancer.When in reality there was no medical evidence that it was the cause.


Bring out the covers of sly and arnold.People that have had steroids help catapult their careers. The general public is ignorant about any type of steroid use period.Steroids are the only subject I have ever discussed with people that have 1.No real experience 2. Have little to no actual knowledge about the substances (most people can't even name the street names for things,because all they know is what the media tells them) 3. Although all the negativity they do believe.People also tend to believe steroids will give you super human ability,and pretty much anyone can take them to achieve this ability.


People can sit and ridicule the media for what they know is wrong about war,crime and sports,because they have a developed opinion from factual experience. When there is no one that says.."i've been using steroids 20+ years and have blood work done to ensure my health,and i'm doing fine" It's almost like people can't believe that has happened..When in reality it has..The horror stories are there..but there aren't all horror stories either..There's always more then one side of the story.Don't be naive enough to think that this one is any different..

sorry powerlifter... wasn't meaning to push anybody's buttons or make them defensive. let me just clarify a couple of things:

1. i don't know the first thing about steroids. and i have had no particular personal interest or compelling motivation to learn about them (probably an additionally ignorant view)

2. i'm not a chemist, pharmacist, molecular biologist, microbiologist, or any kind of athlete so i have no first hand knowledge or experience about their efficacy (or lack thereof)

if you put those two statements of fact together, what you get is that i have no bias one way or the other. lyle alzado, marion jones, powerlifter, max weber, kermit the frog, mother theresa, saddam hussein or whoever else have the individual right and perogative to do as they please to their bodies. lord knows i'm not very picky about my intake...

the point of posting the SI cover was in reponse to steve's post about the fact SOME people (like Lyle Alzado) have CLAIMED there can be long-term irreversible damage.

do i buy Alzado's story? i don't know and i really don't care at this point. what i do know is that he's saying he f*cked up and i'm willing to listen to his perspective without judging him or SI or the ignorant masses (among which i include myself).

you may say that the other side of the coin is that he's probably angry at the world and wants to make SOMEBODY/ANYBODY a scapegoat. that may be true. it wouldnt't been the first, nor will be the last time that somebody whose life has crashed in around them, out of bad luck or bad decisions or both, and has become disallusioned and even violently disgruntled and decides to play up to the public's appetite for dirty laundry and captalize on the econonomic and psychological value of playing the martyr. Alzado has to settle that up with himself wherever he might be right now. that's why what steve said resonated with me and reminded of Alzado and his pitiful and sad condition in his last few years.

to me, what's important is that some very successful athletes have come out publicly and said that their performance success wasn't all because of raw talent and hard work, etc., and now they're having second thoughts about the long-term value of those short-term enhancements.

you say that there's no one that says, "i've been using steroids 20+ years and have blood work done to ensure my health,and i'm doing fine". why is that? would YOU be willing to say that publicly?

 

[powerlifter]

sorry powerlifter... wasn't meaning to push anybody's buttons or make them defensive. let me just clarify a couple of things:

1. i don't know the first thing about steroids. and i have had no particular personal interest or compelling motivation to learn about them (probably an additionally ignorant view)

2. i'm not a chemist, pharmacist, molecular biologist, microbiologist, or any kind of athlete so i have no first hand knowledge or experience about their efficacy (or lack thereof)

if you put those two statements of fact together, what you get is that i have no bias one way or the other. lyle alzado, marion jones, powerlifter, max weber, kermit the frog, mother theresa, saddam hussein or whoever else have the individual right and perogative to do as they please to their bodies. lord knows i'm not very picky about my intake...

the point of posting the SI cover was in reponse to steve's post about the fact SOME people (like Lyle Alzado) have CLAIMED there can be long-term irreversible damage.

do i buy Alzado's story? i don't know and i really don't care at this point. what i do know is that he's saying he f*cked up and i'm willing to listen to his perspective without judging him or SI or the ignorant masses (among which i include myself).

