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Cleveland Browns (2017 Thread of Chlamydia)

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LordJeffBuck said:
We can argue all day long about Brian Kelly and Hue Jackson as head coaches, but both are well-respected football minds and both wanted nothing to do with DeShone Kizer. And you can now add John Dorsey to that list. That's not a coincidence, that's a pattern.
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I agree with everything that you had stated except for the fact while Jackson might have a well respected football mind I do not think he has any idea on how to "run" a football team. I do not know where he got the reputation as a QB guru and OC but he sure has not displayed that mind in the past two years in Cleveland. He has a pass happy coach and does not pay any attention to detail. I have no idea what he has over Haslam and Dorsey but it must be something big for Haslam to retain him with Dorsey having no say.
 
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My dream offense for next year (relatively speaking of course)

JT comes back, centers and guards the same. Spend money on the RT you should have spent with Schwartz.

Gordon on one side, Coleman in the slot, and a WR2 either in FA or in the first 2 rounds, draft Lazard in rounds 4-5 for depth.

Duke as the complementary RB to Barkley at 4.

Alex Smith at QB with someone new (Rosen or Allen) sitting for a season.

What we will get instead:

D’Umbass starting. A scrap heap veteran who has never started or started 10 years ago as a backup.

Gordon out wide until he fails a drug test. Another disaster WR veteran looking for a last paycheck to go with Coleman outside where he can’t run any routes.

Completely underused Duke Johnson when they spend FA money on a RB who will average 2.6 yards a carry.

JT will retire, Bitonio will get hurt again, and Dorsey will spend the #4 on a tackle who will struggle on the right side, while Coleman will be a disaster on the left.

1-15 again
 
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LordJeffBuck said:
I just wanted to revisit this Week 2 conversation after the season.

DeShone Kizer definitely has some arm talent. And he has some mobility. And he's a big kid who can absorb some hits. But I don't think I've ever seen a major pro QB prospect who is so slow to process information. His inability to see what's happening and react to it is what leads to inexplicable coverage sacks and horrible decisions in panic mode. This is who Kizer always has been. This is probably who Kizer always will be.

DeShone Kizer finished this season with a completion percentage of .536; a TD to INT ratio of 1 to 2 (11 TD, 22 INT); six fumbles lost (for a total of 28 turnovers); a 60.5 QB rating; a TD percentage of 2.3%; an INT percentage of 4.6%; a sack percentage of 7.4%; and a winning percentage of .000 (0 wins, 15 losses). Those are historically bad numbers for the passing era of the NFL (and some of those numbers are just plain bad period).

It's hard to go 4-8 at Notre Dame, but Kizer accomplished that. Brian Kelly threw Kizer under the bus and then went 9-3 (bowl game pending) with a QB who entered the 2017 season with 5 passes attempted at the college level.

It's hard to go 0-15 in the NFL, but Kizer accomplished that, too. Hue Jackson came as close as he could to throwing Kizer under the bus on numerous occasions, benched him three times, tried to trade for his replacement midseason, and has basically said that there will be a new starting QB next season. John Dorsey has essentially echoes that final sentiment.

We can argue all day long about Brian Kelly and Hue Jackson as head coaches, but both are well-respected football minds and both wanted nothing to do with DeShone Kizer. And you can now add John Dorsey to that list. That's not a coincidence, that's a pattern.
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Good synopsis of Kizer. Hate it for the kid but looks like he might be a career backup.
 
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Bucklion said:
My dream offense for next year (relatively speaking of course)

JT comes back, centers and guards the same. Spend money on the RT you should have spent with Schwartz.

Gordon on one side, Coleman in the slot, and a WR2 either in FA or in the first 2 rounds, draft Lazard in rounds 4-5 for depth.

Duke as the complementary RB to Barkley at 4.

Alex Smith at QB with someone new (Rosen or Allen) sitting for a season.

What we will get instead:

D’Umbass starting. A scrap heap veteran who has never started or started 10 years ago as a backup.

Gordon out wide until he fails a drug test. Another disaster WR veteran looking for a last paycheck to go with Coleman outside where he can’t run any routes.

Completely underused Duke Johnson when they spend FA money on a RB who will average 2.6 yards a carry.

JT will retire, Bitonio will get hurt again, and Dorsey will spend the #4 on a tackle who will struggle on the right side, while Coleman will be a disaster on the left.

1-15 again
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I’ll say it now...

Damn you for being right!
 
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LordJeffBuck said:
This is definitely in the running for the Post of the Year Award for 2017.
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I may have been a little heated and drinking that day. Njoku has great promise but I still don't think we had to trade up for him though.

But Peppers set me off. As a collective board I can't think of another player we've been so undoubtedly unified in our stance of "DO NOT TAKE". Maybe Manziel comes close? But that's about all I can think of.
 
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Buckeneye said:
I may have been a little heated and drinking that day. Njoku has great promise but I still don't think we had to trade up for him though.

