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Cleveland Cavs (2016 NBA Champions)

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BuckeyeMafia said:
I began to look at the trade in a more favorable light today, but I am concerned about the Brooklyn pick. Brooklyn's roster is better, they have no reason to tank, and the Lakers, Suns, Bulls, Pacers, Magic, and Hawks may all tank. It still shouldn't be worse than #8 or so, but the pick's position is worth thinking about.
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Motivation no. Apathy? Powerful.
 
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joycemorgan said:
The Boston Celtics have acquired All-Star point guard Kyrie Irving from the Cleveland Cavaliers for point guard Isaiah Thomas, forward Jae Crowder, center Ante Zizic and Brooklyn's 2018.

I am seeing a big opportunity for the men in green now to dominate this new season and make their way to the finals.
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I don't understand where the optimism is coming from. The Finals? They probably won't even make it to the Conference Finals. Go take a look at the Celtics current roster.

Only four players still remain from last years team (Best Record in East with 53 wins): Terry Rozier, Marcus Smart, Jaylen Brown and Al Horford.

On the current 15 man roster there are SIX players (SIX!!!!!!!) who have never even played a single NBA game: Jayson Tatum, Semi Ojeleye, Kadeem Allen, Jabari Bird, Abdel Nader and Daniel Theis. Of these six only Jayson Tatum was drafted in the First Round. Teams that go to the Finals usually aren't quite that Green (No pun intended).

Right now the starters look like Kyrie Irving, Marcus Smart, Gordon Hayward, Marcus Morris and Al Horford. That is a good lineup especially for the Eastern Conference although the 2 guard spot could be better unless Kyrie is basically the 2 guard but I don't know many 2 guards around the league he can stick and Marcus Smart is only 6-4 so ditto. Kyrie is the all star point guard who struggled to hold a lead the last three years whenever Lebron went to the bench for rest which wasn't that often because the CAVS couldn't afford to let Lebron rest! Good Luck with Kyrie as THE MAN.

Oh let's see who backs them up. Terry Rozier (6-2), Shane Larkin (5-11), Rookie Kadeem Allen (6-3 and drafted 53rd overall), Rookie Jabari Bird (6-6 and drafted 56th overall). Not a very impressive group of bench guards.

Small Forward the Celtics are set though. Hayward (6-8), Jaylen Brown (6-7), Rookie Jayson Tatum (6-8 and drafted 3rd overall), Rookie Semi Ojeleye (6-7 and drafted 37th overall). Kind of sucks that Boston just gutted last years team to sign Hayward to a max contract and he plays the same position as the teams last 2 number one picks. Overkill for the small forward position and eventually there will probably be another trade here.

How about the bigs? Marcus Morris (6-9) and Al Horford (6-10) will start. On the bench. YUK! Rookie Abdel Nader (6-6) (Wikipedia calls him a power forward but I watched some of his D League high lights and he looks more like a small forward but whatever), Rookie Euro Daniel Theis (6-9), and Aron Baynes (6-10) and THAT'S IT!!!

As currently constructed the Celtics look like a team in transition with a couple very good players however, a third of the roster is filled with 2nd round picks and D Leaguers. They have no depth at the 4 and 5 and no length at the 2 and that is just not a recipe for winning. Unless they can bring in a couple guys at vet minimum contracts or something to improve that bench they will probably get run over by the CAVS again and that's if they can get by the Raptors, Wizards and Bucks who all look like they have more complete rosters at the present time than the Celtics.

There is absolutely no telling what type of team the Celtics are right now after bringing in all the new faces and having such a lopsided roster. Calling them the favorites in the East and pegging them for the Finals is a huge stretch and could be characterized as borderline delusional.
 
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I agree with your post, spadukins, but I expect Jaylen Brown to start at SG.

Also, Cleveland's bench unit was terrible in part because we have no offensive system. LeBron is the distributor, creator, and attacker. Irving doesn't slot into that role as well (nobody does, frankly) so it was a struggle when LeBron sat. That won't be as much of a problem in Boston with one of the most creative coaches in the league, but I think Kyrie is closer to the guy we saw with Waiters than the guy with saw with LeBron. He's the ideal second banana and someone you can rely on when you need a basket. Beyond that, we'll have to wait and see.

Boston will be awful on the boards, and that will kill them against Cleveland, particularly when the Cavs have Thompson and Love on the roster.
 
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There are a couple of guys on Clevelands current roster that no one is even talking about that I think can contribute if they turn the corner.