you may say that the other side of the coin is that he's probably angry at the world and wants to make SOMEBODY/ANYBODY a scapegoat. that may be true. it wouldnt't been the first, nor will be the last time that somebody whose life has crashed in around them, out of bad luck or bad decisions or both, and has become disallusioned and even violently disgruntled and decides to play up to the public's appetite for dirty laundry and captalize on the econonomic and psychological value of playing the martyr. Alzado has to settle that up with himself wherever he might be right now. that's why what steve said resonated with me and reminded of Alzado and his pitiful and sad condition in his last few years.

to me, what's important is that some very successful athletes have come out publicly and said that their performance success wasn't all because of raw talent and hard work, etc., and now they're having second thoughts about the long-term value of those short-term enhancements.

you say that there's no one that says, "i've been using steroids 20+ years and have blood work done to ensure my health,and i'm doing fine". why is that? would YOU be willing to say that publicly?

That's a good post,and I understand what you mean exactly. My point was leaning towards a lot of what you said. The last part about the long term steroid use even proves my point more...People aren't going to do that,because there is no reason to. Could you imagine what the media would do to arnold if he wrote a book and condoned the use of steroids? He is living proof that everything isn't black. There are definitely the ones that have very negative things happen to them but those are the ones that will come out in the media. Do you honestly think any of those "former wrestlers" that were interviewed after the Chris Benoit story unfolded still are big in the sport? No..They were guys who Vince let go of years ago,and it was evident that most of the guys/girls have some sort of vendetta against him. Most of them were part of some underground low budget wrestling association. They sold their souls,and now they regret it...Big deal..I'm sure they weren't complaining when the money was good for the very same reason they are against now.

I'm not a steroid advocate,but it's like anything else..It sits there in a vial it doesn't do anything. You make the choice to do it or not. A gun never shot anyone without a finger..Just don't blame the gun for killing if you are the one pulling the trigger...

 

[OH10]

The point you make is totally understandable. Realize that saying that every one of these side effects occur to an individual(or any of them) isn't always true either. How many people do you know that have personally taken steroids?The money people made off using those substances,and the ability to perform at a level above is worth it to them. For every liver transplant from one steroid abuser people up there are plenty of athletes who have used them successfully for years. People look up to people like Arnold [SIZE=-1]Schwarzenegger for where they are at in life now..When in reality his steroid use early in his life has made him what he is today. There's no way we would even know who he is without his bodybuilding past (acting as well)...Do people honestly think he never used steroids as well? Steroids in long term use are obviously not good for you. There is no arguement there. I just think it's ironic that people are surprised when their favorites athletes admit to use. It's around everywhere just because someone wins doesn't mean they are using anything,but it also means that someone else who lost wasn't...There are different levels of talent.[/SIZE]

Total fucking bullshit.

If you're an athlete and you use steroids to get ahead of the man next to you, then the man next may start using steroids. And the man next to him will use, and it just perpetuates itself.

But what about the man with integrity that decided that the medical side effects just ain't worth it? Yeah, well the cheating athletes keep saying "Fuck that man." No, fuck the cheaters. Fuck them all.

 

[powerlifter]

Total fucking bullshit.

If you're an athlete and you use steroids to get ahead of the man next to you, then the man next may start using steroids. And the man next to him will use, and it just perpetuates itself.

But what about the man with integrity that decided that the medical side effects just ain't worth it? Yeah, well the cheating athletes keep saying "Fuck that man." No, fuck the cheaters. Fuck them all.

10 years ago this statement made sense. If you are still 10 years behind,then it will still make sense...One day people will open their eyes to the use of steroids. It exists everywhere. Anywhere a competitive physical advantage is sought after.There is too much money in sports not to have an individual playing at an unbelievable level.

When you have a choice to do it to compete against others who are doing it,then it's just nature. There is no longer a doubt. Over the years more and more will come out and people will see that steroids don't turn your average guy into a monster.You are talking millions of dollars difference between an athlete who is clean and the same athlete not clean. The difference isn't integrity the difference is money...

