Debt (economic, social, generational, etc.)

[stxbuck]

Of course not everyone is suited to be an educator, that wasn't my point. But, because we don't put a premium on paying our educators top dollar (and especially compared to shit we are willing to pay top dollar for (Entertainers)) people who would be suited for the positions decide, "Eh, I can make more money doing something else"

Well, if you are a materialistic kind of person, I don't know if teaching would be the best field. If teachers were paid by student performance, nobody would want to teach at Eastmoor or Glenville-and the type of bonus someone on Wall Street or pharmaceutical sales can earn would still outstrip any kind of financial incentive the school system could offer, even w/ jacked up taxes.
What do you feel would be a salary at which you feel more people would want to enter the teaching profession? There is competition for the jobs at the current salary structure.

 

[Taosman]

[SIZE=+4]

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[SIZE=+2]The Second Continental Congress voting independence.[/SIZE]
If I post a pic of the Continental Congress do I get get extra credit?

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

Well, if you are a materialistic kind of person, I don't know if teaching would be the best field. If teachers were paid by student performance, nobody would want to teach at Eastmoor or Glenville-and the type of bonus someone on Wall Street or pharmaceutical sales can earn would still outstrip any kind of financial incentive the school system could offer, even w/ jacked up taxes.
What do you feel would be a salary at which you feel more people would want to enter the teaching profession? There is competition for the jobs at the current salary structure.

Being that you've said you're actively involved in teaching already, I'm hard pressed to exhibit any particular expertise on the matter. Still, I think if one "Dreamed" of being a teacher in the same way as one "dreams" of being a professional athlete the system would improve, likewise, the quality of education overall I would think, goes up.

Seems to me, teachers at "affluent" schools are the cream of the crop, and the relatively shitty ones go to the shit schools where they make shit pay. Of course, worse teachers in worse systems leads to no progression. Here in Cbus, Upper Arlington kids are going to be ahead of the curve.. they get a very good HS education. But, if the pay scale was such that it was equally as beneficial to teach at some shittier school, then UA wouldn't be the pinnacle.... not sure how to say it differently.. what I mean is, over the whole scale of teaching, the pay should be increased so as to induce people to do the job. I hesitate because I don't want to sound like I'm saying people "Settle" on teaching.... because I think there are very good teachers out there, but I also think it can be improved.

 

[Gatorubet]

[SIZE=+4]

[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+2]The Second Continental Congress voting independence.[/SIZE]
If I post a pic of the Continental Congress do I get get extra credit?

Nope. No Pole Vault chick.

 

[Beenthere77]

Education has been brought up as a major problem yet our college system is the best in the world and attendance is at an all time high. So I doubt if educated people is this country's biggest problem.

Independence from foreign oil was brought up. How bad can our independence on this oil be if people haven't bothered to change their habits. The worse thing that can happen is the prices continue to go up and then people will have to give up their SUVs.

IMO, it's leadership that is our biggest problem. Look at our choices in just the last 3 elections: Clinton/Dole, Bush/Gore, and the last one, Bush/Kerry. Seriously, would you hire any of these guys to run a company that you were responsible for? I don't know about you all, but I'm tired of voting for the lesser of two evils.

We need someone who can step up and make the big picture decisions regardless of what is best for his party, someone that will leave the petty issues to others. We all know government spending is out of control and has us on the path to bankruptcy. But where is that leader that can bring everyone together to clean up this black hole. Someone that has the foresight to balance our capitalistic and social financial needs. If this is done right, imagine the resources it would free up for the advancement of our economy. Plus this leader needs to be able to unite the country in the war on terror, a person who can develop a foreign policy that makes us a stronger nation that the world doesn't hesitate to look to for leadership.

Is this person out there, no doubt in my mind. Is this person interested in putting up with the BS to get in position to save our country, this is my fear.

 

[NewYorkBuck]

I will add another vote to foreign oil/energy.

The sad part of what is going on in Iraq is we are trying to put out a fire with gasoline. Our current government does not (want to?) realize that all wars are economic. If you want to beat the terrorists - dont fight them, starve them. If we poured all of the money we wasted in Iraq into renewable resource technology, I assure you we'd be pretty damn far on our way to an oil solution right now. Take away oil, you take away the terrorists resources and they go from flying planes into our buildings to begging us for food. Further, all of the billions of US $ that are now exported for this single commodity would now be staying at home. Its a win win for everyone except the dino companies and OPEC, and dont underestimate the influence they have on our government.

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

I will add another vote to foreign oil/energy.

The sad part of what is going on in Iraq is we are trying to put out a fire with gasoline. Our current government does not (want to?) realize that all wars are economic. If you want to beat the terrorists - dont fight them, starve them. If we poured all of the money we wasted in Iraq into renewable resource technology, I assure you we'd be pretty damn far on our way to an oil solution right now. Take away oil, you take away the terrorists resources and they go from flying planes into our buildings to begging us for food. Further, all of the billions of US $ that are now exported for this single commodity would now be staying at home. Its a win win for everyone except the dino companies and OPEC, and dont underestimate the influence they have on our government.