But Peppers set me off. As a collective board I can't think of another player we've been so undoubtedly unified in our stance of "DO NOT TAKE". Maybe Manziel comes close? But that's about all I can think of.
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It’s just frustrating when the entire world can see something that this inept organization can’t. Peppers? A good pick? Really? :smash:
 
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CFPBuckeye said:
Hue Jackson still has a job.
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And that shows what a spectacular fail these last 2 years have been. No, not even a 1-31 record does that adequately, he’ll coaches like Rich Kotite have been bad before, and Detroit went 0-16. No, to fully appreciate the one in a lifetime sucktitude, you have to go to the fact that not only does the coach with the 1-31 record who treated his rookie QB like a chew toy and made more game day mistakes while his nut savkvwas buried in his play sheet than I can count (Charlie Weis laughs at his inattentiveness to the defense) still have a job, but Jimmah ended up in a position where he COULD NOT FIRE HIM.

What I mean by that is, the risk of going with the outsider analytics approach is that when it fails, all the “football guys” turn their backs on you. Just go to 92.3 the Fan and listen to the Chris Landry interview. It’s clear that all of the “football insiders” don’t blame Hue at all for the situation, to the extent that if Jimmah fires Hue under these circumstances, he’d never get another coach that anyone wanted to come here, and he likely wouldn’t have gotten Dorsey either. So he sat and watched not only as his team burned to the ground, but he watched as Hue threw the FO under the bus...publicly, through the media...with Hue knowing damned well that not only was Hue not getting fired, but that Jimmah COULD NOT fire him or else he would be a football pariah until he sold the team.

So that’s what we are left with...the worst stretch in NFL history, and a 1-31 coach he can’t fire.
 
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Bucklion said:
And that shows what a spectacular fail these last 2 years have been. No, not even a 1-31 record does that adequately, he’ll coaches like Rich Kotite have been bad before, and Detroit went 0-16. No, to fully appreciate the one in a lifetime sucktitude, you have to go to the fact that not only does the coach with the 1-31 record who treated his rookie QB like a chew toy and made more game day mistakes while his nut savkvwas buried in his play sheet than I can count (Charlie Weis laughs at his inattentiveness to the defense) still have a job, but Jimmah ended up in a position where he COULD NOT FIRE HIM.

What I mean by that is, the risk of going with the outsider analytics approach is that when it fails, all the “football guys” turn their backs on you. Just go to 92.3 the Fan and listen to the Chris Landry interview. It’s clear that all of the “football insiders” don’t blame Hue at all for the situation, to the extent that if Jimmah fires Hue under these circumstances, he’d never get another coach that anyone wanted to come here, and he likely wouldn’t have gotten Dorsey either. So he sat and watched not only as his team burned to the ground, but he watched as Hue threw the FO under the bus...publicly, through the media...with Hue knowing damned well that not only was Hue not getting fired, but that Jimmah COULD NOT fire him or else he would be a football pariah until he sold the team.

So that’s what we are left with...the worst stretch in NFL history, and a 1-31 coach he can’t fire.
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That’s also what is so hilarious. Jimmy being a pussy that he thinks firing Hue will make other coaches not want to come. I’m sure the rest of the football world already understands that going 1-31 will get them fired. It isn’t a situation exclusive to Jimmy Haslam.

Edit: Hell, Jimmy NOT firing Hue must be an attempt to make the job more attractive. “Come to Cleveland, where you can be historically awful and not get fired!”
 
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Bucklion said:
And that shows what a spectacular fail these last 2 years have been. No, not even a 1-31 record does that adequately, he’ll coaches like Rich Kotite have been bad before, and Detroit went 0-16. No, to fully appreciate the one in a lifetime sucktitude, you have to go to the fact that not only does the coach with the 1-31 record who treated his rookie QB like a chew toy and made more game day mistakes while his nut savkvwas buried in his play sheet than I can count (Charlie Weis laughs at his inattentiveness to the defense) still have a job, but Jimmah ended up in a position where he COULD NOT FIRE HIM.

What I mean by that is, the risk of going with the outsider analytics approach is that when it fails, all the “football guys” turn their backs on you. Just go to 92.3 the Fan and listen to the Chris Landry interview. It’s clear that all of the “football insiders” don’t blame Hue at all for the situation, to the extent that if Jimmah fires Hue under these circumstances, he’d never get another coach that anyone wanted to come here, and he likely wouldn’t have gotten Dorsey either. So he sat and watched not only as his team burned to the ground, but he watched as Hue threw the FO under the bus...publicly, through the media...with Hue knowing damned well that not only was Hue not getting fired, but that Jimmah COULD NOT fire him or else he would be a football pariah until he sold the team.

So that’s what we are left with...the worst stretch in NFL history, and a 1-31 coach he can’t fire.
Click to expand...
It's not just Hue. This franchise has chewed up and spit out coaches at a rate almost unheard of in sports. They are 19 seasons into this joyless death march and on their 8th coach (9 if you wanna count interim Terry Robiskie), making the average tenure a hair over 2.5 years. Of those eight, only three have survived until their third season (Butch, Crennel and now apparently Hue). Prior to hue, the previous four coaches lasted 2,2,1 and 2 years. This franchise's rep as a graveyard of head coaches was cemented long before Hue embarked on his suicide mission. Even more grim, only 1 of those poor fools landed another NFL HC gig, Romeo Crennel for a little over a year with KC.
 
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The strangest thing is that Hue was generally very well respected and most people thought the clowns hiring of him was an excellent decision. Hell, I thought it was a great choice and had hoped the Niners would land him. Two years later, he looks like a total buffoon. The FO did him no favors by handing him a ridiculous roster, but Hue has looked woefully unprepared to coach a young team.
 
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