 

[Steve19]

Powerlifter, there are a lot of young athletes that read these threads and your comments are completely misleading and irresponsible.

Contrary to what you allege, I just did a quick search of Medline using the search words "steroid" and "harmful effects". It turned up 112 articles.

Here are some contact for authors of a recent review article (that can be read by non-medical people and which refers to many of these studies above) by a interfaculty research team at Ohio State. I am providing a full reference and their contact details so that anyone who thinks there may be any validity to your comments may get an informed medical or psychiatic opinion.

Anabolic steroid use is not only wrong, it is not only cheating...it is dangerous.

"Consequences of Use of Anabolic Androgenic Steroids" in the journal Pediatric Clinics of North America 54(4) (August 2007) by

Marcel J. Casavant, MD[SIZE=-1]a[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]b[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]c[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]∗[/SIZE]
Kathleen Blake, MD[SIZE=-1]a[/SIZE]
Jill Griffith, PharmD[SIZE=-1]c[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]d[/SIZE]
Andrew Yates, MD[SIZE=-1]a[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]e[/SIZE]
LaRae M. Copley, RPh, MD, PhD[SIZE=-1]a[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]f[/SIZE]


a [SIZE=-2]Department of Pediatrics, The Ohio State University College of Medicine, 370 West 9th Ave., Columbus, OH 43210, USA[/SIZE]
b [SIZE=-2]Department of Emergency Medicine, The Ohio State University College of Medicine, 1654 Upham Drive Columbus, OH 43210, USA[/SIZE]
c [SIZE=-2]Central Ohio Poison Center at Children's Hospital, 700 Children's Drive, Columbus, OH 43205, USA[/SIZE]
d [SIZE=-2]The Ohio State University College of Pharmacy, 500 West 12th Ave., Columbus, OH 43210, USA[/SIZE]
e [SIZE=-2]Division of Cardiology, Children's Hospital, 700 Children's Drive, Columbus, OH 43205, USA[/SIZE]
f [SIZE=-2]Department of Psychiatry, The Ohio State University Hospitals, 140 Neurosciences Facility, 1670 Upham Drive, Columbus, OH 43210, USA[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-2]* Corresponding author. Central Ohio Poison Center at Children's Hospital, 700 Children's Drive, E-265, Columbus, OH 43205.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-2]E-mail address: [email protected][/SIZE]

An excerpt from the introduction to the article:

Whether providing anticipatory guidance to the young adolescent patient, conducting a preparticipation examination on a young athlete, or treating a sick user of anabolic androgenic steroids (AASs), the primary care physician must be familiar with the adverse consequences of the use of these compounds. This article reviews the endocrine, cardiovascular, neuropsychiatric, musculoskeletal, hematologic, hepatic, and miscellaneous effects of AASs, highlighting effects reported in children and adolescents and relying on consequences in adults when pediatric data are unavailable. We rely heavily on case reports and series; prospective studies are rare for technical and ethical reasons and are of questionable generalizability, given the number of AASs and the variety of dose ranges and patterns of use. The available data may underestimate the actual untoward effects because doses administered in clinical studies do not approximate the supraphysiologic doses used by illicit steroid users.

 

[OH10]

10 years ago this statement made sense. If you are still 10 years behind,then it will still make sense...One day people will open their eyes to the use of steroids. It exists everywhere. Anywhere a competitive physical advantage is sought after.There is too much money in sports not to have an individual playing at an unbelievable level.

When you have a choice to do it to compete against others who are doing it,then it's just nature. There is no longer a doubt. Over the years more and more will come out and people will see that steroids don't turn your average guy into a monster.You are talking millions of dollars difference between an athlete who is clean and the same athlete not clean. The difference isn't integrity the difference is money...

Is that you Victor Conte?

 

[powerlifter]

Powerlifter, there are a lot of young athletes that read these threads and your comments are completely misleading and irresponsible.

Contrary to what you allege, I just did a quick search of Medline using the search words "steroid" and "harmful effects". It turned up 112 articles.