I have to agree with you on this. I've held the position that if we truly wanted to neutralize the middle east we'd move on to something other than Oil since the 1st Gulf war (if not before).... which makes sense environmentally as well...


Unfortunately it appears we are having to wait until the last dollar has been eked out of the last drop of oil.

 

[sandgk]

I have to agree with you on this. I've held the position that if we truly wanted to neutralize the middle east we'd move on to something other than Oil since the 1st Gulf war (if not before).... which makes sense environmentally as well...


Unfortunately it appears we are having to wait until the last dollar has been eked out of the last drop of oil.

Co-sign.

 

[Beenthere77]

I will add another vote to foreign oil/energy.

The sad part of what is going on in Iraq is we are trying to put out a fire with gasoline. Our current government does not (want to?) realize that all wars are economic. If you want to beat the terrorists - dont fight them, starve them. If we poured all of the money we wasted in Iraq into renewable resource technology, I assure you we'd be pretty damn far on our way to an oil solution right now. Take away oil, you take away the terrorists resources and they go from flying planes into our buildings to begging us for food. Further, all of the billions of US $ that are now exported for this single commodity would now be staying at home. Its a win win for everyone except the dino companies and OPEC, and dont underestimate the influence they have on our government.

Again, it comes back to leadership. Most of us are followers, we just need someone worth following.

 

[fourteenandoh]

Education has been brought up as a major problem yet our college system is the best in the world and attendance is at an all time high. So I doubt if educated people is this country's biggest problem.
.

I've always thought that a team is only is strong as their worst player. To translate that into the debate at hand, bringing up the bottom of the barrel is whats most important. The top will take care of itself. Think about how much the bottom 20% of our country could contribute to the economy if they were properly educated.

 

[sandgk]

I've always thought that a team is only is strong as their worst player. To translate that into the debate at hand, bringing up the bottom of the barrel is whats most important. The top will take care of itself. Think about how much the bottom 20% of our country could contribute to the economy if they were properly educated.

"Would sir prefer pommes frites with his braised heart-blocker this afternoon?"

 

[Beenthere77]

I've always thought that a team is only is strong as their worst player. To translate that into the debate at hand, bringing up the bottom of the barrel is whats most important. The top will take care of itself. Think about how much the bottom 20% of our country could contribute to the economy if they were properly educated.

Will the contribution to the economy from an educated bottom 20% come close to the cost of educating them? Or is it instead a huge drain of limited resources. It so happens our public schools are set up to meet your standards and I doubt if you can find too many people that are excited about its present state. Our colleges, OTOH, are set up for those with the skills to learn and it's not a coincidence that they just happen to be the best in the world.

 

[fourteenandoh]

Will the contribution to the economy from an educated bottom 20% come close to the cost of educating them? Or is it instead a huge drain of limited resources. It so happens our public schools are set up to meet your standards and I doubt if you can find too many people that are excited about its present state. Our colleges, OTOH, are set up for those with the skills to learn and it's not a coincidence that they just happen to be the best in the world.

I like the way you think. My post may sound as if it has a liberal tone, but nowhere in my post did I say the gov't needs to spend more on entitlement programs or education subsidies to educate the bottom 20%. The opportunity is there, they need to take advantage of it.

 

[NewYorkBuck]

I've always thought that a team is only is strong as their worst player. To translate that into the debate at hand, bringing up the bottom of the barrel is whats most important. The top will take care of itself. Think about how much the bottom 20% of our country could contribute to the economy if they were properly educated.

I see what you are saying, but capitalism is not a "team" game. Yes, different entities often must work together to achive a final goal, but make no mistake everyone is working in their own best interest of maximizing profit. When my firms stock price goes up, trust me, I am not thinking about how happy I am that the guy in the office next to me is making money - all I am thinking about is my bottom line. The most people think like this, the more competition there will be and the more efficiently goods and services will be delivered. Those who do not follow this lead will be left behind.

If you look at this, it will become evident that the largest advances to society do not come from encouraging the bottom 20% to do better. The benefit from doing this is likely only to be that they are less of a drag on the remaining 80%. Not to mention the fact that even if you move these people up, there will still always be a bottom 20%. No, history has shown that the biggest advances to society have typically come from the greatest minds - the very best of the best. For example, think about how far we would be economically right now if Issac Newton died as an infant (which he almost did) and his three laws were not discovered for another 100 years. The entire Industrial Revolution would have been serverely delayed if not crippled until these equations came into existence. Modern day examples in business are abundant too. Think about what the Windows operating system did for the PC - brought it to every home and office and multiplyed by many times the productivity of the typical worker. If anything, I believe it is the top 10% that we should really be focusing on, because it is here from where our next radical inventions and advancements will come from.

 

[PlanetFrnd]

I like the way you think. My post may sound as if it has a liberal tone, but nowhere in my post did I say the gov't needs to spend more on entitlement programs or education subsidies to educate the bottom 20%. The opportunity is there, they need to take advantage of it.

The opportunity is DEFINITELY not there for everyone in the bottom 20% - probably not even most or many.