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- Thread starter osugrad21
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OH10
*
Quick retort to all of the Halladay vs. Lee stuff. First, I don't think Toronto asked for too much. If you're going to trade the best pitcher in baseball, you better get serious talent in return, especially when the talent is unproven. I don't blame Toronto one bit for not taking that deal.
Second, Shapiro had said he would need to be blown away to deal Lee and Martinez a year early. Those deals aren't "blown away" deals.
Third, if the small market teams are going to continue to get less than even value for their All Stars, then its time for the small market teams to reset the market and tell the Big Market teams they'll just have to wait until they hit free agency. You'll see the big markets make better offers in the future.
Big Markets already have the advantage in free agency. GMs like Shapiro are giving them the advantage on the trading block as well. All Philly and Boston did was send some talented (NOTE: not top talented) guys to their AAAA affiliate (Cleveland) and they'll get them back if they ever turn out to be All Stars. Nice cyle we've perpetuated. So I reiterate: fuck baseball.
Second, Shapiro had said he would need to be blown away to deal Lee and Martinez a year early. Those deals aren't "blown away" deals.
Third, if the small market teams are going to continue to get less than even value for their All Stars, then its time for the small market teams to reset the market and tell the Big Market teams they'll just have to wait until they hit free agency. You'll see the big markets make better offers in the future.
Big Markets already have the advantage in free agency. GMs like Shapiro are giving them the advantage on the trading block as well. All Philly and Boston did was send some talented (NOTE: not top talented) guys to their AAAA affiliate (Cleveland) and they'll get them back if they ever turn out to be All Stars. Nice cyle we've perpetuated. So I reiterate: fuck baseball.
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3074326
Proud lunatic fringe
OH10;1508360; said:
It was massive overpayment.. there's a reason he wasn't traded.. they wanted FOUR top prospects. There were only a few teams that even fit the mold. And if none of them were willing to do it, how is it not asking for too much? Nobody was willing to give that much. That is pretty much the definition of asking for too much.
I agree.
The idea is good, but the small market teams rely on these young players to come make the team a contender. Without these trades (and reliance on the draft), the same teams will still be winning/losing.
They weren't the team's BEST prospects, but the key components to the deals were probably top three/four prospects. Coming from Philly and Boston, that's pretty good.
That was not a balk, btw.
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Okay, so lets just summarize to save another 10-15 posts of the same content.OH10;1508360; said:
Side A: Hates the trades because they feel there was not sufficient return for proven players. Is frustrated with baseball's hierarchy and don't want to "feed the monster". Perhaps should give up following baseball period because it ain't gonna change.
Side B: Understands the necessity for trades like this for small market clubs to remain competitive, even if it means sacrificing a couple seasons to get to where they need to be. Doesn't like the way baseball is structured, but understands there is no changing it.
Bueno?
Incidentally, I think Reds fans would love to be in our position. That organization has needed a rebuild for years now, but refuses to make the moves necessary to do so. The Tribe laid the groundwork for it last year, decided to give it a go this year and failed. They recognized that they can't compete in their current incarnation (for myriad reasons) and started making moves for the future.
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3074326
Proud lunatic fringe
bigballin2987;1508379; said:
They aren't willing to throw around three or four of their best prospects in one trade. I don't think they've ever been willing to do that. Even teams that contend every year and can afford to buy their rings weren't willing to pay that price. That tells me Toronto was asking for massive overpayment..
When Toronto said they wanted to be blown away, they weren't kidding. The Indians were. Although the Indians got some good prospects..
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Jake
Once a Buckeye, always a Buckeye
‘17 The Deuce Champ
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'18 The Deuce Champ
3074326;1508363; said:
They said from the beginning that anyone who wanted Halladay this year was going to have to overpay to get him. Otherwise, they wouldn't trade him. They set their terms and stuck to them.
It's not like he's a FA this fall. He has another year on his contract. They'll have all offseason to make a deal and I expect one to happen. They had time to play with and they used it to aim high this summer. No one bit so they'll move to Plan B.
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3074326
Proud lunatic fringe
bigballin2987;1508388; said:
This is why the Jays will not compete for quite some time.
Jake;1508389; said:
I don't blame them for not trading him if they didn't get what they wanted. But when they fetch less in the future than they could've received for him now, I might have a laugh or two.
Honestly though, I don't give a fuck what the Jays do with Halladay. This is being discussed because people were using the Jays high demands as a basis for what they thought the Indians should've got for Cliff Lee. That's ignorant.
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Well, not an awful outing by Carmona. 5 Innings, 2 Runs on 4 hits. Still having control issues, 4 walks, 1 strikeout...that must be corrected.
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How does a manager manage to use SIX fucking pitchers before the 8th inning is over in a 4-3 game??? 
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itownbuckeye
Heisman
NFBuck;1508440; said:How does a manager manage to use SIX fucking pitchers before the 8th inning is over in a 4-3 game???
You can't say Wedge isn't a grinder.
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Crowe's having a nice game. 3-4, 3 runs, a triple...5-3 Tribe. Hopefully "Gascan" Wood can hold on, I hate the fucking Tigers.
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itownbuckeye
Heisman
Crowe with a good night, hopefully he continues his trend of doing much better the second time he sees a new level. Saw Jason Donald had three K's for Columbus tonight. Only one game of course and I hope he turns out well but the acquisition of he and Marson are the thing that aggravate me the most regarding the fire-sale trades. Just didn't understand either, neither have a spot in the projected 2010-2011 lineups so they should have gotten some higher upside lower level talent.
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worst 10 million dollars per year ever