Here are some contact for authors of a recent review article (that can be read by non-medical people and which refers to many of these studies above) by a interfaculty research team at Ohio State. I am providing a full reference and their contact details so that anyone who thinks there may be any validity to your comments may get an informed medical or psychiatic opinion.

Anabolic steroid use is not only wrong, it is not only cheating...it is dangerous.

"Consequences of Use of Anabolic Androgenic Steroids" in the journal Pediatric Clinics of North America 54(4) (August 2007) by

Marcel J. Casavant, MD[SIZE=-1]a[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]b[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]c[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]∗[/SIZE]
Kathleen Blake, MD[SIZE=-1]a[/SIZE]
Jill Griffith, PharmD[SIZE=-1]c[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]d[/SIZE]
Andrew Yates, MD[SIZE=-1]a[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]e[/SIZE]
LaRae M. Copley, RPh, MD, PhD[SIZE=-1]a[/SIZE],[SIZE=-1]f[/SIZE]


a [SIZE=-2]Department of Pediatrics, The Ohio State University College of Medicine, 370 West 9th Ave., Columbus, OH 43210, USA[/SIZE]
b [SIZE=-2]Department of Emergency Medicine, The Ohio State University College of Medicine, 1654 Upham Drive Columbus, OH 43210, USA[/SIZE]
c [SIZE=-2]Central Ohio Poison Center at Children's Hospital, 700 Children's Drive, Columbus, OH 43205, USA[/SIZE]
d [SIZE=-2]The Ohio State University College of Pharmacy, 500 West 12th Ave., Columbus, OH 43210, USA[/SIZE]
e [SIZE=-2]Division of Cardiology, Children's Hospital, 700 Children's Drive, Columbus, OH 43205, USA[/SIZE]
f [SIZE=-2]Department of Psychiatry, The Ohio State University Hospitals, 140 Neurosciences Facility, 1670 Upham Drive, Columbus, OH 43210, USA[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-2]* Corresponding author. Central Ohio Poison Center at Children's Hospital, 700 Children's Drive, E-265, Columbus, OH 43205.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-2]E-mail address: [email protected][/SIZE]

An excerpt from the introduction to the article:

Whether providing anticipatory guidance to the young adolescent patient, conducting a preparticipation examination on a young athlete, or treating a sick user of anabolic androgenic steroids (AASs), the primary care physician must be familiar with the adverse consequences of the use of these compounds. This article reviews the endocrine, cardiovascular, neuropsychiatric, musculoskeletal, hematologic, hepatic, and miscellaneous effects of AASs, highlighting effects reported in children and adolescents and relying on consequences in adults when pediatric data are unavailable. We rely heavily on case reports and series; prospective studies are rare for technical and ethical reasons and are of questionable generalizability, given the number of AASs and the variety of dose ranges and patterns of use. The available data may underestimate the actual untoward effects because doses administered in clinical studies do not approximate the supraphysiologic doses used by illicit steroid users.

What exactly did I state here again? I don't see where you point proves anything I "alleged" never said steroids were healthy did it? Just because someone posts and doesnt say kill everyone who takes steroids doesn't mean a whole lot.

There aren't people signing up to admit they have used steroids who have used them and been successful just because of the reputation "steroids" tends to bring onto someone. People bring up the same names of yesteryear,because that is all that is there to be publicized. However,you don't see people campaigning "i've taken steroids,and maintained a healthy lifestyle and living" because it's not good for that image not because it's never happened or doesn't..

"The available data may underestimate the actual untoward effects because doses administered in clinical studies do not approximate the supraphysiologic doses used by illicit steroid users." or overestimate considering believing that one drug will have the same effect on every patient is asinine.It's only with steroids that people believe that the exact same things will happen to every single user...

 

[Thump]

Powerlifter,

You take roids right?

 

[OH10]

What exactly did I state here again? I don't see where you point proves anything I "alleged" never said steroids were healthy did it? Just because someone posts and doesnt say kill everyone who takes steroids doesn't mean a whole lot.