Cedi Osman is a player. He might not be an NBA star but the guy is heart, hustle and effort and he can flat shoot the ball. All of those attributes are something Cleveland covets, or used to before trying to copy the Warriors. If they go back to being Cleveland, Osman could be a great addition off the bench.

Edy Tavares is a monster. He needs work on his feet but he has a great touch and he's freaking 7'3"!!! Find Shaq in the offseason or better, Tim Duncan, put em on the payroll and see if this D League dominator can get on the permanent roster and make for a serious rim protector that we're missing.

I'm totally fine with the roster at the moment. I would say if they snag a defensive stopper, or Crowder can turn into that, the Cavs can overtake the Warriors by being tougher than them and our working them for a title.
 
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Not a Cavs fan, but I think everyone is underestimating a healthy Isaiah Thomas against Golden State. His size is what prevents him from being a quality NBA defender, and his size won't matter as much in a match-up with Curry. Curry isn't bothered by size at all; he has that quick release to get his shot off anyone. Curry is bothered by quick, active ball-pressure, and I think IT is actually very good at that. Add in Thomas' strength and toughness, and I think you will be surprised how much better than Kyrie he is against Golden State. Against the rest of the league, maybe some struggles, obviously, but I don't think the Cavs are in bad shape with this move. "How's the hip?" is the question.

Boston got better as well this offseason, and I will be interested to see how Coach Stevens gets these guys to jell. A little thin, but the top seven guys are as talented as any in the league (a hair beneath GS), especially if Tatum emerges as a ROY candidate like I think he can (offensively at least). Nice twist to the new season for both squads.
 
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BuckeyeMafia said:
I began to look at the trade in a more favorable light today, but I am concerned about the Brooklyn pick. Brooklyn's roster is better, they have no reason to tank, and the Lakers, Suns, Bulls, Pacers, Magic, and Hawks may all tank. It still shouldn't be worse than #8 or so, but the pick's position is worth thinking about.
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I'd be shocked if it's not top 5 at least, Top 3 seems pretty likely. I think you are giving Brooklyn a little bit too much credit here, that team is a lost cause, even with a I guess "improved" roster? They have slipped into a culture of awfulness there the past couple years that I doubt this group flips the script on.

Their big man situation is pretty god awful, even if they made slight improvements elsewhere. MOZGOV, Trevor Booker and Jarrett Allen (22nd pick in this years draft) are the only C/PFs on their roster currently. That's bad and will make for lots of Ls
 
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The Cavs know they aren't actually getting Brown or Tatum. Also, if you're Ainge, you don't have a whole lot of leverage. The Kyrie trade market may not be hot, but Cleveland is still negotiating from a position of strength. Apparently Thomas's leg isn't in good shape, you don't want Thomas and Crowder to return to the team after attempting to trade them, and you're left facing the Boston sports media as you once again failed to make a trade for a superstar. I'm not sure what choice Ainge has other than to forfeit another draft pick.

Players are involved in trade rumors all the time. They aren't traded and then returned a week later.
 
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BuckeyeMafia said:
The Cavs know they aren't actually getting Brown or Tatum. Also, if you're Ainge, you don't have a whole lot of leverage. The Kyrie trade market may not be hot, but Cleveland is still negotiating from a position of strength. Apparently Thomas's leg isn't in good shape, you don't want Thomas and Crowder to return to the team after attempting to trade them, and you're left facing the Boston sports media as you once again failed to make a trade for a superstar. I'm not sure what choice Ainge has other than to forfeit another draft pick.

Players are involved in trade rumors all the time. They aren't traded and then returned a week later.
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How about adding Rozier and Felder to the deal?
 
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BuckeyeMafia said:
The Cavs know they aren't actually getting Brown or Tatum. Also, if you're Ainge, you don't have a whole lot of leverage. The Kyrie trade market may not be hot, but Cleveland is still negotiating from a position of strength. Apparently Thomas's leg isn't in good shape, you don't want Thomas and Crowder to return to the team after attempting to trade them, and you're left facing the Boston sports media as you once again failed to make a trade for a superstar. I'm not sure what choice Ainge has other than to forfeit another draft pick.

Players are involved in trade rumors all the time. They aren't traded and then returned a week later.
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exhawg said:
How about adding Rozier and Felder to the deal?
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How about adding Miami's 2020 2nd round pick? :pimp:
 
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When the Bucks rumors came out yesterday I was hoping they would be able to do better than a 2nd round pick to get the Celtics deal done. Looks like the Cavs are going to be carrying 4 PG's this year at least until IT gets healthy. Taking that Bucks trade would have completely fucked the Celtics this season.
 
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