There aren't people signing up to admit they have used steroids who have used them and been successful just because of the reputation "steroids" tends to bring onto someone. People bring up the same names of yesteryear,because that is all that is there to be publicized. However,you don't see people campaigning "i've taken steroids,and maintained a healthy lifestyle and living" because it's not good for that image not because it's never happened or doesn't..

"The available data may underestimate the actual untoward effects because doses administered in clinical studies do not approximate the supraphysiologic doses used by illicit steroid users." or overestimate considering believing that one drug will have the same effect on every patient is asinine.It's only with steroids that people believe that the exact same things will happen to every single user...

Ok, but you still haven't answered the question... What about the athlete that follows the rules and doesn't use steroids because he or she doesn't want to take the same health risk? Is that person just blind? Should they use to keep up with the Bondses and Joneses of the world?

All you apparently seem to be saying is that athletes should use steroids because it helps their performance, and that although there are health risks, they are grossly exaggerated. To that, I say "so what?" Some athletes don't want the risk. It's not because they aren't competitive. It's because they actually care about their bodies and aren't all that intrigued by the unknown, when the unknown could be shitty. That's why the NFL, Major League Baseball and the Olympics have BANNED steroids - because it's not fair to the clean athletes.

Until you can respond to that, your argument is nothing more than the ridiculous rants of an obvious steroid user attempting to validate himself.

 

[Thump]

your argument is nothing more than the ridiculous rants of an obvious steroid user attempting to validate himself.

 

[powerlifter]

People in professional sports use steroids more widely then the normal person would ever believe. I can tell that from your posts that you honestly don't believe that there is a high% of athletes using them right now. If right now everyone in sports was tested (within a detection time of an ester not weeks later to benefit the test and the team)the results would be astounding to the general public. Until the GP realizes that steroids are making the best better,and it's something that is only achieved through genetics and hard work,then there will be a better understanding.No one is going to stop it all together. It just is not going to happen,and there is no reason to actually believe that it will.

It's funny to me that people can sit there and have an argument not only about the side effects of steroids but what steroids can do to you (beneficially)..Like people can actually fathom what steroids do to your mind and body without ever taking them.You cannot period...

The modern day person honestly believes you can do a cycle or even some less informed, an injection and hit home runs...Run marathons..Do whatever you do better then anyone else. That is only the case because more less know people aren't brought into the spotlight about steroids,because honestly they just aren't producing as much. I would venture to even guess that although some people can run a search on google to find "steroid side effects" they can't run google and actually find experience using or people that have,and talk to them first hand. Not what is presented in media life.Although most of you disagree with me. All of you as OSU fans know what it's like to be on one side of the media.

"Until you can respond to that, your argument is nothing more than the ridiculous rants of an obvious steroid user attempting to validate himself."

The thing is the statement that I have made over and over is that people use abundant amounts of steroids in professional athletics. More so then what people will believe if it was told in the open. The amount of "clean" athletes is getting lower and lower and will continue to do so in order to compete against the ones using the substances. However,just because someone is using a substance doesn't assure them anything..Not just side effects,but performance as well. When something is driven as an athlete wants to win he/she will find a way,and something everything they do just isn't good enough. I never said anyone was/is right.Why do I need validation from anyone about anything. I never have admitted that I have used anything,and even if I did. Why would I seek validation from you? I wouldn't... I am just saying that people are a lot more naive to the real world simply because they aren't educated about it.Not because anyone is a moron...Just simply because they haven't actually experienced it,and only know through what they have read or been told by the media.

People who talk about the long term effects of steroids..Everything in the negative that steroids do deserve are fine by me. It's a precaution to anything to understand that someone can take over your body and honestly control your mind more so then any other drug you take. It can give you a physical addiction,that only is fixed by more. It can also give you a fearless mental edge,that you are totally confident that you will win,and you expect nothing less. Yet at the same time it can also destroy that confidence level,when the substances are no longer there in your system. That's something you won't read on the internet,and understand,because it's all a specific person relation with the drug.

The reason people abuse steroids is because they want to outperform their former self,and their competition. The thing is once you start taking them,and feel the psychiatric change with your mind you can get hooked. The only people I have ever met in my life to start taking steroids and stop are people who weren't dedicated to what they were doing. They wanted a quick fix and to look a little better. What most people fail to realize is that it still takes hard work along side of the use. The reason I say these are the only people that start and stop are because they are unsatisfied with the results. Almost like "steroids let them down"..When in reality it was their lack of effort and dedication that did so..You are born with an internal drive to do what you want or you aren't.The normal person laying on a couch eating potato chips is like that because they choose to be. Any physical activity is only as good or as bad as your mind lets it be. The dedication it takes as an athlete is not a lot different then the dedication it takes to be anything in life. Hard work,dedication,goals and things pay off eventually.

The people with the responses of "fuck the athlete" will not ever understand what it is like to be an athlete on the level they are playing at. Do you think a relief pitcher is going to go out on tv and say xxx xxx xxx and xxx all use steroids,that's why they are better then me. When in reality a lot of people actually will believe that's why. I AM NOT AN ADVOCATE FOR STEROID USE...I am simply staying that people are years behind as far as testing and keeping athletes clean of these substances.Far enough behind to develop just my own personal opinion of substances will always be there. People will always be on steroids and it won't ever be clear who is actually using them and who isn't. Any guy that makes a great run in his own respective sport will consider it,but he will always have speculators..Just because that's how much it is actually there.

 

[OH10]

People in professional sports use steroids more widely then the normal person would ever believe. I can tell that from your posts that you honestly don't believe that there is a high% of athletes using them right now. If right now everyone in sports was tested (within a detection time of an ester not weeks later to benefit the test and the team)the results would be astounding to the general public.

Actually, I believe steroids are all over. I, like many fans who pay hard-earned money to watch these athletes, don't care for steroids.

Until the GP realizes that steroids are making the best better,and it's something that is only achieved through genetics and hard work,then there will be a better understanding.No one is going to stop it all together. It just is not going to happen,and there is no reason to actually believe that it will.

Don't care if it makes the best better. Don't care if it can't be stopped. Don't believe accepting steroids as a part of society is a good thing. You do - and that's a problem.

It's funny to me that people can sit there and have an argument not only about the side effects of steroids but what steroids can do to you (beneficially)..Like people can actually fathom what steroids do to your mind and body without ever taking them.You cannot period...

So steroids make great athletes better? Boo fucking hoo. In the grand scheme of life, why should I give a shit about such a "nothing" benefit when there are identifiable risk? Why should I embrace steroids if all they do in sports is allow Barry Bonds to hit 73 home runs or Marion Jones to win 5 medals, but at the same time, tell our kids that steroids will help you win that high school league title you've dreamed about?

The modern day person honestly believes you can do a cycle or even some less informed, an injection and hit home runs...Run marathons...

Actually, most people know that steroids "alone" doesn't do a damn thing. We all just wish it was hard work and talent - without the steroids.

The amount of "clean" athletes is getting lower and lower and will continue to do so in order to compete against the ones using the substances.

Doesn't respond at all to the question. The fact that more athletes are using steroids is a BAD thing for the few clean athletes left. The honest athletes that don't break CLEAR RULES are suffering from a competitive disadvantage because the CHEATERS don't care about the health risks.

It can also give you a fearless mental edge,that you are totally confident that you will win,and you expect nothing less.

I assume this is something only a user, like yourself, might understand, right?

The thing is once you start taking them,and feel the psychiatric change with your mind you can get hooked. The only people I have ever met in my life to start taking steroids and stop are people who weren't dedicated to what they were doing.

Because if they were dedicated to the sport, they'd be dedicated to steroids, right?

The people with the responses of "fuck the athlete" will not ever understand what it is like to be an athlete on the level they are playing at.

You're right. But I do know what it's like to watch a high school athlete tear his family apart with his reliance on steroids just because he thought he could become the next Shawn Merriman.

 

[powerlifter]

Why haven't you answered my question yet?

Admitting to any type of drug use or not admitting to any type of drug use has no outcome on my posts. I am simply stating there are two sides to every wall. Just because you live on one side and believe that you are educated about the topic(although I am honestly curious to the average posters education about steroid use..Not something they have brought up on google and suddenly became experienced athletes)enough doesn't mean you totally understand it.

 

[bkochmc]

I'm going back to powerlifter's first response to me since I'm late in the conversation...

People fail to realize that this is how some people make a living. Doing some sport or something physical that revolves around how fast,how big you are. If your boss came in and said you're out a job unless you pick up the slack,then you have to rethink and redo everything you have ever done.

Strawman argument. Many athletes make a living playing their sport without steroids.

People COULD think twice and just realize that steroids are all over the sports industry.

I'm under the assumption that many people DO think that steroids are used in professional sports, specially certain sports (MLB, T&F, Cycling, NFL to an extent).

The people have DEDICATED their entire lives to being the best at something. It's funny to me when people make it out like they could actually do something even in the same world as people this dedicated. 90% or better of the people in this world have no idea what it's like to train for something 10+ years...Think about that..What kind of drive does that take? What kind of motivation/hard ships/injuries does one go through over this course of time?

Again, wrong. Think of how many people have DEDICATED their entire lives to their own specific profession, athletic or not. Some people cheat and weasel themselves to the top, some people take the straight and narrow path. Sports do not have a monopoly on motivation and hard ships.

Steroids will enhance a lot of things,but the top elite athletes at their respective sport have done nothing but practice to get where they are.

Funny, I thought this thread was about a woman at the top of her sport and she admitted to using steroids.

It's odd that steroids are so potent yet you don't see people manning up and getting off a couch to become the greatest (insert sport here) of all time. It just doesn't happen,and for the people that think they could load up and do something even similar that just doesn't happen either. The scapegoat of laziness people cast on steroids is what pisses me off personally. Sooner or later people will realize that it is widely used in all aspects of sports yet at the same time people want to see THE BEST...

I haven't seen anyone mention that laziness is why athletes take steroids... it's all about someone attempting to gain an advantage over other athletes. The elite athletes of most sports are so close in ability that there is a temptation to take steroids to give one that little extra speed burst, power burst, endurance enhancement, etc.

Live a day in the shoes of someone who makes their paycheck with their athleticism,and tell me it would never cross your mind to make a better living because you are better at something.There is no promotion that will happen if you give it all your hard work and time unless you progress physically. If you KNEW beyond a shadow of a doubt that something was going to catapult you into what you love and end up making a living at it...(financial security for you and your entire family) then a lot of people would analyze their thoughts differently.

The counter to this argument can be:

1) Replace the words athleticism and physically with intellect/intellectually. Same deal in the "common man" working world.
2) So if someone knowingly does an action that is illegal and/or against company/team rules they should do it anyways?

There are very few people on most forums that I have ever read that have actual experience in DETAIL(start to finish,pct included) about cycling and experienced the good and bad of steroids. Reading something on ESPN about steroids is no different then reading someone on ESPN about Ohio State. It's written there to read and for people to look at and make assumptions,but in reality they really don't know shit about anything,but are just trying to make a living like anyone else...

You're most likely right, most people on fan forums do not have any experience, either first hand or close proximity with steroids. To say someone "don't know shit about anything" because they haven't experienced it is asinine. I've never played organized football but I know quite a bit about it by reading about teams, analysis of people who have played/coached/have inside information, and watching the game. Does that make me an expert on football? No but I can normally talk intelligently about the subject.

 

[bkochmc]

Here's a different point for you to consider powerlifter...

Using the example you mentioned... say you spent 10+ years dedicating yourself to the sport of your chosing. The entire time you have never used performance-enhancing drugs (PEDs). You get to the championship round/game/meet, play your heart out but you lose. I'm sure you would be crushed. A week later you hear that your opponent took PEDs to beat you but there was no way to prove it (at least short term). What would you do? How would you react?